I my self like knowing as soon as posible. And every one should know by now the planed release date and the real release date are not always the same dates.

From FM "I've suggested that they heavily exaggerate the time needed to release updates, but I think that the tasks expand to fit the deadline."

I agree with you FM. Could the developers say its expected within the next week instead of tommorrow? that way every knows it coming but some of the pressure is off and the developers can actually to thier job. Unless they like the pressure and rushing to put out something that isn't as good as it could be.

This is just like ship balancing.

If you don't tell people anything, then they start complaining about lack of feedback.

If you promise a date and then miss it, people complain about unfulfilled expectations.

If it was me, I'd just work on updates and only tell folks when it was about to be uploaded. Of course, long stretches with no updates would be annoying.

Perhaps the only way to solve this is with a daily blog of the day's activities, which will take time away from development. (Although this might be an interesting way to document the creation of the world's #1 MMORPG, once the devs look back on it in 2 years...)

I like the blog idea but don't really need to know. If you've ever been in the military, you learn two things:
1) Hurry up and wait.
2) I'll believe it when I see it.

Isn't it enough to know these guys are working their asses off to get these updates done right with too many variables between the test server and the production server. Is it too hard for some to understand what that means when it comes to announcements? They are telling us it appears ready then, something rears it's ugly head (besides ananzi).

pfff anannanzy...
what else is to suspect from such old linux basher like you are...

Fine,
"You'll get an UPDATE during your lifetime"

sarahanne: LOL Thats all i need thanks :)

I like the blog idea, but it does not need to be a daily thing. I just like to know where it's at. If they say they are stumped by a pile of code, I know not to expect anything for a while. What's frustrating is long spans of nothing, no communication, etc. It leaves people to wonder and end up getting frustrated. The devs have said that they would use their wiki site for this but as of yet have made 2 updates in almost a years time, with no relavent info, just some basic ship stuff and backstorys on the corps. Nothing on the game developement its self. Same with the "news" link on the side bar. They say they will update every other week with info, but they can't even seem to take 15min every two weeks to blurt something out.

It was also extremely irritating of them to release that image of the new TPG cap ship knowing that it would spaw more traffic to the site and game, and then do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING after that.

As is everyone else… I'm fully aware of the time that it take to develope things and make sure they are working, not only on the test server but also on the public one. With that said, there is no one there at Guild who is making them held accountable for anything, they just work as they please, release as they please, and yet we pay them for this? They should be accountable for releasing quality product on a timely manner. This has yet to happen. What other business do you know of where you can tell your clients that it will be done when we are ready?

I also understand that this is only a 4 man team, and that they do this out of a labor of love, and that is fine. But, Obviously they need MORE developers, or figure a better way to create a workflow that would allow player created content to be integrated with guilds content without the need of a dev and a few hours of extra reworking.

By catoring to the die-hard VO gamers Guild is only doing a disservice to themselves becasue no mater what the state of the game is in the die hards will always be around. Its the players that come and check out the demo, find that there is nothing to do and tell their friends that it's not worth it that you should worry about. More Players = More Money, More Money = More Employees, More Employees = More Updates, More Updates = More Content, More Content leads to More Players, …

flame on

/ignore thread "payment delayed"

Alrighty then...

/flame

Yah... JH it's funny you think that paying 10$ a month somehow makes you an investor. I got news for ya buddy, you're not an investor, you're a subscriber. Try making those demands on any other web board and you'd probably get laughed at. Don't take the devs' willingness to listen for granted.

THIS WAS A DEAD THREAD!!!!!!!!!

NO NEED TO BUMP A TROLL

ok, heres a flame....

take 1 part gasoline... add ignition source..

seriously john, if you feel that:
""__They should be accountable for releasing quality product on a timely manner. This has yet to happen. What other business do you know of where you can tell your clients that it will be done when we are ready?__""

please.. by all means cancel your subscription and give it a rest. people like you really are starting to piss me off. It's like anything else.. if you dont like the service you are recieving.. take your money elsewhere.

before you decide that the devs are out to screw you however, maybe you should have a clue what you are talking about.

visit
http://www.dreamcatchergames.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=40

its the dreamcatcher forum for a game called "dungeon lords". my copy is currently doing service as a set of coasters, and its barely able to do that. the game was released completely buggy, missing features that were promised on the box, and the devs have yet to make a single post on the site. they have relased 3 patches since it came out 5 months ago.. and those patches didnt even bring the game up to what was listed as features on the box.

keep in mind that dreamcatcher isnt a small gaming company.. its one of the major game publishers, and that attitude is FAR more the norm than what we get on this game, but if you arent happy with it, do us all a favor and just leave.

on most forums ananzi's original post would have been deleted or locked almost immediately.. and i've lost count of the threads that have been outright deleted from the dreamcatcher forum just because people wanted to know why they were sold a product that was completely buggy. most of the threads were perfectly civil and WAY less inflamatory that things that get posted here daily.. and the kicker is the devs REPLY to the incendiarism here, often with a calm explanation.

So let me get this straight, a subscriber dosn't have the right to expect promptness and quality from their provider? And as for the Dev's willingness to listen that's about all they do, sorry to say. They listen a lot and then do what they want when they want, just like every other company in this business, AND, they are worse because they lead you to believe that they are different when they are not. And I love that that's the only sentence out of that whole reply that you all seem to grip on me about, and I was not trolling, I was giving my opinion, which you are all so fond of giving too so STFU.

Again, the reason for the complaints is not that I don't like the game or the devs, it's that I DO like the game and the devs. If I did not care about it I already would be gone, but I'm not, I've been sitting on my hands waiting for an update of ANY kind for a long time now. I'm sorry if I'm not as patient as some of you are, or that I don't take enjoyment from sitting in a station and pretending to drink some made up alcohal. Not my style. And pvp for no other reason then pvp is just wasting time. So I'm back to voicing my frustrations here on the boards.

And the devs have changed since I've started playing back in Nov of '04, back then (and boy do I hate saying that, sound like an alpha player, ewww) the devs posted news regularly, there were minor changes almost weekly, and although there was little to do in game, you could see the universe changing before you very eyes. Now we go weeks on end without any word, unless you happen to be close to a guide that slips some tidbits in here and there. Then when they do announce something and implement it and it doesn't work we don't hear about it for a few more weeks. Anyway… I've said what I've got to say on this.

getting updates is a privelige not a right. read the EULA. you have the right to not give a damn about a poor product if you wish.

ta

Getting payed by me is also a privilage B) that works both ways.

Yes you are giving your opinion but you are doing it in an obnoxious and inflammatory manner. The people who talk the loudest often have the least to say.

And as for the Dev's willingness to listen that's about all they do, sorry to say. They listen a lot and then do what they want when they want, just like every other company in this business...

You couldn't be more wrong, my friend.
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/6580
Oct 14th I made that suggestion. Oct 16th it was implemented. Pretty amazing, if you ask me... not the suggestion itself but the fact that two freaking days after a player suggests something it gets implemented. This may not be the norm but name one other company or game where something of that nature is even remotely possible.

compared to most other games you GET a lot better quality here.

and grow up please.. STFU is NOT an argument.. its a childish whine.

Uhh. Look, it's my fault there hasn't been any newsposts lately. I try to say positive stuff there, and it's more difficult when things aren't working real well. I tried to get that across in my last newspost. I like the blog idea and stuff, but frankly, I'm having a hell of a time getting all my stuff done as it is. We already have outlets for that kind of thing (news/wiki) and I should just use them more.

A lot of what we post on news ends up on gaming sites. And I dislike reading "guild software having lisp scalability issue" on some random site. Hence the attempt at posting Good things. But, whatever, it doesn't really matter. I'll post more about how our crap is all broken.

The TPG ship thing.. I didn't want to post a final version until the total ship design was final. But, I still haven't gotten the final version from the artist, who has apparently been very busy with his real job (since we, clearly, are not paying him). I guess I shouldn't have released anything, but I wanted to show that *something* was going on with new artistic content. I didn't expect it to take this long.

As for the whole "oversight" comment.. the oversight is Me. We do the best we can. Sometimes, it doesn't work right. It can be depressing for us too, we're the ones actually putting IN all that time and labor, and then having it just.. not work right at all. If we were catering only to our die-hard players, then I would have switched everything back to like Vendetta Test 1.3.5 or something, like so many people seem to request. But no, we're moving forward. Come hell or high water, we're going forward.

Reviving angsty threads like this isn't helpful. If you're frustrated about.. our game, our lack of newsposts, whatever.. then send me an email. It's a lot more helpful. Posting on here to tell us how shameful it is that we can't release on time, just isn't terribly useful. Trust me, we would really love to release on time. If this stuff would work right, it'd be GREAT@!# Really!@#

I'm locking this thread. If people want to yell at me more on the topic, they can create new threads, or flame my inbox.