[DELETED BY WHISTLER].

[ladron's mother was a hamster, and his father smelt of elderberries!]

I'm going to laugh when [DELETED BY WHISTLER]'s start getting mysteriously replaced with legitimately offensive text.

Edit: I laughed despite the fact that that wasn't remotely mysterious.

What happens when a [DELETED BY WHISTLER] becomes so offensive in context that it must actually be [DELETED BY WHISTLER]?

Edit: and Dr. Lecter, max speed granting additional turbo thrust aside... you're underestimated the power of CV distance control. You can't do shit about it in a duel if a CV wants to give you a big neutron bear hug or if they decide to backpedal to scratch an itch. Although... talk's been going around about a much-needed SVG buff for a very long time. Even more so than the WTD.

making nation changes is not fun. I wonder why no one in eve ever bitches about minmatar flying amar ships or the other way around. oh and in eve the pirate ships take (roughly) twice as much skill points to be able to fly and some are remarkebly better. As in complete [DELETED BY WHISTLER] pwning. You also have to either buy them from someone for an insane price or be KOS everywhere to take the missions to get them.

Oh also about this "nations having the best ships" [DELETED BY WHISTLER] going around. Remember that the government ALWAYS buys from the lowest bidder, and corporations that don't have any public oversight are going to be much more free to experiment with crazy ass [DELETED BY WHISTLER]

Well, I still don't buy the fact that Corvus wouldn't be [DELETED BY WHISTLER] for improving on stolen SVG designs.

I am softening to change though. I think the stronger argument for changing faction requirements is the promotion of more interesting game dynamics. There is something there, I just think the current proposal is a little too extreme and pirate centric. Not that it couldn't be massaged a little bit to make everyone accept it. One way to start would be to improve the SVG.

I am also concerned that the universal KOS change could reduce the amount of dueling though, which is the most fun aspect of the game for many people. The dueling player base would be split on each side of the map. Nationalists dueling in Deneb would get bored after a while. Flying through grey would not seem so attractive to us. Its not like we trade a heck of a lot in there, there are other groups the RP that aspect. The only reason we go there is to fight, and if we have to slog back and forth for decent ships (unless you like the Rev C), it would get pretty tedious.

I think part of the point is to encourage people to do something other than hang out in B8 and play Carebear Island all day, rg10.

That being said, I don't really buy the argument that people would duel significantly less often in grey if this were implemented. I see people flying SVG's, proms, valks, and the like in B8 pretty frequently, not to mention rev c's, vulture mkIII's, hogs, and other ships that are easily available to anyone without any special standing.

the current proposal is a little too extreme and pirate centric.

Again, are you fucking retarded?

The current proposal is that pirates have to be tri-nation KOS to get their own fucking ships. How is that pirate centric?

Pirate centric might be overkill.

EDIT: By centric I mean that the fights will be coming to the pirates home space, a place where they have better ships. It's not that far off base (i used the words "a little too" btw) because corvus pilots make the tri-nation sacrifice. Some have already stated that the sacrifice is too much.
I'm just trying to flesh out the issues, cover all the bases. The proposal has certain merits, not trying to kill it.

By centric I mean that the fights will be coming to the pirates home space, a place where they have better ships

Now, if there were Corvus wormhole turrets on every wormhole in Grey that shot at anything not tri-KOS, you would have a point.

By centric I mean that the fights will be coming to the pirates home space, a place where they have better ships.

Wait, wait, wait... you're concerned because pirates, the natural denizens of Grey space and the main thing that makes it the dangerous place that it's supposed to be, will be . . . the ones who are more at home in Grey? That's it, you are retarded.

Let's be clear here: I'm not proposing that you have to be hated by Corvus to buy nation specific ships, or that someone who is Tri-POS cannot become Corvus POS, too. Or that once they've done so, they can't buy all the goodies that are to be found in Sedina/Odia/Bractus stations, like Gauss II and Chaos Swarms and Sunflares (though I think that would probably be a good step, too, for Itani/Serco and for Corvus/Tri-Nations). Just that they cannot buy three specific ships. In exchange for being able to buy those ships, pirates are sacrificing docking and entry rights to 75% of the universe.

Get over yourself.

What would be infinitely more awesome than anything proposed here is if players could trade ships the way the can trade everything else. ;-)

It would be grossly unfair to, well, me, if these callous restrictions were added before the WTD was turned into a proper special combat ship. Actually, I think I'll just buy a few thousand corvults to keep in storage, the way I've done with SCPs and X-1s, so that I can laugh at all the newbs who started playing too late to do so themselves.*

I still don't get why Corvus would trust only (and trust at all) those who betrayed their native country and are loathed by 75% of the known universe with their advanced military hardware. It's not like these people only have Corvus to turn to and it's not like Corvus doesn't have assets which could become compromised as a result of the arms sale to these shifty folks.

* That was sarcasm. I would never laugh at a newb.**

** The truth of this is left as an exercise to the reader.

It would be grossly unfair to, well, me, if these callous restrictions were added before the WTD was turned into a proper special combat ship.

You feel free to go for either the Serco or the Itani combat ships, Maal. Nobody ever said the UIT needed a great combat ship, being the trader dogs of the universe that they are. If anything, they need a special moth. There are consequences to your nation choice, unless you wish to change it.

It's not like these people only have Corvus to turn to and it's not like Corvus doesn't have assets which could become compromised as a result of the arms sale to these shifty folks.

That was, I hope, more sarcasm.

I still don't get why Corvus would trust only (and trust at all) those who betrayed their native country and are loathed by 75% of the known universe with their advanced military hardware.

It isn't an ideal system, Maal, but it's one that would work a) a lot better than what we have now and b) without too terribly much dev effort.

What would be infinitely more awesome than anything proposed here is if players could trade ships the way the can trade everything else. ;-)

I agree that players should be able to trade ships, but not as freely as they trade weapons. It should only be allowed to happen in Corvus stations, and the Corvus authorities should exact a fairly steep 'tax' for these transactions. Anyway, this is a topic for another thread.

bump

I still don't get why Corvus would trust only (and trust at all) those who betrayed their native country and are loathed by 75% of the known universe with their advanced military hardware.

The thing about KOS Maalik is that it often is a requirement to join a guild/group, and therefore more a right of passage than an actual indicator of character. The fact that the majority of this group were willing to isolate themselves in such a manner, I think anyway, shows a level of commitment and loyalty that Corvus would likely admire.

Plus, as Ladron said, it just works better with the existing faction system.

I actually like the idea of the tri-kos for the cv and hound, the maud, I could care less about really. I also like the similar ideas proposed for the valk and prom.

As for Corvus being able to make ships on par with the SVG, meh, that's not that surprising really, the XT is almost on par with it, and the rev c is almost on par with the IBG. I get the feeling that the ships haven't changed much in the past 40 years or so in the VO time line. Either way, once you have the ability to make things using nanotechnology, reverse engineering and copying things would likely be rather easy. You don't see the Itani building proms because it's not their style. The CV isn't the SVG because Corvus wanted a higher cruising speed, not because they couldn't make it. Modern parallels don't apply when you change the level of technology so drastically.

my two cents: just adding purchase restrictions would give stockpilers a serious motherfucking advantage. Granted... there is an argument that such an advantage is deserved, but just saying.

Additionally, I don't believe any faction restrictions on those ships should be implemented until people can sell ships to one another. Black-market selling of ships would make faction restrictions far, far more interesting, and far less annoying.

"my two cents: just adding purchase restrictions would give stockpilers a serious motherfucking advantage. Granted... there is an argument that such an advantage is deserved, but just saying.

Additionally, I don't believe any faction restrictions on those ships should be implemented until people can sell ships to one another. Black-market selling of ships would make faction restrictions far, far more interesting, and far less annoying."

A point, you seem to have. Although when I figure out what kind of self respecting sercan would sell a prom on any sort of black market, it wont be a pretty day.

Although it would make homing in Grey much, much nicer.

A point, you seem to have. Although when I figure out what kind of self respecting sercan would sell a prom on any sort of black market, it wont be a pretty day.

Offering Serco and Itani ships on the black market should definitely be possible, but it should also cause a steep standing loss.