I lost over 700,000 credits today to Ghostwolff's ****ing spam moth. He would wait in B8, and then spam the shit out of me and run, every single time I came in, usually killing me if I was busy fighting another player (or three... was it UIT gankfest holiday or something and I missed the memo?).

Anyway, moth needs major nerfage, sooner rather than later... because it is NOT designed to be an invulnerable spam platform.

I saw that but what you forgot to mention is how you cruised by him in b-8 with a vult
he did nothing. You left came back in a spam rag and went at him. Only then did i see you lose some ships. Seems to me you provoked your loss. You looked like the main aggressor to me. So are you just a sore loser? And now you want the moth gone so you have an edge in your spam rag?

meh, he has 5 godamn shots cunjo...just get some spam, and nail him before he fires, when he does, run, avoid swarms, repeat.

Haha. That said, the moth shouldn't even really be capable of mounting an offensive ability. Maybe not even equipping swarms.

I definitely think it's the power of the swarms that is the culprit in this case. But I've been pushing to put moth top speed at 160.

And I only ganked you b/c I saw 2 Vipers after you. If it was b/c of GhostWolff, I give you my deepest apologizes.

forget top speed, cut the armor - by HALF.

jkloos:
uhh, no. I don't fly vults, and I didn't switch to a missile loadout on my rag until he had killed me 6-8 times during combat with other players.

zamzx:
He's flying a ****ing Moth! Not only can he outrun swarms, but he can absorb them as well. On the other hand, one shot from him will kill just about any offensive ship/loadout. A cent doesn't have the power to take him out quickly, and anything big enough to do so gets eaten by the swarms.

Speaking of that, the moth needs a THRUST decrease too, because there should be no way in hell it can launch two flights of swarms head-on, and still turn around and boost away before the swarms of the other ship catch it.

fooz:
why top speed? It's the armor that makes the moth uber, and nobody wants to fly a slow ship on long trade missions. What's nerfing the top speed going to do? cut the armor by half, and tune down the thrust so it can't accelerate as quickly.

ya, and what the feck was with that anyway? I jump into B8 in a moth to counter ghostwolff, and I immediately get two vipers on my ass... bloody 'anti-piracy' hypocrites.

I agree that the moth is either WAY too strong OR way too fast.

It's almost impossible to take out. Even a flare + dual AGT wont bring it down while a single dual salvo of swarms pulverizes a Taur.

It's nopt right for a cargo hauler.

We need to cut down on speed or prohibit use of missile weapons on that ship. Restriction to energy only would make sense.

maye it wasn't a vult but it damn sure wasnt a rag. you flew in, said you were trying something out and left, came back in your spam rag and headed for him opened up 1 volley and he threw three at you. Then you kept coming back and sending volleys and he did the same. Your both guilty of spamming he just got the better of you. Thats total BS saying you didn't load missile's till you were killed 6-8 times. If you can't fight a moth you prolly shouldn't be pvping let alone attempting to counter in a rag. If you wan't the moth gone or toned down there are much better way's to tell them about it's superiority than OMG I LOST 700K TO GHOSTWOLF CAUSE I CAN'T FIGHT A MOTH IT NEEDS TO BE NERFED. Grow up everyone knows it's overpowered and needs to be toned down a bit. Just say that and your more likely to get a positive response. Oh and VPR was coming after you because like I said you attacked him first. He retaliated, so they saw it as a threat. More specifically they saw it as you being a pie rat so they aren't hypocrites. Please I know what he does but this time you did start it. So stop with the i'm the victim crap.

Cunjo, can't you jsut wait a little bit longer? New ships and ship tweaks and nerfings are coming after the UI is ready, among them the second moth nerfing and the "biggening" of the cent.

If you are having so much trouble killing a TRADESHIP in the meantime, may I suggest you flee in terror every time you see one?

Jex,
Calling it a tradeship isn't much of an insult.
This is VO... remember?
The game where even an atlas has a chance of taking out an IBG once its got AGT.

It's true you can't take out a moth within 20 seconds if its turboing at full speed unless you have a valk with flare and neut II combo.
OR
Hog and mega posi, flare.
So take down the top speed by 10 so that moths now need an escort if they want to go through dangerous space.

OK?
Viper's = Hippo Critters

Cunjo forgot to tell you, ghostwolf was standing STILL and then cunjo would go to dive-bomb him. then, of course, ghost pwnd him in his face.

rags can barely outrun swarms and moths have 50% less thrust.

(look whos talking...me..)

here's my idea.

it should be VERY VERY HARD!!!!! for one person to take down a moth. all this stuff about OMG ITS UNBALANCED!!!!!!!! talking about one thing or another isnt taking into account group combat, because well, there arent enought peeps for group combat really.

So you couldnt destroy a moth that was actively trying to kill you? BOOO HOOOOO!!!!! go get some friends to help you out and you will kick his ass.

actually a speed decrease will be more effective play wise than an armor cut. If it cant escape so fast it will be FAR more veunerable to energy weapons, and ships will have time to coordinate attacks against it.

cut the speed, cut the thrust -> mass ratio (maybe by doubling the mass and multiplying the thrust(both turo and non-turbo) by 1.5)

while we are at it cut the top speed of the rag to 60/180.

What Spellcast said.

I can't WAIT to see what everyone says about the capships:

I think the capships need a 90% armor nerf! And they should only be able to go 10 m/s so I have time to pop them as they transit my sector! OMG! I can barely even damage it in my little Rev C!

Sheesh. Not every ship has to be balanced 1 v 1. It's OK for some ships to be inherently BETTER than others. And I can't believe that CUNJO in a swarm Rag lost to GHOSTIE in a swarm Moth in a fair fight. I assume that Ghostwolff did his usual crap, sitting around until someone is wounded badly, then he valiantly swarms the crap out of them. He's like a hyena. An ugly, smelly hyena, "loping" his prey to death.

I find even a mildly maneuverable ship acceptable against a swarm moth. Just have to turn on the sound so you can hear the "pet beeps..."

I remember Inc. saying he was planning on nerfing the moth eventually. That he never intended it to have so much armor. He (and I) want it to have very little armor actually, so that it requires an escort. This will also promote group play.

Cunjo and I last night put up one hell of a fight against him. We
threw everything we could against GW: N2/3's, AGT, rail hornets,
jacks, screamers, gems... even swarms. We managed to kill everyone
BUT Ghostwolff.

A way that seemed to be working quite nicely last night was one person
would get GW's attention (and swarm fire) while the other went in for
the kill from behind.Once he realized he was under attack, he'd
put the pedal to the metal, and/or his cronnies would race to his aid.

A great combo that works on moths are an infiniboost Hog II with megaposi and N2/N3 grouped under primary weapons. Its more than enough speed to catch a moth, and can kill it in about 2-3 fairly direct hits.

why not oh say... remove the moth's weapon ports?
ar at least swap them for S ports.

as for the whole speed v armor issue, while what Spellcast, says is corect, the moth doesn't need to be more vulnerable to energy so much as it needs to be more vilnerable in general. hence given it's low speed and hight armor, and armor cut is more logicle

[edid] though dying to a moth is prety sad in general

All this complaining about the ship is really just an excuse at not paying close attention to your surroundings. If a moth kills you, you need to be more aware and thats all.

If he was bugging the crap out of you and spamming the hell out of you, upload a log and file a harrasment complaint against him, dont use one guys dick like behaviour to get a ship changed.

I remember Inc. saying he was planning on nerfing the moth eventually. That he never intended it to have so much armor. He (and I) want it to have very little armor actually, so that it requires an escort. This will also promote group play.

Ghost. if he wants to promote group play then slowing it down would be more effective IMO, then it can act as the centerpiece of a moving battle with bot attackers and defenders able to keep up with it. cutting the armor would just make it veunerable to the 'fly in, kill the escortee, deal with the escorts at your leisure' tactics that CtC basically has become.

at 180m/s with its current thrust it still outruns most attackers and turns combat around into what basically amounts to a race.

a reasonable speed lightly armored ship is much harder to kill than a slow heavy armored ship.