Forums » Suggestions
/me plants the 100th post flag
This one has been nagging me for a week or so.
Nobody wants their faction to say UIT. Pirates obviously do not wish to be labeled as a silly ineffective association of corporations, and traders aren't dedicated to wearing the label either. Just about everyone seems to want the ability to change who is reported as their faction.
Well, look at what UIT is. It is basically a sort of EU for the yellow space corporations. This tells me that only government personnel (read: NPCs) should be called UIT. Since UIT stands for Union of Independent Territories, shouldn't citizens of the UIT area be more accurately called "Independents?"
If yellow players were labelled in this fashion, there would be no need to change factions for pirates or anyone else. The term independent covers it all. They are no longer bound to yellow space, or union stations, by the label on their character screen.
Now on a separate note, the addition of a fourth player faction. Instead of Serco, Itani, UIT, unaligned, I propose this instead.
Serco, Itani, Independent, Neutral.
What does this change? Well, it offers people more options. The third and fourth options would be a label in reference to the war between the Itani and Serco. Let me explain better..
Independent is the term I would use for someone who *is* a combatant, but *is not* on anyone's side. Pirates, belligerent traders, bounty hunters, and more can be defined very easily as independents. They hold no allegiance but to themselves, and their faction system should reflect that. They can gain faction the same way as an Itani or Serco pilot (read: necessary to pick a side in red vs blue or corp vs corp struggles), but on a VERY slow to trust basis. Picture the faction system for Independents as stuck in the mud. No matter which direction they attempt to go, it will take them longer to get there. Blasting someone in nation space or near a station should be expected from independents, and their faction levels will only hiccup as a result, because it took them a lot longer to get where they are. An Independent cannot gain PoS with anyone, only +999. This reflects again that every faction in space knows you intend to do as you please, and provides a way to restrict ships and equipment available from the warring factions.
Neutral is for the peace-loving. Similar to the present UIT, they will be able to gain faction with anyone with no restrictions. HOWEVER: when any neutral kills someone as the aggressor instead of as the defender, their penalty should be tripled or worse. Maybe even kicked out of Neutral and sent to Independent. This is because a Neutral pilot is giving up their right to take sides in return for unparalleled access to every station, market, and corner of space. This faction option is perfect for those traders who wish to maintain access to all of space despite the new system that will make every other player choose who to take and who to discard, but it comes with a price. If properly implemented, a player should be unable to call himself neutral unless he really does avoid combat. As a benefit to Neutrals, the killer of any Neutral pilot should have the book thrown at them.
Anyone (read: red and blue as well as yellow) should have the ability to take a mission to switch themselves to Independent. Neutral, however, needs to be selected at character creation and can only be lost, not gained. This accurately reflects a pilot being held accountable for his actions in the past, as no faction is stupid enough to ever completely trust he is neutral.
Obviously you cannot gain faction with 'neutral' or 'independent' because they are not factions in that sense. They are both labels applied to pilots not of Serco or Itani birth, or the disenchanted of the Serco and Itani.
Nobody wants their faction to say UIT. Pirates obviously do not wish to be labeled as a silly ineffective association of corporations, and traders aren't dedicated to wearing the label either. Just about everyone seems to want the ability to change who is reported as their faction.
Well, look at what UIT is. It is basically a sort of EU for the yellow space corporations. This tells me that only government personnel (read: NPCs) should be called UIT. Since UIT stands for Union of Independent Territories, shouldn't citizens of the UIT area be more accurately called "Independents?"
If yellow players were labelled in this fashion, there would be no need to change factions for pirates or anyone else. The term independent covers it all. They are no longer bound to yellow space, or union stations, by the label on their character screen.
Now on a separate note, the addition of a fourth player faction. Instead of Serco, Itani, UIT, unaligned, I propose this instead.
Serco, Itani, Independent, Neutral.
What does this change? Well, it offers people more options. The third and fourth options would be a label in reference to the war between the Itani and Serco. Let me explain better..
Independent is the term I would use for someone who *is* a combatant, but *is not* on anyone's side. Pirates, belligerent traders, bounty hunters, and more can be defined very easily as independents. They hold no allegiance but to themselves, and their faction system should reflect that. They can gain faction the same way as an Itani or Serco pilot (read: necessary to pick a side in red vs blue or corp vs corp struggles), but on a VERY slow to trust basis. Picture the faction system for Independents as stuck in the mud. No matter which direction they attempt to go, it will take them longer to get there. Blasting someone in nation space or near a station should be expected from independents, and their faction levels will only hiccup as a result, because it took them a lot longer to get where they are. An Independent cannot gain PoS with anyone, only +999. This reflects again that every faction in space knows you intend to do as you please, and provides a way to restrict ships and equipment available from the warring factions.
Neutral is for the peace-loving. Similar to the present UIT, they will be able to gain faction with anyone with no restrictions. HOWEVER: when any neutral kills someone as the aggressor instead of as the defender, their penalty should be tripled or worse. Maybe even kicked out of Neutral and sent to Independent. This is because a Neutral pilot is giving up their right to take sides in return for unparalleled access to every station, market, and corner of space. This faction option is perfect for those traders who wish to maintain access to all of space despite the new system that will make every other player choose who to take and who to discard, but it comes with a price. If properly implemented, a player should be unable to call himself neutral unless he really does avoid combat. As a benefit to Neutrals, the killer of any Neutral pilot should have the book thrown at them.
Anyone (read: red and blue as well as yellow) should have the ability to take a mission to switch themselves to Independent. Neutral, however, needs to be selected at character creation and can only be lost, not gained. This accurately reflects a pilot being held accountable for his actions in the past, as no faction is stupid enough to ever completely trust he is neutral.
Obviously you cannot gain faction with 'neutral' or 'independent' because they are not factions in that sense. They are both labels applied to pilots not of Serco or Itani birth, or the disenchanted of the Serco and Itani.
I don't mind it aside from the facts that it sounds overly complicated, and doesn't allow for Corporation alignment. I want to be Orion dammit (on one of my characters anyway).
To be 'Orion' would involve flying missions only for them like their NPCs. You don't see them working for Axia or anyone else. You could only home at Orion stations. It would be really restrictive.
You, as an Independent, are better than that. You are paid more than Orion employees and you have more of a life than they do.
You, as an Independent, are better than that. You are paid more than Orion employees and you have more of a life than they do.
You see Corporations working together like that everyday though... Escort missions always gain faction with the destination faction, not the initial faction with whom you fly.
Anyway, the restrictions you mention are your personal opinion and wouldn't have to be implemented. I don't see why they would be. Given that the back story paints the UIT as such a pure form of Capitalism, I personally think of Corporations as families. Sure there would be trade-offs, just like any of the other factions (Serco or Itani). Being Orion might mean you don't have access to BioCom stations because of a legal dispute between the two corporations (war). And doing missions for a different Corporation, and in the process gaining faction with them, might lower faction with Orion, eventually leading to a change of alignment.
And even if your point was the case, it could be a choice people make. Want access to the Rev C? Well, it's only for Orion employees. So you've got to join up with Orion!
Anyway, the restrictions you mention are your personal opinion and wouldn't have to be implemented. I don't see why they would be. Given that the back story paints the UIT as such a pure form of Capitalism, I personally think of Corporations as families. Sure there would be trade-offs, just like any of the other factions (Serco or Itani). Being Orion might mean you don't have access to BioCom stations because of a legal dispute between the two corporations (war). And doing missions for a different Corporation, and in the process gaining faction with them, might lower faction with Orion, eventually leading to a change of alignment.
And even if your point was the case, it could be a choice people make. Want access to the Rev C? Well, it's only for Orion employees. So you've got to join up with Orion!
Just a reminder Incarnate... You agreed to post a new updated RFC for the upcoming faction changes being as this is from 2007 some of it is outdated....
you know it makes sense the way he was going to do it, I like it
I completely agree with your op, Inc.
I go with the OP, but would like to suggest a few (probably already suggested modifications, but I'm not reading the whole damned thread) suggestions.
1) Admire and POS if it continues to exist in game should not be possible to attain exclusively through trade proc missions or botting. Each nation or faction may have different requirements which may include successful completion of a difficult mission, success in combat (ie. border missions), pk's of the rival faction. Something, anything but a straight easy shot like it is now. Oh, and personal preferences, a) grandfather anyone in based on their choice at the time of implementation and b) leave the path mysterious.
2) We've really got to have a method for fighting in nation space without risking faction loss. Possibly increase the difficulty in regaining faction standing. Limit players who have tanked their standing to neutral or respect as the maximum they will be able to achieve in the future. Regaining faction should not be just sneaking in and botting for an hour or two and then running procs. Maybe be forgiving for the first offense, but subsequent offenses should become less absolve-able.
3) I'm not going to argue too hard for this one, but nation specific ships should be exactly that. Foreigners should not be able to gain enough standing to purchase top end nation ships. The problem I see with this one, is the likely shift of players over to Itani characters for the valks. Though to be fair, I have been seeing a lot more proms around lately.
1) Admire and POS if it continues to exist in game should not be possible to attain exclusively through trade proc missions or botting. Each nation or faction may have different requirements which may include successful completion of a difficult mission, success in combat (ie. border missions), pk's of the rival faction. Something, anything but a straight easy shot like it is now. Oh, and personal preferences, a) grandfather anyone in based on their choice at the time of implementation and b) leave the path mysterious.
2) We've really got to have a method for fighting in nation space without risking faction loss. Possibly increase the difficulty in regaining faction standing. Limit players who have tanked their standing to neutral or respect as the maximum they will be able to achieve in the future. Regaining faction should not be just sneaking in and botting for an hour or two and then running procs. Maybe be forgiving for the first offense, but subsequent offenses should become less absolve-able.
3) I'm not going to argue too hard for this one, but nation specific ships should be exactly that. Foreigners should not be able to gain enough standing to purchase top end nation ships. The problem I see with this one, is the likely shift of players over to Itani characters for the valks. Though to be fair, I have been seeing a lot more proms around lately.
Agreed on #3. Foreigners should not get to have nation exclusive ships regardless of how this all turns out on what the ceiling of faction level is for foreigners.
Foreigners should not get to have nation exclusive ships regardless of how this all turns out on what the ceiling of faction level is for foreigners.
+100. Make valks, proms and UIT version of maud unique!
+100. Make valks, proms and UIT version of maud unique!
I'm not opposed to making them mutually exclusive, but they either need to create a market where players can sell ships or make a 3 port fighter to rival the valk. Making it so you can only buy 1 type at any given time, mutually exclusive, would be acceptable though.
If they do that, then they need to make a heavy armored ship to rival the prom as well. Kind of defeats the purpose of having the valk and prom in the first place.
Pick a side.
Pick a side.
There should be no way that if someone is admired by a sub faction you should be able to get to nation space if KOS with that nation, but i will bet apples to oranges that will not be changed or fixed. just my 2 cents
Let the flaming begin
Minen, member of IPA, Interstellar Pacifists Association
Let the flaming begin
Minen, member of IPA, Interstellar Pacifists Association
Nah, I like the idea of being able to butter up a company so that they will shelter you within hostile space. It is very UIT.
Of course you would like it Rin :>)
I disagree with the above post from abort... The prom seems to be structured to a specific niche, the valk on the other hand can be used so successfully against just about anything it's almost completely silly to use anything else.
Each and every ship should have a specific niche or you risk boring the player base. The valk needs a serious refocusing so the other ships are considered on the basis of merit rather than availability. If the faction update is aimed at fixing the silly amount of valk pilots then it aims to do so simply by restricting availability. You will only have serious duels between itani and serco/uit players will largely disappear from the serious pvp scene.
We need alternative 3 port fighters, or better yet, a refocusing of the valk to make it less of a generalist.
Each and every ship should have a specific niche or you risk boring the player base. The valk needs a serious refocusing so the other ships are considered on the basis of merit rather than availability. If the faction update is aimed at fixing the silly amount of valk pilots then it aims to do so simply by restricting availability. You will only have serious duels between itani and serco/uit players will largely disappear from the serious pvp scene.
We need alternative 3 port fighters, or better yet, a refocusing of the valk to make it less of a generalist.
It's not a generalist. It's a fighter/interceptor. It's got zilch for a cargo hold and slows down pretty dramatically when you put really heavy addons like repair guns on it.
The prom isn't so niche as you might think. How many of them have you flown? In the hands of a capable pilot they're as devastating as a valkyrie and take twice as long to kill.
The prom isn't so niche as you might think. How many of them have you flown? In the hands of a capable pilot they're as devastating as a valkyrie and take twice as long to kill.
And it's (the prom) a horrible interceptor.
Make the valk itani only and you create a situation where pirates suddenly have a huge incentive to turn blue.
Although....I do see the attraction of labeling all itanis as scoundrels ;)
Make the valk itani only and you create a situation where pirates suddenly have a huge incentive to turn blue.
Although....I do see the attraction of labeling all itanis as scoundrels ;)