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Just been told this is a feature, not a bug, well, im pretty sure this isnt how it was meant to be.
How the hell we gunna have PvP events and the likes if theres no *safe* places to blast someone?
Yesterday, I shot a UiT in UiT space, yet I lost Itani faction, I also blasted a Tani n UiT space, and lost nothing. Today, yakyuk blasted a UiT in Edras (unmonitored) and lost Serco standing...
...Now to be honest, if this is planned, its one of the worst moves ever, its enough to drive me out of the game, seriously, GREY SPACE = NO FACTION LOSS. John said so, ages ago, and I dont really care about NPCS that only pirate NPCS, can we have some clarification from you guys about this?
How the hell we gunna have PvP events and the likes if theres no *safe* places to blast someone?
Yesterday, I shot a UiT in UiT space, yet I lost Itani faction, I also blasted a Tani n UiT space, and lost nothing. Today, yakyuk blasted a UiT in Edras (unmonitored) and lost Serco standing...
...Now to be honest, if this is planned, its one of the worst moves ever, its enough to drive me out of the game, seriously, GREY SPACE = NO FACTION LOSS. John said so, ages ago, and I dont really care about NPCS that only pirate NPCS, can we have some clarification from you guys about this?
I side with you on this Yoda.
Grey space is marked as unmonitored space. That means unmonitored for all.
if you start shooting down those Corvus *pirates, you're loosing Corvus standing. Since there's no way to get that standing back if you get down to hated, this is just plain wrong. It means that all accesses to the Corvus hangouts (Sedina B8, Latos / Sedina WH and a few more) means you can no longer go there unhindered.
It's just plain wrong.
Grey space is marked as unmonitored space. That means unmonitored for all.
if you start shooting down those Corvus *pirates, you're loosing Corvus standing. Since there's no way to get that standing back if you get down to hated, this is just plain wrong. It means that all accesses to the Corvus hangouts (Sedina B8, Latos / Sedina WH and a few more) means you can no longer go there unhindered.
It's just plain wrong.
Seriously.
I don't care about losing uit in tani or losing serco in uit space and such, do what you want with those colors.
But grey should be free reign.
I don't want to go into grey thinking "should I attack this guy?"
I don't care about losing uit in tani or losing serco in uit space and such, do what you want with those colors.
But grey should be free reign.
I don't want to go into grey thinking "should I attack this guy?"
Dude!
are you *sure* you were in unmonitored space? I did some pking in Sedina B8 last night with no faction loss.
Also, not all greyspace should be law of the jungle... I'm sure Tunguska, Axia et al still care about people killing their traders even if Corvus doesn't.
are you *sure* you were in unmonitored space? I did some pking in Sedina B8 last night with no faction loss.
Also, not all greyspace should be law of the jungle... I'm sure Tunguska, Axia et al still care about people killing their traders even if Corvus doesn't.
The only faction loss in Sedina (that i've seen) is -5 Corvus for blasting a pirate NPC. Not enough to even consider if you ask me.
I don't consider this a problem. If you want to shoot someone without risking your faction, try /duel.
I don't consider this a problem. If you want to shoot someone without risking your faction, try /duel.
-5? You mean -500. Last night, I hadn't even taken a mission, but when I shot a corvus pirate dude I lost 500 standing instantly. I regained it thanks to RelayeR, but seriously, something's wrong with the faction system right now...
-Calder
-Calder
Yep, im pretty sure it was unmonitored space, unless of course someone just started to monitor the edras/pelatus worm hole, and well, we both thought it was a bug, but apparently not, apparently its even been talkind about ingame by a dev, its something to do with *no wantin to let pirates be admired by peoples if they go pking* so what about pvp events?
And phaser STFU, im not whining, im asking for clarification, is all.
And phaser STFU, im not whining, im asking for clarification, is all.
"I'm sure Tunguska, Axia et al still care about people killing their traders even if Corvus doesn't."
Really? Your sure of that?
What if its not cost effective to protect them?
Like say everyone's in a moth and gets away no matter what....
Not worth the task force.
Really? Your sure of that?
What if its not cost effective to protect them?
Like say everyone's in a moth and gets away no matter what....
Not worth the task force.
-500? Then something's changed, because I tested it at the B8 WH Friday evening, when I first noticed it. I shot two pirates and lost exactly 10 point.
On a side note, yesterday, when I shot a UIT player who was evidently Corvus neutral or dislike, Corvus gave me 1000 creds.
All-in-all, I like the increased faction monitoring. Though, a bit more explaination on how it works now would be nice.
On a side note, yesterday, when I shot a UIT player who was evidently Corvus neutral or dislike, Corvus gave me 1000 creds.
All-in-all, I like the increased faction monitoring. Though, a bit more explaination on how it works now would be nice.
Um, the real question is: how the fuck are you losing any standing for killing NPCs in unmonitored gray space sectors. 5, 500, doesn't matter. Not. Supposed. To. Happen. Hence the point of "unmonitored."
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if you start shooting down those Corvus *pirates, you're loosing Corvus standing. Since there's no way to get that standing back if you get down to hated, this is just plain wrong. It means that all accesses to the Corvus hangouts (Sedina B8, Latos / Sedina WH and a few more) means you can no longer go there unhindered.
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What a frightening prospect!
Thankfully, unless some drastic gameplay aspect was changed while I was getting lunch, it is actually impossible to become hated by corvus to the point where they won't let you dock. Honest. I tried this once, back in the day. When the only way to lose corvus standing was by canceling missions. I was all pumped for being hated by every single faction in the game and not being able to dock or spawn anywhere, but lo and behold, just as I would have hit -601, instead of the regular "corvus standing decreased slightly" I was faced with a "corvus standing increased slightly."
Sohm, yea, don't worry so much. All you're losing is a few hours of trading. And you ARE killing _corvus_ pirates, after all.
if you start shooting down those Corvus *pirates, you're loosing Corvus standing. Since there's no way to get that standing back if you get down to hated, this is just plain wrong. It means that all accesses to the Corvus hangouts (Sedina B8, Latos / Sedina WH and a few more) means you can no longer go there unhindered.
----------------
What a frightening prospect!
Thankfully, unless some drastic gameplay aspect was changed while I was getting lunch, it is actually impossible to become hated by corvus to the point where they won't let you dock. Honest. I tried this once, back in the day. When the only way to lose corvus standing was by canceling missions. I was all pumped for being hated by every single faction in the game and not being able to dock or spawn anywhere, but lo and behold, just as I would have hit -601, instead of the regular "corvus standing decreased slightly" I was faced with a "corvus standing increased slightly."
Sohm, yea, don't worry so much. All you're losing is a few hours of trading. And you ARE killing _corvus_ pirates, after all.
unmonitered means not officialy monitered. consequences should exist everywhere. what changes is what those consequences are.
but i agree some clerification on what is supposed to hapen would be nice, and there has to be some benifit to helping the relavent factions in addition to a penalty for angering them.
but i agree some clerification on what is supposed to hapen would be nice, and there has to be some benifit to helping the relavent factions in addition to a penalty for angering them.
No, unmonitored means that in Sedina B-8 or any other sector that is unmonitored, what happens there is unknown and unverifiable. If that convoy vanishes, some pirate ships don't make it home, or some pilots happen to, uh, become a buffet line... hey, who's to say what really happened.
The idea that any system could monitor that much of the universe is not only silly, but not terribly useful for gameplay. We already have monitored space, let's keep the consequences limited to it.
The idea that any system could monitor that much of the universe is not only silly, but not terribly useful for gameplay. We already have monitored space, let's keep the consequences limited to it.
it has nothing to do with monitoring, but with having the ability to signal the factions of being attacked by person X or Y. So in that regard it is not a prob.
But as always we will see what it will become. But if the devs did decide on smething like this, complaints won't work to stop it.
It would however not surprise me to see this going in and have at the same time an introduction of a device that will get rid of id-calls. Which will in turn make you unidentifiable on radars. Or another gizmo like it.
But as always we will see what it will become. But if the devs did decide on smething like this, complaints won't work to stop it.
It would however not surprise me to see this going in and have at the same time an introduction of a device that will get rid of id-calls. Which will in turn make you unidentifiable on radars. Or another gizmo like it.
Heh. That would require insertion of new content*. I'm not holding my breath. The current focus on UI and missions that merely make for a different flavor of ctc will keep those four hopping around on bugs and wrinkles for a loooong time.
*Note, content is defined as something that adds a new dimension/incentive to the game, not some mission that gives me a new way to shoot NPC defenders or escorts to make credits that I can't do anything new with. Ooo, but I hear I CAN lose faction now, to get those credits by playing the missions. A step in the right direction, at least. Now all I need is a reason to do those silly escort/pirate missions. Like, say, denying an enemy access to resources, hence credits and parts, hence ships and equipment.
*Note, content is defined as something that adds a new dimension/incentive to the game, not some mission that gives me a new way to shoot NPC defenders or escorts to make credits that I can't do anything new with. Ooo, but I hear I CAN lose faction now, to get those credits by playing the missions. A step in the right direction, at least. Now all I need is a reason to do those silly escort/pirate missions. Like, say, denying an enemy access to resources, hence credits and parts, hence ships and equipment.
The basic thing I am wondering about is this... If rumors are true and grey space is to become monitored, then as yoda said, what about events, like: the roid wars or Last man standing or even the Deneb run and TGFT mining events, where pirates add to the gameplay. Making you lose faction no matter where you fight is just going to stop pvp except in /duel situations and thats just in my opinon very bad. If we can get a dev to respond to this it would clear things up for us all.
Unfortunately, I've been asleep for the whole life of this thread, or you can be certain I'd have replied before now. Let me first assure the concerned that, essentially, what yoda encountered was a bug.
The faction system, as basically everyone I've ever talked to about it agrees, is pretty lame. That, said, it isn't quite ready to be replaced yet. What I stuck in there with my new missions was mostly just meant to handle rewards for kills. The faction penalties, were, I guess, an artifact of the future that I shouldn't have let into production. In my defense, no one complained during the 2 weeks or so that it was this way on the test server (in fact penalties were 100x greater).
As others have said, space doesn't really have to be monitored for a faction to know that you destroyed a member, and it is pretty unrealistic to think that even Corvus wouldn't care. A character should not have an easy time walking the line between friend of Corvus and anyone else. But obviously there are some missing pieces before it will be acceptable to make this aspect of the game more realistic.
I will simply remove all faction penalties right now, pending discussion with the other devs and the community. The penalty that yoda incurred would have been due to one of the two parties being on a Deliverator-based mission; it wasn't meant to affect the usual furballs in B8 that are obviously the staple of our gampeplay right now.
Once again, I'm really sorry for the confusion/stress this has caused. I suppose I need to pay more attention to what a given change will do to the game as it stands, rather than how it fits into our vision of how it should be. I hope to hear from you all about how the new missions can best be tweaked to provide maximum fun in our present universe.
The faction system, as basically everyone I've ever talked to about it agrees, is pretty lame. That, said, it isn't quite ready to be replaced yet. What I stuck in there with my new missions was mostly just meant to handle rewards for kills. The faction penalties, were, I guess, an artifact of the future that I shouldn't have let into production. In my defense, no one complained during the 2 weeks or so that it was this way on the test server (in fact penalties were 100x greater).
As others have said, space doesn't really have to be monitored for a faction to know that you destroyed a member, and it is pretty unrealistic to think that even Corvus wouldn't care. A character should not have an easy time walking the line between friend of Corvus and anyone else. But obviously there are some missing pieces before it will be acceptable to make this aspect of the game more realistic.
I will simply remove all faction penalties right now, pending discussion with the other devs and the community. The penalty that yoda incurred would have been due to one of the two parties being on a Deliverator-based mission; it wasn't meant to affect the usual furballs in B8 that are obviously the staple of our gampeplay right now.
Once again, I'm really sorry for the confusion/stress this has caused. I suppose I need to pay more attention to what a given change will do to the game as it stands, rather than how it fits into our vision of how it should be. I hope to hear from you all about how the new missions can best be tweaked to provide maximum fun in our present universe.
Verrrrry Interesting. In computer games, as in Real Life, actions, as well as lack of
actions and wrong actions, have consequences. As in "Pong," "Asteroids," "Sim City," "Unreal Tournament" and other games, if you screw up, you pay the price.
Why should VO be any diferent? What is the difference if you shoot a "player" or
an "NPC?" In the game, they are all in "contact" with their home base, and their
"nation" has an idea what they are doing and what happens to them. In my opinion,
this makes gameplay more complex and more interesting. There is no "free lunch,"
in real life or in gaming. This is a good idea.
actions and wrong actions, have consequences. As in "Pong," "Asteroids," "Sim City," "Unreal Tournament" and other games, if you screw up, you pay the price.
Why should VO be any diferent? What is the difference if you shoot a "player" or
an "NPC?" In the game, they are all in "contact" with their home base, and their
"nation" has an idea what they are doing and what happens to them. In my opinion,
this makes gameplay more complex and more interesting. There is no "free lunch,"
in real life or in gaming. This is a good idea.
phew!
Thanks for clearing that up momerath, I guess I can add one more player to my *take with a pinch of salt* list!
Thanks for clearing that up momerath, I guess I can add one more player to my *take with a pinch of salt* list!
What RattMann said (and very well said). Pirates (Corvus) may very well be tolerant of crime... but it doesn't at all mean that they're stupid, or the nicest faction in the galaxy.
To tell you the truth, as a pirate, I feel kindof miffed at the fact that anybody and their grandmother's dog can just casually fly into greyspace and dock at a Corvus station... whether they be docile trader or pirate-hating bounty hunter. I just don't feel that should happen so easily. You fight Corvus = Corvus don't like you.
I think a change would be good in our present universe ... although some people would obviously complain because they're so used to things. That's what happens when you have an old userbase.
So here's my suggestion - Make a dueling sector or sectors (preferably close to b8) that are completely unmonitored. People will still easily be able to have their pvp fests... but greyspace is still monitored to a certain degree. If you kill a Serco/Itani in greyspace, you're not going to lose much (if any) standing with them. You're certainly not going to lose standing with Corvus/Xang Xi... but if you are killing Corvus/Xang Xi/Pirates... there are definitely going to be consequences to that. I think it would be a good change to have players think before they fight.
To tell you the truth, as a pirate, I feel kindof miffed at the fact that anybody and their grandmother's dog can just casually fly into greyspace and dock at a Corvus station... whether they be docile trader or pirate-hating bounty hunter. I just don't feel that should happen so easily. You fight Corvus = Corvus don't like you.
I think a change would be good in our present universe ... although some people would obviously complain because they're so used to things. That's what happens when you have an old userbase.
So here's my suggestion - Make a dueling sector or sectors (preferably close to b8) that are completely unmonitored. People will still easily be able to have their pvp fests... but greyspace is still monitored to a certain degree. If you kill a Serco/Itani in greyspace, you're not going to lose much (if any) standing with them. You're certainly not going to lose standing with Corvus/Xang Xi... but if you are killing Corvus/Xang Xi/Pirates... there are definitely going to be consequences to that. I think it would be a good change to have players think before they fight.