Use touch accelerator as up/down accelerator, change the up/down accelerator controls to be the accelerator buttons, instead of removing the buttons altogether. I think if the option exists, it wouldn't be bad if that were the case in the future. Since what I'm suggesting isn't the default, using DroidButtons (plugin) on newer phones is becoming increasingly annoying.

I initially created a thread in the bugs section because I thought it might be a bug, but now that I know, I suggest posting it here without intending to bother the forum. Thanks for everything.

You can already do this. It's in Options>Advanced>Controls>Touch -- Use Touch Thottle[sic] as Strafe Up/Down

You don't understand my suggestion; when you press that option, there are no forward/reverse acceleration buttons.

I think it was my mistake, sorry.

Apologies for the confusion; I didn't explain myself clearly in the original post due to a mistake on my part. What I meant was that when setting "Acceleration Mode as Strafe Up/Down," the vertical strafe buttons (Up/Down) should be swapped with the forward/backward acceleration controls, rather than being hidden or removed entirely. My goal is to avoid having to rely on the DroidButtons plugin on newer phones, which is becoming increasingly difficult due to the restrictions on installing plugins on modern Android devices. I hope this clears things up!

Didn't we already do this thread like 6 months ago?

[edit]

Oh yeah, on the bugs forum tho, here for reference > https://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/2/39208

+ a lot though, I know Incarnate does not agree that having vertical strafe on touch is useful or better than having buttons for forwards or reverse (you can still accel etc with this option, as sliding up/down on the speed indicator also changes speed), but some find it better because well, it is. If the option worked as it is indicated, it gives a mobile user 360 degree of control. The forwards/back buttons should be replaced with up/down buttons when the option to use touch throttle as strafe up/down is active tho, as this is basically what the option means. Nice to have it in suggestions too, but it is a bug that it does not happen. Why have the option to use these buttons as strafe if you are just going to take the buttons away?

Having to use a 3rd party plugin that may or may not work on your device is silly when the option actually exists.

I didn't have any disagreement with the idea of not-removing the buttons and re-purposing them.

I know Incarnate does not agree that having vertical strafe on touch is useful or better than having buttons for forwards or reverse

Not exactly. I have maybe ~3 seconds to convince the average touch player to continue playing, after first startup. Having commonality with a lot of mobile FPS controls allows the game to be easier for on-boarding.

I did disagree with the early thread claim that vertical strafe is fundamentally "more effective" as a means of dodging than horizontal strafe. I can probably also prove that empirically with game data. But that isn't the point..

The point is that some people prefer a different control layout style, and I'm a huge believer in having lots of player-configurable options (within our development resource limits).

So, no opposition here. It just hasn't happened yet.

I've only suggested a small change to an option the game already offers, nothing more, nothing less. My intention isn't to ask for something supposedly better, because I never said it was, nor did I mean to imply anything of the sort. I simply believe it could be implemented in the way I'm suggesting for the existing option, and that it's not technically impossible. That's all, and thanks for everything, as always. Also, I think it's an interesting possibility for the throttle mode as Up/Down that's already in the game.

Sorry Inc, I was not meaning to sound argumentative but I will try to explain why I personally find it better, it is simply this - strafing one direction only is a sure fire way to eat flares; strafing from left to right is also a good way to eat flares and energy fire. Where-as strafing left to up to right is a great way to dodge that flare you saw coming. It _can_ be accomplished with rolls too, and I suspect you are right that this is what most players do, but advanced players are also aware that rolling decreases aim effectiveness. If I can still hit you when you cannot hit me I win.

Yes, you have the data, and data is great; but it is really no match for experience, and in my experience (using mobile with droid buttons), I die a lot less when I have access to all strafe directions. Sure, a feature only advanced players will use, and will still be no match for a full controller; but in my personal opinion it is better once learned.

Again, sorry if I sound a bit prick-ish, but we both know that is exactly what I am. Thank you for even considering this.

Sorry Inc, I was not meaning to sound argumentative but I will try to explain why I personally find it better, it is simply this - strafing one direction only is a sure fire way to eat flares

There are (practically) no bots with flares, man :). You're a PC vet, mistakenly trying to align a default mobile configuration argument to PvP (which I tried to explain above), while almost no mobile players encounter PvP (yes, some do, but statistically it's rare).

You are fundamentally not having the same conversation that I'm having, or that I was having back on Bugs.

And that's the point I've been trying to make here: I have no issue with adding more configuration options, which is what arzyayix is actually asking for. He was not asking for a default change.

However, I have had a variety of other people push back on having forward/reverse be the default mapping for "up/down" on touch, the Bugs thread was not at all the first discussion to engage around that topic..

As a result, I often have to respond to the "aggregate community" (both the "seen" and the "unseen" discussion; which is what was happening on Bugs).. because people will see some fragment of something that agrees with what they previously asked for, and be like "SEE?@!#" and I have to be broad enough to be like "No, this is not the same @#!$ing thing".

I also made a really specific distinction in that Bugs thread. I only limited the left-vs-right as a comparison to up-vs-down (not "having both"), because I've also had that pushback from people on the defaults ("if you pick only one axis, it should be up/down!"). So note that I said very specifically:

Strafing left-and-right is not more or less effective than strafing up-and-down. They're the same. PC players use all of them, of course, but in general the strafing "type" is less important than understanding the speed of your opponents shots, and keeping your motions "random" and difficult to predict by your adversary.

All of that is concretely true, within the explicit limits of what I stated. Again, I was responding to "which axis should be available" not "should all axes be available".

I don't lack for experience here.. I was one of the best PvP players for the first 3 or 4 years of live operations (but often not as "Incarnate"), and I invented rocket tossing. Of course having all axes, including up/down, is incredibly useful for PvP (on any control interface); having the most available axes to randomize response is invaluable. No PvP player would claim that "rolling" is a reasonable tradeoff.. even at a minimum configurable ramp-speed, the roll + strafe additive time would be a major disadvantage.

But that's not what I was saying.. the issue I was responding to was whether it should be default or not, for a very limited control set, and whether there was a disparity of value given only one axis available.

And.. no, it shouldn't be the default. Because that would make the game less accessible for new mobile players (most of whom never engage in PvP, have a very low attention span, and are very demanding of control defaults). Having something closer to PUBG and Genshin and other popular games (even though they are not space games) is more accessible.

So, anyway, if we just read what I actually wrote, I'm not sure anyone is disagreeing with anyone else here, and hopefully we can stop posting things like "I know Incarnate does not agree that having vertical strafe on touch is useful or better than having buttons for forwards or reverse" which is quite misleading to the rest of the community, especially when it comes to so-called "optional, advanced configurations".

I will also close with a hot take: I think PvP on touch is pretty limited and always will be. Yes, I'm aware there are a few people with claw-hand styles on custom droidbuttons setups who have done fairly well with it, and yes I know fully-custom touch setups have advantages over the defaults. But you're still going to get your ass handed to you by anyone who is really competent on PC. The only "real" option is a game controller, because of loss of "tactility" as a feedback mechanic on control-actuation is too great of a disadvantage to fully overcome. So, that's why I tell people who want to PvP on mobile to get a game controller. The alternative is setting them up for disappointment.

But, that all being said, I have absolutely no problem with trying to improve the configuration options to give people as many ways of personalizing things as possible (within the limits of our development time).

Noted and I'm 100% understanding now, thanks for the clarification!