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In short the heavier the ship is the more battery juice required to jump it.
Worm Holes will still need a full charge as well as meeting this requirement.
This may require the addition of a slow charging ultra heavy battery so those xc loads of rails can still move,,,
Worm Holes will still need a full charge as well as meeting this requirement.
This may require the addition of a slow charging ultra heavy battery so those xc loads of rails can still move,,,
+1
The only problem is finding an equation that works for 3000kg ships and 300,000kg ships. Or, yeah, more batteries, which would be nice, but less likely to happen soon. Capital class batteries with very slow charges and very high capacities would fix tridents' invincibility tactic of sector-hopping as fast as light ships. I'm thinking 20 charge and 2-3k capacity.
Or add a new stat to batteries, jump efficiency: heavy cells and other high-capacity cells have a better efficiency, meaning instead of (examples) 1 energy/100kg for a jump (fast charge), 1 energy/500kg for a jump (heavy).
The only problem is finding an equation that works for 3000kg ships and 300,000kg ships. Or, yeah, more batteries, which would be nice, but less likely to happen soon. Capital class batteries with very slow charges and very high capacities would fix tridents' invincibility tactic of sector-hopping as fast as light ships. I'm thinking 20 charge and 2-3k capacity.
Or add a new stat to batteries, jump efficiency: heavy cells and other high-capacity cells have a better efficiency, meaning instead of (examples) 1 energy/100kg for a jump (fast charge), 1 energy/500kg for a jump (heavy).
Is the trident mass 3000k? or is the wiki off?
mass / 600 +50 loks ok for a start with current cells
3k = 55
5k = 58
10k = 66
300k = 550
but the trident breaks it by requiring 5050 energy to jump
mass / 600 +50 loks ok for a start with current cells
3k = 55
5k = 58
10k = 66
300k = 550
but the trident breaks it by requiring 5050 energy to jump
- a lot.
Punitive to Serco nationalists.
Advantageous to Itani Nationalists.
No support in VO lore for it to work this way.
Transparent self serving crap is transparent.
Punitive to Serco nationalists.
Advantageous to Itani Nationalists.
No support in VO lore for it to work this way.
Transparent self serving crap is transparent.
So you're only against it because it doesn't serve your own interests?
What support is there in VO lore for jumps to function the way they do now?
What makes sense about every ship requiring 25% energy to jump, heavy cell or light, trident or centurion? A flat jump cost would be better than what we have, but in physics (correct me if I'm wrong), the energy required to move something increases with its mass.
Making a sensible change to the game that affects one nation more than the other is a problem that needs to be addressed at the level of the unequal nations, rather than preventing the change from taking place.
What support is there in VO lore for jumps to function the way they do now?
What makes sense about every ship requiring 25% energy to jump, heavy cell or light, trident or centurion? A flat jump cost would be better than what we have, but in physics (correct me if I'm wrong), the energy required to move something increases with its mass.
Making a sensible change to the game that affects one nation more than the other is a problem that needs to be addressed at the level of the unequal nations, rather than preventing the change from taking place.
"So you're only against it because it doesn't serve your own interests?"
One can easily argue that you are for the change because it supports your interests.
It is only really a problem though because of the stupid imbalances in ship roles between the Itani Nation and the Serco Dominion. If you want to fly competitive light ships, you must have good itani standing, and if you want competitive heavies, you must have good Serco standing.
I'm still not supporting the change, because there's no need for it.
One can easily argue that you are for the change because it supports your interests.
It is only really a problem though because of the stupid imbalances in ship roles between the Itani Nation and the Serco Dominion. If you want to fly competitive light ships, you must have good itani standing, and if you want competitive heavies, you must have good Serco standing.
I'm still not supporting the change, because there's no need for it.
+1, but not on a linear scale...something more punitive for very heavy loads.
No, I'm against it because it represents a clear advantage for only one nation. I would support it if each nation had unique ships that were equivalent, as opposed t the completely unrealistic system we currently have.
"What makes sense about every ship requiring 25% energy to jump, heavy cell or light, trident or centurion?"
Easy, the jump system is a sub system of the ship. If I start my tower in my house, it takes no longer than starting my laptop. You might have a point IF we were flying in an atmosphere... but, we are not. So you don't.
"What makes sense about every ship requiring 25% energy to jump, heavy cell or light, trident or centurion?"
Easy, the jump system is a sub system of the ship. If I start my tower in my house, it takes no longer than starting my laptop. You might have a point IF we were flying in an atmosphere... but, we are not. So you don't.
Your tower also consumes a lot more power then your laptop but it also has a lot more power availible.
You claim Itanis have an advantage with this... How exactly - give examples and include the mass and jump energy required as well.
@ lecter - this does in fact favor fighters over freighters . If it needs a curve then the curve would need to be reversed.
You claim Itanis have an advantage with this... How exactly - give examples and include the mass and jump energy required as well.
@ lecter - this does in fact favor fighters over freighters . If it needs a curve then the curve would need to be reversed.
One can easily argue that you are for the change because it supports your interests.
You seem to forget I have multiple characters, and that even on my main I often fly heavy trade ships laden with hefty goods. I support this idea because it is sensible realism. Nation ships with equivalent capabilities is the subject of other threads, of which there have been many.
PaK: it's quite obvious lighter ships like the valk, IBG, and SVG will benefit from this, while proms will suffer along with the rest of the heavy class. This idea still makes sense, though, so other changes should be made to compensate, but on the subject of unbalanced nation ships.
Or even give ships a jump efficiency stat, and nerf that for the valk, IBG, and SVG. Combat ships don't have room for efficient jump engines or somesuch.
You seem to forget I have multiple characters, and that even on my main I often fly heavy trade ships laden with hefty goods. I support this idea because it is sensible realism. Nation ships with equivalent capabilities is the subject of other threads, of which there have been many.
PaK: it's quite obvious lighter ships like the valk, IBG, and SVG will benefit from this, while proms will suffer along with the rest of the heavy class. This idea still makes sense, though, so other changes should be made to compensate, but on the subject of unbalanced nation ships.
Or even give ships a jump efficiency stat, and nerf that for the valk, IBG, and SVG. Combat ships don't have room for efficient jump engines or somesuch.
You having multiple characters does not exempt you from national bias. It's a basic presumption in any and ryan was right to point it out.
Also "sensible realism"? There is absolutely no basis for realism whatsoever when we are talking about jump drives, it's 100% Sci-fi. Therefore the only basis to assess it on is gameplay impact and as Ryan points out the change is completely in-favour of the Itani, especially when it comes to itani being able to run away easier.
Also there's no real reason for the change, there's no crisis of people getting through wormholes too quickly or anything as such.
Also "sensible realism"? There is absolutely no basis for realism whatsoever when we are talking about jump drives, it's 100% Sci-fi. Therefore the only basis to assess it on is gameplay impact and as Ryan points out the change is completely in-favour of the Itani, especially when it comes to itani being able to run away easier.
Also there's no real reason for the change, there's no crisis of people getting through wormholes too quickly or anything as such.
-1
The wormholes are a distortion is space-time-continuum, and unrelated to the MASS of ship, or the ship itself...
We can relate the energy required to Ships' SIZE and SPEED, as size relates to WH size, and speed with how long it must be kept open.... but it does not matter if an object have 1KG or 1ton when crossing a hole, as long as it fits!
The wormholes are a distortion is space-time-continuum, and unrelated to the MASS of ship, or the ship itself...
We can relate the energy required to Ships' SIZE and SPEED, as size relates to WH size, and speed with how long it must be kept open.... but it does not matter if an object have 1KG or 1ton when crossing a hole, as long as it fits!
"I'm thinking 20 charge and 2-3k capacity."
I'm thinking this would make the Trident even LESS effective in combat. Power Cell charge rate is the #1 limiting factor of damage in the game today. It's bad enough that the few weapons that are useful on the main gun of a Trident are absolutely awful as far as energy efficiency goes.
How about 100 charge and 10k capacity. Same effect on sector hopping w/o rendering the main gun useless.
I'm thinking this would make the Trident even LESS effective in combat. Power Cell charge rate is the #1 limiting factor of damage in the game today. It's bad enough that the few weapons that are useful on the main gun of a Trident are absolutely awful as far as energy efficiency goes.
How about 100 charge and 10k capacity. Same effect on sector hopping w/o rendering the main gun useless.
"Also there's no real reason for the change, there's no crisis of people getting through wormholes too quickly or anything as such."
Yeah yeah TheRedOstrich, we get it: whenever anything comes along you don't like, you stick your head in the sand and pretend the issues it addresses don't exist.
@Ryan: What are you babbling about? Accelerating a larger mass takes more energy period, whether in an atmosphere or out. Also, nowhere in your rambling did you actually address why trying to jump with the same ship requires twice as much power if you happen to have a powercell with twice the capacity - plugging bigger batteries into my laptop has zero impact on boot speed and power consumption.
Alloh, on the other hand, actually provides a sensible counterpoint to the OP. I agree with him. It should be based on the ship dimensions, not the mass.
Yeah yeah TheRedOstrich, we get it: whenever anything comes along you don't like, you stick your head in the sand and pretend the issues it addresses don't exist.
@Ryan: What are you babbling about? Accelerating a larger mass takes more energy period, whether in an atmosphere or out. Also, nowhere in your rambling did you actually address why trying to jump with the same ship requires twice as much power if you happen to have a powercell with twice the capacity - plugging bigger batteries into my laptop has zero impact on boot speed and power consumption.
Alloh, on the other hand, actually provides a sensible counterpoint to the OP. I agree with him. It should be based on the ship dimensions, not the mass.
^That does make sense. +1 to jump energy relative to size, then.
TRS: why must every suggestion solve a problem?
TRS: why must every suggestion solve a problem?
instead of a finite energy amount lets keep it to %'s of the power cell, We don't want to limit the amount of items we are able to use in game
so light 25% like it is now
medium load/weight 50%
heavy 100%
What surprises me is the serco freaking out and not the traders, because really this would make light fighter multi sector pursuits of heavier ships, traders or capital more likely to succeed.
+1
so light 25% like it is now
medium load/weight 50%
heavy 100%
What surprises me is the serco freaking out and not the traders, because really this would make light fighter multi sector pursuits of heavier ships, traders or capital more likely to succeed.
+1
+1
Espionage, I think it fit's each nation's "personalities." I see the Serco as the type to design heavier ships, while the Itani would make lighter and more agile ships.
Espionage, I think it fit's each nation's "personalities." I see the Serco as the type to design heavier ships, while the Itani would make lighter and more agile ships.
and if you draw circles around a X1 and a SCP at their largest section, both are quite similar, despite their mass/length... while a Valk produces a larger circle... good for busses, atlas, revs... bad for centaurs, craptors, etc...
Pizzasgood said:"Accelerating a larger mass takes more energy period, whether in an atmosphere or out."
Who said jumping intra-sector, or through WH's accelerated anything?
I like the idea of differing intra-sector jumps needing more or less energy, but I'd rather see the difference based on how far one jumps (how many other sectors crossed). I never imagined the energy was used to somehow accelerate the ship, more just "opening the doorway".
The 100% batt requirment for WH jumps I always imagined was due to a need for some kind of electrical system stability... as is, you cant jump while the charge levels are fluctuating...
Dent.
Who said jumping intra-sector, or through WH's accelerated anything?
I like the idea of differing intra-sector jumps needing more or less energy, but I'd rather see the difference based on how far one jumps (how many other sectors crossed). I never imagined the energy was used to somehow accelerate the ship, more just "opening the doorway".
The 100% batt requirment for WH jumps I always imagined was due to a need for some kind of electrical system stability... as is, you cant jump while the charge levels are fluctuating...
Dent.
Every suggestion doesn't have to solve a problem, but if a suggestion is to replace an existing feature it should at least be shown why it is a better choice than the existing one, which hasn't occurred here.
"You claim Itanis have an advantage with this... How exactly - give examples and include the mass and jump energy required as well."
Lightest unique Itani vessel base weight: 2900kg
Lightest unique serco vessel base weight: 3800kg
Nuff said.
Rin, for starters you should be calling me TheRedEmu if anything, since I don't stick my head in the sand, but i'm telling you, I can run the pants off a Centaur Mark II.
I like the idea of introducing a proper range of powercells with different drawbacks, grid power, jump efficiency and all of the above. The jump mechanics should stay constant so that we can build a trade-off system with powercells and not have fixed
"You claim Itanis have an advantage with this... How exactly - give examples and include the mass and jump energy required as well."
Lightest unique Itani vessel base weight: 2900kg
Lightest unique serco vessel base weight: 3800kg
Nuff said.
Rin, for starters you should be calling me TheRedEmu if anything, since I don't stick my head in the sand, but i'm telling you, I can run the pants off a Centaur Mark II.
I like the idea of introducing a proper range of powercells with different drawbacks, grid power, jump efficiency and all of the above. The jump mechanics should stay constant so that we can build a trade-off system with powercells and not have fixed