Well how about this gets moved to bugs then?

I will, I just left it temporarily, for those currently tracking it, to make sure people see.

The main ability that gunners can do which is still useful is the ability to command all turrets to fire as far forward as they are able to, regardless of what is in their field of view. Want to light up empty space for a light show? Gunners can do that. Want to as incarnate mentioned shoot at something REALLY big at VERY close range (nearly collision range)? Gunners can do that. As far as I can tell, they have the same firing arc as Active Turrets, but Active Turrets does not appear to fire at things the system doesn't think it can hit.

So the only 'problem' I see with Active Turrets, is the inability to simply command all guns to fire as forward as they can go. The use cases for this ability are rather limited, but can be lots of fun. Last night I was in Itan B6 smashing up convoys. I used capitol swarms, for which the ability to aim them is almost meaningless.

Also, I thought Active Turrets was only supposed to fire two turrets at once. I thought that they were supposed to fire seeking missiles (swarms, gems, firecrackers) at whatever is targeted regardless of if they can bring the weapon to bear, so long as the target is in range. I have not tested if they actually do fire missiles from the other side of a capitol ship and I may be misinformed as to the intended behavior. Unfortunately without knowing in detail what they are supposed to do, I cannot say if they are doing that or not.

"Gunners have an advantage because they fire 4 forward at once and the most activate turrets will is 2..."

and / or

"Four turrets blindly firing forward because of players in the turret does not rely on the targeting system"

It would be helpful to get more details or video of this.

I think i understand the bug. And I made a video to demonstrate it. In the first part of the video, my capswarm turrets are activated via +ActivateTurrets. The turrets are able to fire on the the asteroid I am targeting. The neut turrets on top of my dent are unable to shoot the asteroid, even though they can hit it.

I then add a gunner to an upper turret and engage fire with +shoot2 with the gunner. Only then do my upper and lower turrets work at the same time against the same target.

In the next part of the video, I pitch forward a bit and use +ActivateTurrets to turn on the upper neut turrets. Then lower capswarm turrets are unable to fire upon the asteroid.

I then have the gunner hop into the lower capswarm turret and engage +shoot2 and only then are both upper and lower turrets able to fire upon the same targets at the same time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODEAjZTsUXA

Hmm, from watching that video, it does look like the turret should be able to hit the roid, and therefore fire. Could it be as simple as the "visible" and "not visible" numbers have an over-lap? Does that even make sense?

Anyway, the focus fire thing isn't a bug with activateturrets, it is a feature of turretbots. Just like plugins things can get added to activateturrets, so it maybe just a missing feature rather than bug. It is not possible (by design) to fire all weapons forward regardless of the target with activateturrets, but it is with bots.

So a bit of both things and a bit of mis-communication? Saying "but we can fire all our guns at a target in front of us" did make it sound like turretbots could fire in a larger arc, and while that might actually be a slight case, the actual problem is that you cannot fire all guns forwards. turretbots had a feature added a while back where all the bots aim at a place called "forward" and will fire blindly at that spot; this is the advantage turretbots have in pvp, as against a large target, this can be quite an effective move.

You certainly cannot do that with activateturrets. If it were to be added, rather than complicate things with new commands, could it be as simple as if you have no target, then the turrets will attempt to fire at this "forwards" place? You can find out where the plugin aims them by looking at it. This will also have the added bonus that people won't be able to just lock activateturrets on and use a targetclosest bind.

Yoda, the plugin dosen't aim. The gunners are aimed by hand. The turnup, turndown etc commands were removed well over a year ago

Yeah, the point isn't how it is aimed I guess though, just that is what is getting cross-talked about in this thread. being able to fire all guns that can forwards is a nice touch that ativateturrets does not have, and you also cannot fire swarms at a target your turret cannot see (even though you can target them) with activateturrets, you certainly can do that with turretbots.

Adding a way to fire all guns (that can) forwards to activateturrets would balance both them things? Just a thought of course.

being able to fire all guns that can forwards is a nice touch that ativateturrets does not have, and you also cannot fire swarms at a target your turret cannot see (even though you can target them) with activateturrets, you certainly can do that with turretbots.


^There is the distillation of the "bug".

Player-manned turrets can dumbfire (untargetted) straight ahead all together, activate turrets cannot fire all together nor can it fire straight ahead.

Player-manned turrets can fire swarms at targets not within view, activate turrets cannot.

I think i understand the bug. And I made a video to demonstrate it.

I appreciate We all float's example and information.

^There is the distillation of the "bug".

Yeah, I'm well aware of those points; I already determined internally how we were going to proceed.. yesterday afternoon. I was asking for data, since page-1:

- Weapon loadouts being used primarily for the "blind firing" technique.

That was what would have been actually helpful. There are a variety of reasons why, which are technical and I didn't want to get into.

But, most of you would rather talk about the definition of the word "Bug", and what's a miscommunication, and what solution ideas you have (that I specifically asked you to stop posting).

I appreciate WaF actually paying attention and reading things.

I'm locking this thread, because it's largely been a frustrating and pointless exercise, in which much of the userbase fails at basic communication.