Would it not be possible to set up an "automagic" scaling system where the client renders model size based on its reported geometery? (From front to stern)

Thus have a "standard" relational model, say 10m, and thus a 12m ship is 120% of that model's size, 8m would 80%, etc? If there are problems with its scale from intended, you could tinker with a single number server side and correct such malformity, and the change in scale would be reflected in the ship's in-game info at the same time.

Ghost: finding this problem has prompted me to revisit *all* the ships and make sure their scales and collision meshes are corresponding. I'm not sure that I'll shrink the valk, but I'll at least make sure it's all relatively correct.

The Prom/AGT fixes will debut at the same time as everything else I'm doing. I'm hoping to launch the new client as "look at all the stuff I would like to have done four months or more ago". So, clearly, I have a lot of stuff I need to fix or look at.

MechaDragon: it's theoretically possible to do something like that, but it would be involved and.. I don't think it would really be worthwhile. I'd rather just check through all the ships once and then leave it alone, rather than spend a couple of weeks developing some new auto-scaling system.

Who ever said they were fixing the Cent without fixing the Prom? The same can be said about the reverse, "Fixing the Prom without fixing the Cent is like peanut...". So, we now have Incarnate saying he IS going to fix the Cent as soon as he can, by making it larger and possibly tweaking its stats. If he somewhere said he was never going to tweak the Prom to be more balanced, I must have missed it, which would be strange considering how much I read these forums.

I feel safe thinking that once everything is shifted over to the new stuff & they can start releasing updates again, the Cent is NOT the only ship that'll have balance changes.

Also, while I'm not saying the Prom is balanced in its current state, if we had to choose to change only one ship (which of course is NOT the case), I'd choose nerfing the Cent over nerfing the Prom. The two main reasons I say that are 1) the Cent is a VERY LOW level ship, while the Prom is a VERY HIGH level ship, so I'm far more understanding of the Prom being uber than the Cent being uber; and 2) At least when I fight a Prom I generally feel like I hurt it significantly, even though I boom before it does. When I fight Cents, on the other hand, all too often I feel like I was completely ineffective against it, 'cause I won't have hit it at all (the times that I do hit it, I usually win).

Oh, and for the record I prefer my peanut butter sandwiches without jelly (although I'm not all that fond of peanut butter at all). Jelly is too sweet.

Cool, thanks John!

Oh, and for the record I prefer my peanut butter sandwiches without jelly (although I'm not all that fond of peanut butter at all). Jelly is too sweet

Wierdo!!!

[/off topic]

Thanks john, Always good to hear from you and the rest of the devs and get an idea about what you are planning. Keep up the great work guys.

now what can you do about my holiday schedule so i might actually have time to log in and play the game as opposed to just lurking on the boards?

Ok just for the record I don't care if you make the cent bigger.
But pullin numbers outta your butt like:

"I'm not saying a massive change either, but maybe a 40-50% increase in scale. Something to bring it in line with.. seemingly.. all the other ships."

I'm not sure how much of a change that will have in combat but I can feel the difference in mass when I use a neut III versus a phase blaster and believe me all those slow pokes still usin 2 neut III's are just askin for it.

So 40-50% change is rather.....
WHY CAN'T YOU TAKE BABY STEPS?!?!?!
I mean if anything.... how about you increase it by 10% every day till it "feels" right?

I don't mind change...
Just not drastic.
And yes little tiny numbers like 50% are big even if they don't "seem" big.

And how is:
"Wow Kix, you're a bit of an ass aren't you?"
(Followed by an example of physically hurting me *whimpers*)
not a flame but calling him a ********* is?

I mean seriously can I get a list of all the words that I can use and words I can't because I didn't realize that ********* was rated R.

Actually, I meant smack you down in a response, but keep hope alive. Maybe these posts won't get deleted.

PS You're still being an [apple].

KixKizzle, did you happen to see this post in this very thread?

"Sat 04:37PM incarnate
When I rescale it, I'll post comparative screenshots again. I'll mostly "eyeball" it, I expect, and try to make it a little more in-line with the other small ships. Still smallest, but a little more reasonable. For what it's worth, I prefer to make small changes rather than large ones, but I'll probably just figure it out when I load it into Max."

Also, from Incarnate's initial post:

"I propose increasing the size of the Centurion. I'll scale it uniformly.. its handling behaviour should not be changed at all by this (distribution of mass will remain the same)."

Regarding flaming: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flaming and http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard?agree=y

It doesn't really have anything to do with whether something is "R" rated, though I do notice those and overly hostile posts more easily. For eveyone's elucidation, here is the list: stay on topic and attack arguments, not people. Seriously, everyone, is the question worth all of this drama and strife???

Definite thumbs up to making the cent bigger. Especially the Border Guardian and Rev C versions. At just lvl 2/2, you shouldn't be able to get a ship that will pwn everyone. Also, maybe you should make the Vult even shorter, it still has a frontal aspect that is too big to be the main advantage of the ship.

Kix, I pulled this entire game out of my butt. Obviously, in some ways, it shows, but I just do the best I can. And yes, as FM highlighted, I prefer to make small changes rather than big ones. I find it makes things easier to balance. 40% might not be as large as you expect. But, regardless my focus won't be on numbers as much as eyeballing it, like I said.

But the real point here is in your delivery. If you don't agree with me, that's fine, the whole reason why I posted this here was to get feedback (good and bad). But the way you and johnhawl choose to get your point across doesn't help your arguement at all (if anything, it distracts attention from it and just makes you look ranty), and it makes me wonder if posting this stuff is really worth the headache. At the end of the day, I'm going to do what I think is best for the game, period. I post here to try and involve the userbase and have a forum for discussion on this game that we're all playing. If you disagree, that's fine, but you don't have to rant at me.. just make your points.

The very fact that almost all of the respondents to this thread are positive about the change pretty well shows that it's not a completely dumb idea.

Thank you to everyone who didn't rant.

"I'm not sure how much of a change that will have in combat but I can feel the difference in mass when I use a neut III versus a phase blaster and believe me all those slow pokes still usin 2 neut III's are just askin for it."

I wasn't referring to mass just making the point that little things change combat in a big way.
Though that was a bad example. So sorry FM that I couldn't properly convey my point but it wasn't regarding mass distribution.

And I wouldn't care at all Inc, if every single change made to the ships didn't drastically unbalance combat... but it always does, and I've kinda lost faith in balance when it happens.
And the MAIN reason why I have been moved to rant is the infinitely impossible matchup of the prom versus the centurion. I've posted many times about this and YES I KNOW you can't do anything yet which is FINE.
But nerfin the cent first is just too much for my delicate emotions to handle.
Ok I'm done.

Ooh, newsflash! Changing balance on ships changes combat! I'd better go see if the Associated Press will put a story on the wire about that...

I don't like the change, Inc. I like piloting Centurions because they ARE hard to hit. It's the only thing that saves me from dying in under 20 seconds to the ridiculously powerful AGT and *Flare weapon systems.

But I understand that many pilots seem to think that the Centurion is too small, and since I can tell I'm in the minority on this one, I'll shaddup.

Hopefully I'll be able to improve my dodging and fly the Valk or Vult.

And of course rogue doesn't care about combat.
Rogue when was the last time you fought anyone?
Freedom. Christmas. Unlimited Bandwidth. Only $1.99 A MONTH!
[Hope this isn't a flamebait... OoOoO I know. I'll try to confuse the FM AI by putting happy words in! :P]
Love, joy. Helpful. Longevity. LONG LIVE THE DEVS!!!
Goodness. Wonderful. Happiness. Free week of gameplay!!!.

This is Vendetta version 1.2.7.
Changes from 1.2.6:
- Added "Escort" missions
- Added Raptor class vessel
- Increased the size of the centurion by 200 fold
- New UI
- New TPG Destroyer... its called the centurion :P
- Player controlled caps are now available
- Economy Redux
- Put a limit on the amount of items you could have stored at any given station
- Lowered the Damage a given Capitol ship mining beam can inflict :)
- We are starting to advertise on all major gaming sites and there will be a 15 minute introduction video to the game played at all your local theatre's followed by a credits section that goes out to ALL subscribed players......

That better spell?
:P

i think the list is gonna be a lot longer than that kix. lol

[OT]

Incarnate said " I pulled this entire game out of my butt."

You must be very keen on personal igiene because the game doesn't stink. On the other hand, the mental image of GAMES.CX is scary. Dont do that again please!

[/OT]

Given the wireframes that Incarnate posted and the size numbers given in the game, I wonder how it would work out if the Centurion was scaled to be the same length as the Warthog, with the other dimensions increasing accordingly. It seems like that would be a fair compromise between evening the hittable surface of the ships and keeping the options open.

I dunno what you guys are talking about, I can dodge gatling just fine in a vult 3, and I'm not especially good. Of course I'm not saying the prom shuldn't be nerfed, I'm just saying that this shouldn't make it mandatory.

This is a really good change, imo. Look at the Vult vs. the Cent. A corvus vult, easily the most maneuverable vulte, and an orion cent

Price: CV is 9000c more than the OC, and since you're buying it at a Corvus station, you get a 1000c more Heavy battery, or like 2-3k more FC

Weight: OC, obviously

Armor: Vult wins here, however, in an effort to prove my point, it is likely that perfectly even fights where this armor boost will end in a draw anyway. In my experience the best way to hit a Cent consistantly is to get in close to it, and at that point, shot for shot, the vult won't have enough armor left to handle the cent's explosion

Cargo: Vult loses on all models, I think. If the vult's gonna be heavier, let it be for a reason besides the almost meaningless difference in armor

Battery-Drain: And of course, CV loses again

With all these factors against it, I think people can see why a less skilled OC pilot (*cough-Leber* :P) can beat a better Vult pilot too often to be luck. Hopefully this size change will be "good" enough to fix these changes, however I would also love to see Vult 4 placed in more stations around Sedina B8 so vult pilots have a cheaper and less-crappy-than-3 model around, or at least some changes in cargo capacity or Vulturius drain

And Inc, please don't let the loud guys (*cough-Rival*) make you think we're all pissed. This is a wonderful change.

I don't like the change, Inc. I like piloting Centurions because they ARE hard to hit. It's the only thing that saves me from dying in under 20 seconds to the ridiculously powerful AGT and *Flare weapon systems.


The Valk, I agree, should have a pretty much even 50/50 win/loss split with the Prom, and it currently doesn't.

However, consistent death when you take your combat level 2 Cent (the equivalent of a well-trained man with an Uzi on a superbike) against the pride of the Serco Navy (say, the F-22)? This surprises you?

EDIT: nvm, let's keep it on-topic...