Forums » Suggestions
Flechette Cannon Mk2
Suggestion: Drop the mass to 300kg.
Rationale: It fucking sucks in every possible scenario you could find yourself using it in try it out yourself fire up the game client and find out in 5 minutes instead of half-assing my suggestions out of fear of generating a whining shitstorm.
Impact on gameplay: It would still suck but it might suck less enough to be worth installing as a secondary weapon in niche cases to compliment an accurate energy efficient gun like the AAP/Neutron II/Raven.
Rationale: It fucking sucks in every possible scenario you could find yourself using it in try it out yourself fire up the game client and find out in 5 minutes instead of half-assing my suggestions out of fear of generating a whining shitstorm.
Impact on gameplay: It would still suck but it might suck less enough to be worth installing as a secondary weapon in niche cases to compliment an accurate energy efficient gun like the AAP/Neutron II/Raven.
why not change it enough to make it a good primary weapon?
Why do you think it's not a good primary weapon? I've been LOVING the fletchette, even before the previous buff. As much as i'd love for it to get another buff, realistically I don't think it needs one...
I've gotten good service out of the flechette mk2 even before the buff. I don't think I've bothered to mess with it since the buff, so I don't know how much better it is.
I've used it too for fun engagements but it has glaring shortcomings compared to practically any small-port blaster.
Despite the level reqs/price it does worse than the HX blaster and much much worse than an xgx/tpg sparrow phase blaster in identical engagements and it does way way worse than any of the neutron blasters.
It's useless in chases, has piss poor dps/dpe, and is absolutely massive relative to how it performs, thus dropping the mass to make it a good "port filler" similar to the place the xgx would give it a proper place in pewpew.
The recent buff can hardly one it saw a mass reduction drop from 600kg to 500kg it's still abhorrently heavy and still sucks hard relative to the good small port blasters.
The only way it wouldn't suck would be if every shot fired 2 projectiles dropping the mass is the easiest way to make it more viable without risking making it the best close quarter weapon in the game.
Despite the level reqs/price it does worse than the HX blaster and much much worse than an xgx/tpg sparrow phase blaster in identical engagements and it does way way worse than any of the neutron blasters.
It's useless in chases, has piss poor dps/dpe, and is absolutely massive relative to how it performs, thus dropping the mass to make it a good "port filler" similar to the place the xgx would give it a proper place in pewpew.
The recent buff can hardly one it saw a mass reduction drop from 600kg to 500kg it's still abhorrently heavy and still sucks hard relative to the good small port blasters.
The only way it wouldn't suck would be if every shot fired 2 projectiles dropping the mass is the easiest way to make it more viable without risking making it the best close quarter weapon in the game.
"The only way it wouldn't suck would be if every shot fired 2 projectiles dropping the mass is the easiest way to make it more viable without risking making it the best close quarter weapon in the game."
I think you are being way to conservative in this concern you posted spidey. By definition this SHOULD actually be the best close quarters weapon in the game. It is in fact the only weapon that by it's very stats is geared toward close quarters. I think much of the problem with this weapon is indeed it's weight (thanks for the recent buff).. maybe it should indeed be reduced more since it requires you to be so close for it to be useful and you can't be close in a heavy ship or you will just die. I recall in the original suggestion that resulted in a weight change that players actually suggested a much lower weight and Incarnate chose to make a milder change instead and "see how that does". Maybe now we have tried and agree that it could use a little more reduction.
You could also increase the damage done by the rounds.. it is pretty weak, requiring the user to survive a very long "death by a million cuts" type battle. There is also the problem that many of the shots won't hit when you expect them too.. this could be due to rapid fire rates vs network stability.. or the amount of spread between rounds which is hard to see without a tracer on the projectile. With that in mind, reducing the spread of it's projectiles by just a tad could also help this weapon be more viable instead of mostly a novelty.
I think you are being way to conservative in this concern you posted spidey. By definition this SHOULD actually be the best close quarters weapon in the game. It is in fact the only weapon that by it's very stats is geared toward close quarters. I think much of the problem with this weapon is indeed it's weight (thanks for the recent buff).. maybe it should indeed be reduced more since it requires you to be so close for it to be useful and you can't be close in a heavy ship or you will just die. I recall in the original suggestion that resulted in a weight change that players actually suggested a much lower weight and Incarnate chose to make a milder change instead and "see how that does". Maybe now we have tried and agree that it could use a little more reduction.
You could also increase the damage done by the rounds.. it is pretty weak, requiring the user to survive a very long "death by a million cuts" type battle. There is also the problem that many of the shots won't hit when you expect them too.. this could be due to rapid fire rates vs network stability.. or the amount of spread between rounds which is hard to see without a tracer on the projectile. With that in mind, reducing the spread of it's projectiles by just a tad could also help this weapon be more viable instead of mostly a novelty.
Rationale: It fucking sucks in every possible scenario you could find yourself using it in try it out yourself fire up the game client and find out in 5 minutes instead of half-assing my suggestions out of fear of generating a whining shitstorm.
Apparently it sucks so much that half the respondents, thus far, don't agree with you.
I don't mind discussing nerfs or buffs or whatever, that's fine.. that's the point; but this kind of horseshit toxic editorializing is exactly what we don't want. People are supposed to be respectful, of everyone (not just me).
You know what I don't really care about? "Whining shitstorms". I mean, I can just stop reading those and walk away.
You know what I do care about? Unforeseen balance issues due to changes, that lead to exploitative ramifications and secondary problems, which then soak up major development resources.. and we've had a lot of those, in the past year, that took weeks to fix all the "other" problems that came up. NPCs use these same weapons. NPCs with behaviour tuned around given loadout mass parameters. And that's just one of a dozen other secondary issues.
I've learned to make fairly "conservative" changes the way I do from experience, and I don't value your accusatory input on the subject, Spidey. You could certainly have asked for further changes without being a dick about it.
So, I'm muting you on this thread. Someone else can defend your point of view. If you do something like this again, I'm booting you off Suggestions entirely.
Learn how to behave like a reasonable adult, or go play a different game.
Apparently it sucks so much that half the respondents, thus far, don't agree with you.
I don't mind discussing nerfs or buffs or whatever, that's fine.. that's the point; but this kind of horseshit toxic editorializing is exactly what we don't want. People are supposed to be respectful, of everyone (not just me).
You know what I don't really care about? "Whining shitstorms". I mean, I can just stop reading those and walk away.
You know what I do care about? Unforeseen balance issues due to changes, that lead to exploitative ramifications and secondary problems, which then soak up major development resources.. and we've had a lot of those, in the past year, that took weeks to fix all the "other" problems that came up. NPCs use these same weapons. NPCs with behaviour tuned around given loadout mass parameters. And that's just one of a dozen other secondary issues.
I've learned to make fairly "conservative" changes the way I do from experience, and I don't value your accusatory input on the subject, Spidey. You could certainly have asked for further changes without being a dick about it.
So, I'm muting you on this thread. Someone else can defend your point of view. If you do something like this again, I'm booting you off Suggestions entirely.
Learn how to behave like a reasonable adult, or go play a different game.
There is definitely a lacking of high-level unaimed spray-type weapons in this game. The flechette and the gat HV could definitely use some love.
Make the new weapons a different variant, NPC problem solved.
Maybe Incarnate can share some concerns about boosting this particular weapon type that we might not be aware of so we can better understand the problems?
Make the new weapons a different variant, NPC problem solved.
Maybe Incarnate can share some concerns about boosting this particular weapon type that we might not be aware of so we can better understand the problems?
Maybe Incarnate can share some concerns about boosting this particular weapon type that we might not be aware of so we can better understand the problems?
I don't have any particular problem with making modifications. My commentary was on why, generally speaking, I may tend to make small changes, multiple times, instead of one-time larger changes. It's a lot easier to react to unforeseen problems when doing that.
There also tends to be less "overshoot" and buff-nerf-buff-nerf, if one approaches a balance point more slowly, getting feedback in the interim.
Ie, my response was that I was not "half-assing (spidey's) suggestions out of fear of generating a whining shitstorm". It was not specific to this weapon.
I don't have any particular problem with making modifications. My commentary was on why, generally speaking, I may tend to make small changes, multiple times, instead of one-time larger changes. It's a lot easier to react to unforeseen problems when doing that.
There also tends to be less "overshoot" and buff-nerf-buff-nerf, if one approaches a balance point more slowly, getting feedback in the interim.
Ie, my response was that I was not "half-assing (spidey's) suggestions out of fear of generating a whining shitstorm". It was not specific to this weapon.