Forums » Suggestions
Rather than reviving a series of long-dead threads that touched on the subject, I'm creating a new one dedicated to it.
The Marauder
The devs alluded to the idea that the Marauder was originally intended as a modular vessel (but then again, so were the valk and prom according to concept sketches). I think that adding this modularability to the Marauder would give it its special niche and advantage suited to the UIT. Here's how I think it should work:
The baseline Mauarauder should be much as it is now, however it can be extended by adding additional module 'cubes' to the end of it. These modules would come in three varieties:
1) Engine Modules.
The Engine Module is just that... a module with engines. The engines could be affixed to either side of the cubic module. These modules would assist in giving the Marauder more power when fully loaded or burdened by additional modules. Engine modules could not be used to drastically boost the overall performance of the marauder, since they would each have the same thrust:mass ratio as the ship itself, and therefore would only serve to help push the Marauder's overall thrust:mass ratio back toward the 'ideal' one While the Engines supply a proportionate boost in thrust and turbo thrust along with their additional mass, they do not add significantly to the spin torque, so if the train got too long and heavy, it would take forever to turn it.
2) Utility Modules.
The Utility Modules would ideally come in three flavors: L-Port, S-Port and Util-Port. For now, we'll ignore the Util-Port variety, since Utility ports don't yet exist.
Each Utility Module would add one port to the ship at the cost of the extra mass of the module. Together a L-port module and L-port weapon may weigh on the order of 4,000 or 5,000kg, making them a valuable addition in peaceful activities, and perhaps a useful defence in a few situations, but too unwieldly to deploy as a heavy weapons platform. The Maud would not gain any armor with the addition of more modules, so a very long maud filled with L-port modules would be a sitting duck, thus eliminating the potential for abuse in that manner.
3. Cargo Modules.
Each Cargo Module weighs 2,000 kg and adds an additonal 40u of cargo capacity to the train.
With these modules added, Marauders would have the flexability they need to compete with the valk and prom by allowing it to extend into other areas where the valk and prom can't venture (a heavy hauling or mining platform) yet are perfectly suited to the lifestyle of the UIT. A Maud with 2 Engine Modules, 3 Cargo Modules and a L-Port Module would fly well empty, very slowly full, but still have the ability to survive and adapt to different situations, and could carry more cargo than a regular moth. If it had the added ability to detach from its train in flight, it could even stand and fight to defend its cargo, buying its cargo time and distracting or even destroying its attacker.
The Territorial Defender
The TD currently has no role. Ever since it was nerfed, it couldn't stand up to the other varients of the warthog, and it certianly can't fill the gap between the SVG and IBG. I would propose that rather than simply beefing the TD back up to surpass the other hogs, we change it and move it to fill that gap.
The universe has long awaited an agile fighter with a single L-port, and the TD would be the perfect way to accomplish that while giving the UIT an edge back.
I propose that the TD be reduced in weight, given bigger lungs (reduce the turbo battery drain) and drop the S-port, making it unique both among warthogs and all the other ships in the game, while allowing it to go head-to-head with the light fighters of the Serco and Itani.
The Marauder
The devs alluded to the idea that the Marauder was originally intended as a modular vessel (but then again, so were the valk and prom according to concept sketches). I think that adding this modularability to the Marauder would give it its special niche and advantage suited to the UIT. Here's how I think it should work:
The baseline Mauarauder should be much as it is now, however it can be extended by adding additional module 'cubes' to the end of it. These modules would come in three varieties:
1) Engine Modules.
The Engine Module is just that... a module with engines. The engines could be affixed to either side of the cubic module. These modules would assist in giving the Marauder more power when fully loaded or burdened by additional modules. Engine modules could not be used to drastically boost the overall performance of the marauder, since they would each have the same thrust:mass ratio as the ship itself, and therefore would only serve to help push the Marauder's overall thrust:mass ratio back toward the 'ideal' one While the Engines supply a proportionate boost in thrust and turbo thrust along with their additional mass, they do not add significantly to the spin torque, so if the train got too long and heavy, it would take forever to turn it.
2) Utility Modules.
The Utility Modules would ideally come in three flavors: L-Port, S-Port and Util-Port. For now, we'll ignore the Util-Port variety, since Utility ports don't yet exist.
Each Utility Module would add one port to the ship at the cost of the extra mass of the module. Together a L-port module and L-port weapon may weigh on the order of 4,000 or 5,000kg, making them a valuable addition in peaceful activities, and perhaps a useful defence in a few situations, but too unwieldly to deploy as a heavy weapons platform. The Maud would not gain any armor with the addition of more modules, so a very long maud filled with L-port modules would be a sitting duck, thus eliminating the potential for abuse in that manner.
3. Cargo Modules.
Each Cargo Module weighs 2,000 kg and adds an additonal 40u of cargo capacity to the train.
With these modules added, Marauders would have the flexability they need to compete with the valk and prom by allowing it to extend into other areas where the valk and prom can't venture (a heavy hauling or mining platform) yet are perfectly suited to the lifestyle of the UIT. A Maud with 2 Engine Modules, 3 Cargo Modules and a L-Port Module would fly well empty, very slowly full, but still have the ability to survive and adapt to different situations, and could carry more cargo than a regular moth. If it had the added ability to detach from its train in flight, it could even stand and fight to defend its cargo, buying its cargo time and distracting or even destroying its attacker.
The Territorial Defender
The TD currently has no role. Ever since it was nerfed, it couldn't stand up to the other varients of the warthog, and it certianly can't fill the gap between the SVG and IBG. I would propose that rather than simply beefing the TD back up to surpass the other hogs, we change it and move it to fill that gap.
The universe has long awaited an agile fighter with a single L-port, and the TD would be the perfect way to accomplish that while giving the UIT an edge back.
I propose that the TD be reduced in weight, given bigger lungs (reduce the turbo battery drain) and drop the S-port, making it unique both among warthogs and all the other ships in the game, while allowing it to go head-to-head with the light fighters of the Serco and Itani.
[APPROVED]!!!
Number one - Make it so.
mutorcs
Number one - Make it so.
mutorcs
Aw but cunjo, that means no more WTD NPCs being cursed for their flares in deneb and grey.. ;)
Love the post Cunjo.
[APPROVED]
[APPROVED]
I mean, I just love how the Maurauder could be modular, and add on various parts. It'll look like a big train, like you said.
I think the max it should be able to hold though, should be somewhere near 160-180c.u.
It's clear the UIT don't have great fighting ships, so why not give them something useful for a change?
I think the max it should be able to hold though, should be somewhere near 160-180c.u.
It's clear the UIT don't have great fighting ships, so why not give them something useful for a change?
Agree 100%. [APPROVED]
Kirk: I'm against artificially-imposed hard restrictions like that. Rather than putting a limit on the amount of cargo it can carry, it's better to simply limit its usefulness if it carries too much. If you make it so that with 180+u of cargo, the thing turns so slowly it hardly ever makes it to the destination in one piece, you've effectively limited the useful capacity without adding more "things that do not make sense".
Also, each module costs almost as much as the marauder itself does, so it would become prhibitively expensive to fly really long trains if there's any chance of it being destroyed. People would only fly as many modules as they're willing to risk, and the risk grows the more modules they fly. While a 300u, 4 L-port train might be useful for mining in a capitol sector, it would still be at serious risk if word got out that it was there, as it can't get away quickly, and is a big target for anyone who comes in to destroy it, and if it was destroyed, the pilot would be out at least 200k.
Also, each module costs almost as much as the marauder itself does, so it would become prhibitively expensive to fly really long trains if there's any chance of it being destroyed. People would only fly as many modules as they're willing to risk, and the risk grows the more modules they fly. While a 300u, 4 L-port train might be useful for mining in a capitol sector, it would still be at serious risk if word got out that it was there, as it can't get away quickly, and is a big target for anyone who comes in to destroy it, and if it was destroyed, the pilot would be out at least 200k.
edit: added L-ports and S-ports are now gone
Well, I guess you could add on as many as you wanted, but seriously, there should be some kind of limit. I mean, where is the power coming from? Do they have battery attachments? Have you forgotten about the power supply for all of these modules? Adding engines would just evenly space-out the thrust, not increase it.
For this to really work, you would need some degree of modules to decrease in thrust, and for every 2 segments, you would need to add an additional battery to compensate with power.
Different setups would obviously come to mind to get some sort of advantage, but the additional battery will not help much at all. In fact, it's just a requirement for more modules, and doesn't provide that much more thrust, but it helps.
For example:
I buy a Tunguska Marauder. I buy 6 modules for it. Each module has 30cu, L-port, and U-port. Every 2 modules though, I need one battery to be placed, on the equip screen, 'between them'. The batteries must also all be the same type as the main battery, to avoid different power rates. Each battery allows for an engine add-on to the module following it. So if you see it from the back, it would have engines there, and the train is completely visible from front to back.
The stats are as follows:
Tunguska Marauder
Faction 920
Variant Mining
License -/-/-/-/2
Armor 9500
Cargo 60
Weapons 1 small, 1 large
Mass 5500 kg
Length 12m
Thrust 200 N / 250 N turbo
Max Speed 65 m/s
Spin Torque 7.0 Nm
Turbo Speed 180 m/s
Turbo Energy 50/s
Each add-on module would:
+Armor 250
+Cargo 30
+Weapons/ports 1 util
+Mass 500 kg
+Length 6m
2 add-on modules with additional battery would:
+Armor 500
+Cargo 60
+Weapons/ports 2 util
+Mass 1110 kg
+Length 12m
2 add-on modules with additional battery with added thrusters:
+Armor 500
+Cargo 60
+Weapons/ports 2 util
+Mass 1710 kg
+Length 14m
+Thrust 40 N / 50 N turbo
+Max Speed 1 m/s
+Spin Torque 2 Nm
So My ship with 6 add-on modules with additional battery with added thrusters would be:
Tunguska Marauder
Faction 920
Variant Mining
License -/-/-/-/2
Armor 11000
Cargo 240
Weapons 6 util
Mass 10630 kg
Length 54m
Thrust 320 N / 400 N turbo
Max Speed 68 m/s
Spin Torque 13.0 Nm
Turbo Speed 180 m/s
Turbo Energy 50/s
And My ship with 6 add-on modules with additional battery with added thrusters, and full of Premium Heliocene Ore would be:
34630 kg
Thrust 320 N / 400 N turbo
Spin Torque 13.0 Nm
And My ship with 6 add-on modules with additional battery with added thrusters, and full of Premium Xithricite Ore would be:
Mass 82630 kg
Thrust 320 N / 400 N turbo
Spin Torque 13.0 Nm
Well, I guess you could add on as many as you wanted, but seriously, there should be some kind of limit. I mean, where is the power coming from? Do they have battery attachments? Have you forgotten about the power supply for all of these modules? Adding engines would just evenly space-out the thrust, not increase it.
For this to really work, you would need some degree of modules to decrease in thrust, and for every 2 segments, you would need to add an additional battery to compensate with power.
Different setups would obviously come to mind to get some sort of advantage, but the additional battery will not help much at all. In fact, it's just a requirement for more modules, and doesn't provide that much more thrust, but it helps.
For example:
I buy a Tunguska Marauder. I buy 6 modules for it. Each module has 30cu, L-port, and U-port. Every 2 modules though, I need one battery to be placed, on the equip screen, 'between them'. The batteries must also all be the same type as the main battery, to avoid different power rates. Each battery allows for an engine add-on to the module following it. So if you see it from the back, it would have engines there, and the train is completely visible from front to back.
The stats are as follows:
Tunguska Marauder
Faction 920
Variant Mining
License -/-/-/-/2
Armor 9500
Cargo 60
Weapons 1 small, 1 large
Mass 5500 kg
Length 12m
Thrust 200 N / 250 N turbo
Max Speed 65 m/s
Spin Torque 7.0 Nm
Turbo Speed 180 m/s
Turbo Energy 50/s
Each add-on module would:
+Armor 250
+Cargo 30
+Weapons/ports 1 util
+Mass 500 kg
+Length 6m
2 add-on modules with additional battery would:
+Armor 500
+Cargo 60
+Weapons/ports 2 util
+Mass 1110 kg
+Length 12m
2 add-on modules with additional battery with added thrusters:
+Armor 500
+Cargo 60
+Weapons/ports 2 util
+Mass 1710 kg
+Length 14m
+Thrust 40 N / 50 N turbo
+Max Speed 1 m/s
+Spin Torque 2 Nm
So My ship with 6 add-on modules with additional battery with added thrusters would be:
Tunguska Marauder
Faction 920
Variant Mining
License -/-/-/-/2
Armor 11000
Cargo 240
Weapons 6 util
Mass 10630 kg
Length 54m
Thrust 320 N / 400 N turbo
Max Speed 68 m/s
Spin Torque 13.0 Nm
Turbo Speed 180 m/s
Turbo Energy 50/s
And My ship with 6 add-on modules with additional battery with added thrusters, and full of Premium Heliocene Ore would be:
34630 kg
Thrust 320 N / 400 N turbo
Spin Torque 13.0 Nm
And My ship with 6 add-on modules with additional battery with added thrusters, and full of Premium Xithricite Ore would be:
Mass 82630 kg
Thrust 320 N / 400 N turbo
Spin Torque 13.0 Nm
Three small alterations to your suggestion:
Putting the engine modules at the rear of the ship (assuming we may apply force vectors) would not make much sense. Instead, why not strip the maud of most of its existing engine pods (all except the two on the arms) and allow the adding of the rest of them?
Also, there should be a limit to the number of attachable modules. Any number from 5 to 7 sounds reasonable.
Add a 'power' module to the list that allows the fitting of another battery, thus providing double the charge. Or maybe you intend to cover this with the Utility-port module?
Putting the engine modules at the rear of the ship (assuming we may apply force vectors) would not make much sense. Instead, why not strip the maud of most of its existing engine pods (all except the two on the arms) and allow the adding of the rest of them?
Also, there should be a limit to the number of attachable modules. Any number from 5 to 7 sounds reasonable.
Add a 'power' module to the list that allows the fitting of another battery, thus providing double the charge. Or maybe you intend to cover this with the Utility-port module?
The limiting of the number of modules would not be a new "something that makes no sense" even railroad trains have limits.
tosh-
I was thinking that every two modules, you need to equip a battery, otherwise it doesn't even stay connected.
I was thinking that every two modules, you need to equip a battery, otherwise it doesn't even stay connected.
Yeah, limit somewhere. Were this real life, put too much and make a sudden turn... wooosh! There rips off the modules. But in VO we have no such thing. And working within the system, make the engines/battery able to sustain only so much weight. Chalk it up to "working within what we have" and "structural integrity".
For those who missed it... 90k kg maud... suddent turn... woosh! There goes the modules
Thank you :)~
Overall, the best idea I've seen on these boards in... almost ever. [APPROVED]
For those who missed it... 90k kg maud... suddent turn... woosh! There goes the modules
Thank you :)~
Overall, the best idea I've seen on these boards in... almost ever. [APPROVED]
Jim,
he's dead.
Seriously, though:
I sort of missed out on your entire post. I apologize for that gross error (which it is, I'm being honest), but I think your version is too beneficial. 2 additional weapon ports for the meagre total mass increase of 500 kg? This sounds rather formidable. The second layout you propose would increase the maud's offensive possibilities by 100%, which it does need, but not just at the cost of 1.11 tons.
I mean, the Tung maud with 6 add-on modules with thrusters would have 8 (!) large ports, which is 4 times the swarm spamming capability of a Ragnarok; and 7 small ports PLUS the batteries to supply a volley of 7 adv rail gun shots (that's 17.5k damage).
Don't get me wrong, I'd like to see the maud beefed up. But not to the point where it can kill most ships in the game in one single shot, from a distance of over 1 km. The devs balanced the rail guns to prevent exactly that from happening, if I recall correctly.
Thus, I stand by my suggestion to require the use of power modules that can carry a battery, but not much else (but they should weigh substantially less, maybe 250kg with battery), and stick with the specific add-ons Cunjo suggested.
Finally, a turret module (with mannable turrets, of course) would be fun, which would really turn the marauder into some kind of gunship. Imagine three gauss turrets on a maud's tail...
he's dead.
Seriously, though:
I sort of missed out on your entire post. I apologize for that gross error (which it is, I'm being honest), but I think your version is too beneficial. 2 additional weapon ports for the meagre total mass increase of 500 kg? This sounds rather formidable. The second layout you propose would increase the maud's offensive possibilities by 100%, which it does need, but not just at the cost of 1.11 tons.
I mean, the Tung maud with 6 add-on modules with thrusters would have 8 (!) large ports, which is 4 times the swarm spamming capability of a Ragnarok; and 7 small ports PLUS the batteries to supply a volley of 7 adv rail gun shots (that's 17.5k damage).
Don't get me wrong, I'd like to see the maud beefed up. But not to the point where it can kill most ships in the game in one single shot, from a distance of over 1 km. The devs balanced the rail guns to prevent exactly that from happening, if I recall correctly.
Thus, I stand by my suggestion to require the use of power modules that can carry a battery, but not much else (but they should weigh substantially less, maybe 250kg with battery), and stick with the specific add-ons Cunjo suggested.
Finally, a turret module (with mannable turrets, of course) would be fun, which would really turn the marauder into some kind of gunship. Imagine three gauss turrets on a maud's tail...
Tosh,
According to Cunjo, they link up via L-port.
If not then I guess yea, they should just have a u-port and battery between 'em.
Yea, I definately didn't mean to infer that the L-ports would be equippable, or the S-ports for that matter...
Just forget about the ports for now, as there is no u-port anyway... lol
Other than that, I was looking at thrust to mass ratios of other ships, will post back when I have a better idea.
According to Cunjo, they link up via L-port.
If not then I guess yea, they should just have a u-port and battery between 'em.
Yea, I definately didn't mean to infer that the L-ports would be equippable, or the S-ports for that matter...
Just forget about the ports for now, as there is no u-port anyway... lol
Other than that, I was looking at thrust to mass ratios of other ships, will post back when I have a better idea.
Why not give UIT wussies a dev superbus with a NiCad battery?
You can put 16 swarm tubes or 16 agt on it and rule the universe.
Screw the balance, what every UIT need is to become CEO of the known Universe.
Thats the only thing that will make that nation of public accountants, lawyers and bank tellers happy.
You can put 16 swarm tubes or 16 agt on it and rule the universe.
Screw the balance, what every UIT need is to become CEO of the known Universe.
Thats the only thing that will make that nation of public accountants, lawyers and bank tellers happy.
shut up bojan,
We already solved the multiplication of ports problem, sorry to burst your bubble...
We already solved the multiplication of ports problem, sorry to burst your bubble...
There was a brief period in VO history when we had a possibility to equip different engines. Needless to say players abused it. Have you ever fought a valkyrie with a SCP engine installed? Or centurion with a tunguska agresso engine installed?
This is not directly related to this thread but... modular design with engines, weapon ports etc. is a kind of pandora's box.
This is not directly related to this thread but... modular design with engines, weapon ports etc. is a kind of pandora's box.
The turret module would still be interesting. It would allow the marauder to become an efficient convoy guard, thereby opening up an entirely new role for it.
It could also be worthwile to use it in situations like the Nation War, or as a ship that is able to deny access/transit of a certain space.
bojan,
While I agree that there's much potential for abuse, as long as there are working regulations, abuse will be, if not eliminated, at least minimized.
It could also be worthwile to use it in situations like the Nation War, or as a ship that is able to deny access/transit of a certain space.
bojan,
While I agree that there's much potential for abuse, as long as there are working regulations, abuse will be, if not eliminated, at least minimized.
Bojan: The users didn't abuse it, the devs didn't do everything right. Modular design has nothing wrong about it, it's like in WoW where it lets you equip different types of armor, it can still be fairly balanced.
Samething here as long as it is set up well it shouldn't be overpowered.
Samething here as long as it is set up well it shouldn't be overpowered.
You underestimate the ability of our playerbase to find and use exploits toshiro. :)
@zed: True zed, true, but.... there is a line somewhere in VO rules of conduct about using exploits.... Some players did report it but others just hurried like mad to pile up engines like there is no tomorrow. After devs blocked the ability to equip engines some players found a way around it and still used their uber ships/engines for a long time.
@zed: True zed, true, but.... there is a line somewhere in VO rules of conduct about using exploits.... Some players did report it but others just hurried like mad to pile up engines like there is no tomorrow. After devs blocked the ability to equip engines some players found a way around it and still used their uber ships/engines for a long time.