At the moment it is almost impossible to avoid certain missiles. Instead of dumbing down the tracking systems, why not just add in countermeasures? Things that lead the missiles off or blow them up prematurely?

This is about the million'th time this topic has come up.

And probably the million'th time im going to agree, countermeasures would be cool.

Hey, it works for virtually every combat flight simulator out there, and its also a gaping hole in the vendetta universe too. If an enemy nation has seeking weapons, the defending nation WILL ALWAYS develop countermeasures. About that, there is no argument.

asphy

I wouldnt object to countermeasures as long as it was some kind of ammo based weapon system, maybe something that took up a small port. Having the ability to be immune to the missiles needs to be offset by something. also if the missile isnt in active homing mode then the countermeasuers shouldnt work, (eg the missile was "dumbfired" without a target lock.).

yeah, similar to todays existing chaff/flare idea, with perhaps chaff and flare launchers taking up a small port.

although the use of such countermeasures would still require some tactics, same as today.

asphy

I like asphyxia's idea of having them require some tactical employment to actually make them useful, as opposed to making them end-all missile stoppers. Taking up small ports and being ammunition based would likely introduce some changes in combat styles and tactics as well.

I'm completely against intruducing a weapon that takes no skill to use and is very powerful. At the moment the strongest weapons are so because they have the most room for player skill. Requiring everyone to have one less port on their ship to deal with every newb with a fire and forget don't look at target instant kill load out would kill game play.

What if you could get countermeasures, with limited ammo, that were avalible to all ship. Then you could also have an anti-missile system that is energy based, and would have a chance to destory incoming missles, this would take up a large slot, of only be avalible to ships large enough to have some kind of anti-missle turret thing.

You could make something like there was in X-Wing vs Tie-Fighter, a sort of mini-missile that homes onto missiles and destroys them.

I think the anti missile turret would be great for larger vessels (i.e. something that cant execute a sharp turn after deploying countermeasures). Yet again, i think any sort of automated tracking turret would be great, just imagine starting an attack run on a group of four large cargo vessels. Getting into about 1500m and watching the convoy errupt in a barrage of defence fire, energy bolts whizzing past your cockpit.

mmm...

With regards to eldrads post, the idea behind the countermeasures would be to basically make fire + forget weapons a little less devestating than they are now. Left face it, the only uses for FF weapons right now are to a) provide your enemy a distration, giving you a little more breathing space for either getting away, or lining up another couple of blasts. and b) taking out larger vessels that dont have the agility to dodge them.

With countermeasures, yeah, there would be skill there require to use them. I cant think of one pilot that wouldnt worry a little if they had an asraam on their tail, countermeasures or not. In the case of countermeasures, timing is the key. Follow the path of the incoming missile closely, wait until the time is right, deploy chaff/flare (for example, modern equivalents would be different ovbiously) and execute a sharp break.

The added benefit is that the missile would be destroyed, not given the chance to turn around and make another pass.

The idea behind requiring a small slot for the launcher would be that people dont like losing slots to "non offensive" weapons. It promotes learning/practice to dodge these things without countermeasures. It also promotes a balance between offence / defence that isnt orientated around your ship type or battery.

Dunno, just my two cents.

asphy

asphy I think you've missed the current state of missiles. No ship has the agility to dodge them. No matter what ship you're in you must turbo at about 90 degrees or more away from them. I totally agree that with homers the way they used to be implementing some countermeasures would be cool, though not worth it given the ammount of time the devs have to work with. But as they are now a countermeasure that takes up a weapon spot would kill gameplay. I don't think anyone is suggesting dumbing down the tracking system, but a1 did say they now turn too quickly since they turn earlier, so he probably will (and imo should) reduce the agility of homers.

imo; countermeasures would work like this: there would be different levels of them; and they wouldn't necassarily (typo) have to take up a port slot. the lower level (what say 1-5) would require effort on the pilot's part to dodge, shooting out something similar to a flare. the medium one (6-7) would shoot out multiple flares, but eat up ammunition real quick... the higher (8+) would shoot out much like Chaffs, making a cloud of anti-missile smoke behind the ship. This cloud would in affect blow up (or electromagnetically dud) the missiles. You could also have high level missiles or systems that counter the countermeasures; but that's another story...

Eldrad, yeah, you have a point there. And i havent been playing regularly for a while now so i've most likely missed a few things going on in the universe, I am basing these ideas on how the "old homers" used to perform.

Obviously this is not for the upcoming release either, "t3h d3v5" (=p) have far more important stuff to work on, I just think its time to start looking at improvements for Vendetta in its post-release state.

As for the weapon slot, we'll just agree to disagree there =p

Marskman, some nice ideas there, although im a firm believer in simplicity. I'd imagine a single "unit" that launches either chaff (for radar based homers) or flares (to counter gemini's) at the pilots descretion.

If we had the much asked about "utility slots" then they would be perfect. But im not rousing that topic again, for fear of a flame firestorm....

asphy

I favor the old but trusted rock/paper/scissors approach to combat: every weapon system has its countermeasure, to varying degrees of effectiveness. This will force some strategizing when it comes to configuring one's ship. Players will need to out-think as well as out-fight their opponents.