I'm against IRC, too, Atice. Everyone should have the option to remain anonymous. Saying something on 100 shouldn't be documented for everyone to see on the website. IRC doesn't broadcast channel 100 to the website, and who runs their IRC account 24/7 just to see who says something on 100?

Back in the first couple pages of this thread, you countered the idea of people not logging in because of who they see online. You wanted to see if pirates were online. Don't you have an IRC account to run 24/7 and see who's on? Isn't going to IRC to see who's on the same as just logging on?

In my opinion, this makes VO less immersive. Knowing what will come at you instead of reacting to what comes at you makes VO more of a game, something tied to the real world, instead of a universe that you actually feel.

who runs their IRC account 24/7 just to see who says something on 100

I know a few who do.

Isn't going to IRC to see who's on the same as just logging on?

You can't shoot people from IRC... so no, it isn't.

Knowing what will come at you instead of reacting to what comes at you...

Well, if you talk on 100, then people are going to know what will come (because they are either online or on irc or some such). I find that logic to be self-evident... what am I missing?

You know a few who do? Who might these people be?

No, you can't shoot people. This is unrelated, but it in fact aids my argument. Why not log on to see who's on, and then shoot them, instead of just monitering? Why not be productive and trade while you wait to see who is on?

Yes, you are missing something. The idea intended. If this were added, everyone would choose to play and choose how to play by who is on.

If this were added, everyone would choose to play and choose how to play by who is on

and the bad thing about this would be...?

Naming names isn't really appropriate for the forum. I know at least a couple who do it, and I wouldn't lie about such things.

Why not log on to see who's on, and then shoot them, instead of just monitering?

Because some of us have jobs, and can't just sit around waiting for people to show up. Having the RPL would be added incentive to log in when we otherwise wouldn't.

everyone would choose to play and choose how to play by who is on

Neither of us have proof in either direction of that claim. See Death Fluffy's comment earlier in the thread.

VO would be less immersive, Whytee. Nobody would simply play.

Atice, again you are avoiding this making VO less immersive. Also, you are implying I do not have a job and can simply wait around. I do have a job, but this is not a thread designed to insult me or anyone else. This is driving me off topic, but don't you have alts or ever do other things in VO instead of hunt pirates? Only ever doing one thing, for examply, hunting pirates, hardly makes sense, and this seems to be benificial to only that purpose and a couple others. How would this help a trader?

Incentive to log in when we otherwise wouldn't? Why wouldn't we? I log in to have fun, I don't know about you.

EDIT: I just deleted about half of this post because I was going off topic about stat-hungry and greedy players instead of fun-seeking people actually playing VO.

It seems to me that the people who are against this suggestion seem to dislike the use of people sitting on IRC to do exactly the same thing.

Um, I think Roda, Denji, and I had just expressed varying misgivings about discouraging prospective players with a page on the official website which betrays the scale of our active population. IRC, as has been said, is different is this regard.

My bad Maal. I should have said most or some of the people (tarenty, chaos, ryan).

As for discouraging prospective members: see my earlier post.

tarenty: I disagree on the immersion point. That's one of opinion, not logic (on either side), and I doubt we'll be able to sway the other on this point. However, your objection is noted.

I log in to have fun as well, but sometimes I'm just in the mood to shoot people, and if people are online, I'll come do that (otherwise I'll continue doing the shit in RL that I really should be doing). People play the game differently, and I'm trying to accommodate people with different play styles than your own.

Also, I appreciate you keeping your post on-topic, and not digressing into tracking etc.

Log in, go to B-8 or some other pirate/pvper hotspot, and see if anyone is there. Or ask on 100. It isn't hard.

This is my last post on the topic. I'm really getting too fired up about it, and end with a -1.

Logging in takes up far more time than checking a website (or scrolling up in IRC), and as such disrupts workflow far more.

Those are fair points Maalik. However, I'd just point out that in every other mmorg I've tried, you generally see a ton of players in the beginner section. Potential subscribers don't get that here, which is a solid reason to get away from the separate beginner sectors and create a universal one, but before Atice yells at me for being off topic, my point is, they are going to see or not see the population as soon as they log on. At present, 100 is the sole indication suggesting how many players are active most of the time. I think having the page separate from the main VO site resolves the problem nicely.

logging in takes more time then checking the website
idk what piece of shit computer you are using but it takes me about 5 seconds to log into vo.

The APL was taken out so players can remain anonymous, now forcing players to not communicate on 100 so others who are not even logged in can find out if they are on is the exact same thing as the APL but you are calling it the RPL because zomg it resets every half hour. I am sorry but if i chose to talk on 100 then you should have to be in game to know that I am online. I might be able to support this idea if you made it so you could not see players you have actively ignored, but for more nefarious reasons.

So basically you dislike IRC pey?

Also, you know it takes more than 5 sec to start up VO (at decent resolution), log in, get to b8, and ask if anyone is around. workflow mate.

then log off in b8 so you automatically log in there. work smarter not harder mate

lmao! I'm sorry, but I have to give Pey 10 points for that.

I do log off in b8 most of the time. I think we're gonna have to agree to disagree on this one :p.

I like the original idea, there's plenty of people who ill drop by just to say hello if i see them online, but wouldn't bother fireing up vo otherwise. Also I still disagree with the devs decision to hide the number of active players.

I did not like it being used to discover alts.

I did not like it being used to discover alts.

Aye, and this would help with that. Seeing as it could essentially show that you and all of your alts are on at the same time. You could log on as every one of your alts say hi on 100 and all of you would be on for an hour :-)!

Also, as for the IRC thing. Not all newb's know about IRC or even if they do, they do not want/know how to bother with it. So, why not have this information available to them too? Not to mention that it might put something useful on the AP page, I never watch the graph anymore and it doesn't show anything useful if no buddies are on.

"Well, if you talk on 100, then people are going to know what will come (because they are either online or on irc or some such). I find that logic to be self-evident... what am I missing?"

I am missing the part where that constitutes logic. Example, Peytros and Pirren are both on. They both speak on 100. Neither of them mystically "are going to know what will come"... simply because they are aware of each others being logged in. The games setting is large, there are 30 systems and thousands of sectors.

112 stations not counting conquerable ones
34 worm holes, this puts the odds of Pirren randomly running into Peytros at 1 in 146.
It puts the odds of Peytros finding Pirren at 1 in 146, this is of course assuming that they both stick to stations and worm holes. Assume for one moment that they do not stick to station and worm hole sectors only, there is now a 1 in 7680 chance that they will meet.

With those odds, there is no way "people are going to know what will come" unless they arrange to meet or get very very lucky/unlucky, thats really a matter of perspective.

@ Whytee, I just used Peytros as an example because I've seen several veteran players (I'm not naming names because one is a friend and the other two... well, I don't like them much but, it wouldn't be fair to them if I named them and not the other.) log the second Peytros said anything on 100, just because they didn't want to get boomed. I've also seen people log off because other pirates logged in.

There were quite a few folks who had /msg irc active bound to a hot key as an early warning system/ohcrapsoandsoisonnowsoimloggingoutbeforetheyblowmeupagainandagainandagain system