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More setup questions...
How the hell are you supposed to open up a browser these days, anyway? Spider suggested $BROWSER, but I've never seen anyone set that. There's probably some standard GNOME and KDE URL-launching methods, but I have to figure out which of those to use, and in lieu of Konqueror/whatever, where to find FireFox or... whatever.
Maybe I'll just get rid of the "Help" button.
Maybe I'll just get rid of the "Help" button.
Hmm the old gnome-1.* way was via the gnome-browser script/program(?), which launches the browser specified in control-center. But I think that's different now. I'll check that.
And yeah I haven't set $BROWSER either.
EDIT: oups the old way was gnome-moz-remote.
OK now it's done via gnome-open.
some related articles (I <3 google):
http://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/long_list.cgi?buglist=123284
http://www.catb.org/~esr/BROWSER/
via $BROWSER seems to be the recommended way.
And yeah I haven't set $BROWSER either.
EDIT: oups the old way was gnome-moz-remote.
OK now it's done via gnome-open.
some related articles (I <3 google):
http://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/long_list.cgi?buglist=123284
http://www.catb.org/~esr/BROWSER/
via $BROWSER seems to be the recommended way.
Hmm, so maybe I should do this:
- first try $BROWSER
- then try Gnome's "gnome_open <URL>"
- then try KDE "kfmclient openURL <url>"
- then tell the user to open the URL themselves, and to set $BROWSER next time.
There's just a problem if someone has both gnome and KDE installed and prefers to use konqueror. Also, if I reverse KDE and Gnome, then we have the opposite problem, which seems to be worse - konqueror doesn't seem to want to start unless some other KDE stuff is running, but my program might not know that it didn't work.
I guess in any case, everyone should set $BROWSER.
- first try $BROWSER
- then try Gnome's "gnome_open <URL>"
- then try KDE "kfmclient openURL <url>"
- then tell the user to open the URL themselves, and to set $BROWSER next time.
There's just a problem if someone has both gnome and KDE installed and prefers to use konqueror. Also, if I reverse KDE and Gnome, then we have the opposite problem, which seems to be worse - konqueror doesn't seem to want to start unless some other KDE stuff is running, but my program might not know that it didn't work.
I guess in any case, everyone should set $BROWSER.
I'd check what's currently running and use the corresponding(sp?) method.
If I'm not mistaken gnome-session sets $GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID when its used. You could check for that. It'd be quite unusal to run gnome-session in mostly KDE environment (if that's even possible). But somebody should verify this since I use GDM and it does a lot of weird session things.
KDE probably does something similar ... but I haven't used it since 1.0.1 :)
If I'm not mistaken gnome-session sets $GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID when its used. You could check for that. It'd be quite unusal to run gnome-session in mostly KDE environment (if that's even possible). But somebody should verify this since I use GDM and it does a lot of weird session things.
KDE probably does something similar ... but I haven't used it since 1.0.1 :)
heh. I don't really use KDE or Gnome, although I have a few of the gnome libs knocking around for compatibility... Most software I have blindly tries to run "netscape", "mozilla", or "firefox"...
In that case, don't forget about Opera. ;) Debian has it's own /etc/alternatives/x-www-browser symbolic link to whatever user/admin chose as the default graphical browser, but I guess using distro-specific solution is out of question.
In terms of $BROWSER, I don't have it set either, so asking user to do that might be a good idea. Or you could present user with the list of browsers found on his system.
In terms of $BROWSER, I don't have it set either, so asking user to do that might be a good idea. Or you could present user with the list of browsers found on his system.
HAH, I guess in the end the browser detection will make up half of the code in the updater ;)
Another thought:
What about letting the user choose the browser with a fileselector if none of the other methods work.
Another thought:
What about letting the user choose the browser with a fileselector if none of the other methods work.
TBH I don't actually know anyone that uses either Konqueror or Galeon. All my buds and I run either Mozilla or Firefox.
I think the best way to do this would be to have a textbox input somehwere that asks for the path to the browser executable (i.e. /usr/bin/mozilla).
This is how TransGaming has it set up in their Point2Play interface and I've never heard anyone complain that they didn't understand what to do with it.
Then all you have to do is pass the URL value to it (i.e. $browserPath http://vendetta-online.com ). This would keep it completely desktop-independent and would never require adjustment.
I think the best way to do this would be to have a textbox input somehwere that asks for the path to the browser executable (i.e. /usr/bin/mozilla).
This is how TransGaming has it set up in their Point2Play interface and I've never heard anyone complain that they didn't understand what to do with it.
Then all you have to do is pass the URL value to it (i.e. $browserPath http://vendetta-online.com ). This would keep it completely desktop-independent and would never require adjustment.
Turmoyl: You're not a gentoo'er, eh? :d We have long flames between the people that think mozilla deserves to die and KHTML should become the de facto king and those of us who believe KHTML is a smelly pile of dog do doo and gecko r0xx0rs.
Nah. It's not that I have anything against Gentoo, but it's more of a pain in the butt than it's worth to me. I think it's a great learning tool, but it's not an OS that I'd ever choose for a server, full-time workstation or gaming platform.
On almost every Linux-based, game-related forum I visit the Gentoo users have the largest amount of issues by far, some of them very obscure. I see time and time again a series of posts where Gentoo and/or Fedora users complain that something doesn't work, followed closely by a stream of posts from Mandrake, Debian and Slackware users saying that things work just fine for them. The proof is in the pudding. ;-)
As for browsers, I've always felt that - with the exception of IE, which just needs to die - it should be a user choice of which browser to use. As long as browsers follow standards they all turn out pretty much the same; all that changes are the features offered and the level of security. As such I never really get into browser debates because at the end of the day we each have our own sense of usability, security and comfortability. As long as the user is happy and their machine is not being compromised because of security flaws in the browser then that's all that matters.
On almost every Linux-based, game-related forum I visit the Gentoo users have the largest amount of issues by far, some of them very obscure. I see time and time again a series of posts where Gentoo and/or Fedora users complain that something doesn't work, followed closely by a stream of posts from Mandrake, Debian and Slackware users saying that things work just fine for them. The proof is in the pudding. ;-)
As for browsers, I've always felt that - with the exception of IE, which just needs to die - it should be a user choice of which browser to use. As long as browsers follow standards they all turn out pretty much the same; all that changes are the features offered and the level of security. As such I never really get into browser debates because at the end of the day we each have our own sense of usability, security and comfortability. As long as the user is happy and their machine is not being compromised because of security flaws in the browser then that's all that matters.
We have more problems mostly because most of us use far more advanced software. If you want, you can stick to a 100% x86 system and keep the stable versions. Or go to ~x86 and use the newer stuff (like kde3.3) which isn't beta, but isn't "stable enough" yet. Or you can use bmg packages and fill your harddrive with every gnome beta the second it comes out. And if you run lots of beta, you run into lots of bugs. :p
>> We have more problems mostly because most of us use far more advanced software.
*chuckle*
*chuckle*
advanced was the wrong word. Perhaps unstable would have fit better. I am not good at picking right word for occasion.
just a quick post..
gentoo has a gaming build which would more closely match what the fedora/etc guys have.
also, gentoo does not install the mountain of junk that comes with mandrake/fedora.
most guys are using the stock kernel as well and most new users don't realize they need to actually configure their kernel for their hardware.. I end up recommending to use the genkernel sources which really helps there.
not to mention, if you have a gentoo question you post a msg in the forums there and you will have an answer pretty quickly.
the gentoo approach in my op is much better that trying to upgrade/fix something in mandrake or fedora.. but then I am experienced, so I am sure I have a strong bias.
anyway, my point is, it is not like comparing macos to windows when comparing linux distro's.. the distro's are a flavor, we are all still running the linux kernel and some distro's do a good job of the initial setup.. gentoo leaves that to the user and assumes they know what to do..
gentoo has a gaming build which would more closely match what the fedora/etc guys have.
also, gentoo does not install the mountain of junk that comes with mandrake/fedora.
most guys are using the stock kernel as well and most new users don't realize they need to actually configure their kernel for their hardware.. I end up recommending to use the genkernel sources which really helps there.
not to mention, if you have a gentoo question you post a msg in the forums there and you will have an answer pretty quickly.
the gentoo approach in my op is much better that trying to upgrade/fix something in mandrake or fedora.. but then I am experienced, so I am sure I have a strong bias.
anyway, my point is, it is not like comparing macos to windows when comparing linux distro's.. the distro's are a flavor, we are all still running the linux kernel and some distro's do a good job of the initial setup.. gentoo leaves that to the user and assumes they know what to do..
Yep. I used gentoo to set up the server cluster boxes, but when the main server's disk died I didn't have time for a custom setup. fedora was a mistake but the CD was sitting there and it got the server back up.