Forums » Suggestions
reputation reparations payments
I'm nost sure if this would be a good idea or not, but I thought that there should be a way to correct for the huge reputation losses associated with killing somebody in a sector where they are liked. Right now, even a single kill of a NT in 9 or 7 for example bans you from docking there forever. Given that it is possible to kill somebody by accident or in self defense, I thought it would be nice if instead of losing your rep immediately the mission computer asked you to pay reparations to the faction, in a way similar to when you fail lose cargo/datapods for cargo missions.
Now the reparations would have to be very high in order to still discourage griefing/piracy (over 100k for sure), and there should still be a loss of rep even if you pay, just not so dramatic.
Now the reparations would have to be very high in order to still discourage griefing/piracy (over 100k for sure), and there should still be a loss of rep even if you pay, just not so dramatic.
It's very hard to kill someone accidentally... I think the key words are "Self Defense."
If someone shoots you twice, I think the penalty for killing them in self defense should be reduced significantly, or even nullified.
As for the reparations idea, I like it, but I think it should require more than one mission, otherwise it would be too easy to hoard up a wealth of cash and repeatedly grief someone you don't like. Perhaps there would be missions available for that government that you could still take that would increase your standing a little (things no one else wants to do, like "take this radioactive waste to sector 18 and dump it"). So even though you couldn't dock at their stations you will still have the opportunity to win them back over little by little.
If someone shoots you twice, I think the penalty for killing them in self defense should be reduced significantly, or even nullified.
As for the reparations idea, I like it, but I think it should require more than one mission, otherwise it would be too easy to hoard up a wealth of cash and repeatedly grief someone you don't like. Perhaps there would be missions available for that government that you could still take that would increase your standing a little (things no one else wants to do, like "take this radioactive waste to sector 18 and dump it"). So even though you couldn't dock at their stations you will still have the opportunity to win them back over little by little.
I don't think reparations through wealth are a good idea, at least not in the case of serious crimes like murder.
Look at it this way, would you be happy if the real world justice system let you buy yourself out of a murder charge for a reasonable six figures?
Look at it this way, would you be happy if the real world justice system let you buy yourself out of a murder charge for a reasonable six figures?
Sometimes money can't buy you everything. Especially with justice. Self defense would be nice, where whomever fired first is responsible for the incident in a negative manner.
You stole this idea from my head, didn't you?
Anyway, I think that maybe the reparations should go to the person you killed, so griefing someone would actually get that person money, or else. ;P
Anyway, I think that maybe the reparations should go to the person you killed, so griefing someone would actually get that person money, or else. ;P
Celebrim: O.J. Simpson.
Anyhow, I think that a nation's willingness to be bought off should vary. For example, a KOS'd player trying to get back in the Neutrals' good graces could conceivably drop 10k or so in the pockets of each of the (?number?) counselors and see the KOS listing go away.
With Itani, I can see a blacklisted player joining them somehow and being drawn into their hive-mind or whatever. No KOS, but no free will.
With Serco you might be able to request a duel to the death with the aggreived party, which they had the honorable right to accept or deny. You die to them, and the KOS is lifted if they agree you fought well (to avoid issues with you just sitting and dying once to lose the KOS.)
Anyhow, I think that a nation's willingness to be bought off should vary. For example, a KOS'd player trying to get back in the Neutrals' good graces could conceivably drop 10k or so in the pockets of each of the (?number?) counselors and see the KOS listing go away.
With Itani, I can see a blacklisted player joining them somehow and being drawn into their hive-mind or whatever. No KOS, but no free will.
With Serco you might be able to request a duel to the death with the aggreived party, which they had the honorable right to accept or deny. You die to them, and the KOS is lifted if they agree you fought well (to avoid issues with you just sitting and dying once to lose the KOS.)
"Celebrim: O.J. Simpson."
Which just proves my point further.
The system isn't perfect yet, but the tools are coming into place. Maybe I should dig up my old reputation posts.
Which just proves my point further.
The system isn't perfect yet, but the tools are coming into place. Maybe I should dig up my old reputation posts.
Go for it. It'd be interesting.
Please don't verd. You've already made your opinion bout how the devs are going QUITE clear within 24 hours of it being released...
we actually had this discussion online the other night. The current problem with a "self defense" code is in cause and effect and the limitations of a binary language. it has no intuition, it cant ask witnesses what they thought it knows 0/1 off/on no/yes.
First we'll assume that by "self defense" you mean that the person the computer decides was attacked (the defender) doesn't take any reputation penalty, (or a very minimal one) if s/he kills the "attacker".
If you have the "self defense" activated only after the first hit, that leaves 2 exploits/problems.
1-griefer flies up to trader, lays down lots and lots of fire around trader intentionally missing. Trader jumps, turns, responds and hits griefer. griefer kills trader, but takes no reputation hit. as far as the system is concerned, he is the "defender" since he was hit first.
2-the "first hit" can be deadly, you cant respond untill you have taken damage, allowing a pirate or attacker the opportunity to line up a shot without taking return fire.
also how long does that "first hit" count as a provocation? 1 minute, 5, 10?
If you set self defense as a point where you try to determine who "fired" first, then that probably takes a large amount of code. If you restrict it to who fired at a targeted opponent, rockets that are aimed to miss can be used to ignore the algorithm, since they can be fired fairly accurately without a target selected.
Where do mines come into play in any of it. traders wouldnt be able to use them anymore. -Pirate A attacks trader he knows uses mines, trader lays mines, Pirate B rams a mine, takes damage, is considered a defender and kills trader, then splits cargo with pirate A.
just some thoughts.
First we'll assume that by "self defense" you mean that the person the computer decides was attacked (the defender) doesn't take any reputation penalty, (or a very minimal one) if s/he kills the "attacker".
If you have the "self defense" activated only after the first hit, that leaves 2 exploits/problems.
1-griefer flies up to trader, lays down lots and lots of fire around trader intentionally missing. Trader jumps, turns, responds and hits griefer. griefer kills trader, but takes no reputation hit. as far as the system is concerned, he is the "defender" since he was hit first.
2-the "first hit" can be deadly, you cant respond untill you have taken damage, allowing a pirate or attacker the opportunity to line up a shot without taking return fire.
also how long does that "first hit" count as a provocation? 1 minute, 5, 10?
If you set self defense as a point where you try to determine who "fired" first, then that probably takes a large amount of code. If you restrict it to who fired at a targeted opponent, rockets that are aimed to miss can be used to ignore the algorithm, since they can be fired fairly accurately without a target selected.
Where do mines come into play in any of it. traders wouldnt be able to use them anymore. -Pirate A attacks trader he knows uses mines, trader lays mines, Pirate B rams a mine, takes damage, is considered a defender and kills trader, then splits cargo with pirate A.
just some thoughts.
I think, perhaps, instead of per death, it should be per shot. Every time a shot hits its target, a tally is added to the record. When the battle in over (warping out, death, docking, logging off), the tallys are added to each sides rep. Maybe for self defence, it should be whoever shot the most in the first minute... I dunno.