Forums » Suggestions
capship sightings should be relayed to owner in same system and group if in group. +1
+1
.. then we can get four friends together, drop our capships in every station nfz in a system and monitor the entire system without even being there or having the complications of bot detection and reporting.
its one thing to have lua already making surveillance possible.. its another thing to build it right into the default client. capships have historically been used to advantage already as 'motion sensors' of sorts by leaving them off radar in a sector of interest. as the sector activates by players arriving it would trigger the capship to enter/leave your group alerting people to activity in the sector.. great for F6 and conq stations.
sounds awesome. -1
its one thing to have lua already making surveillance possible.. its another thing to build it right into the default client. capships have historically been used to advantage already as 'motion sensors' of sorts by leaving them off radar in a sector of interest. as the sector activates by players arriving it would trigger the capship to enter/leave your group alerting people to activity in the sector.. great for F6 and conq stations.
sounds awesome. -1
SK got a point. -1
+100
This is obviously functionally logical. I disagree with the opposing view because using it this way does still put your capship in danger of attack. Also please note that "spotter bots" operate on a mechanism that was put in place by developers and that mechanism can be modified or removed at any time regardless of the issue of capships. If incarnate wants to toss around ideas to get a handle on spotter bots, that could be a different thread where people who actually write plugins (like myself) can offer genuinely effective suggestions.
1. It is perfectly logical that if you can communicate back and forth with your capship, it should also be able to tell you what it's sensors detect.
2. The investment of time and money required for producing a capship warrants perks and advantages like these. Otherwise it's nothing more than "just a bigger ship" and justification for the effort continues to erode.
3. Reduces multi-boxing and other hacks that undermine devs intentions by putting it in the devs control. How many times to people say "if you want to control something, legalize it and become the sole regulatory power over it." .
This is obviously functionally logical. I disagree with the opposing view because using it this way does still put your capship in danger of attack. Also please note that "spotter bots" operate on a mechanism that was put in place by developers and that mechanism can be modified or removed at any time regardless of the issue of capships. If incarnate wants to toss around ideas to get a handle on spotter bots, that could be a different thread where people who actually write plugins (like myself) can offer genuinely effective suggestions.
1. It is perfectly logical that if you can communicate back and forth with your capship, it should also be able to tell you what it's sensors detect.
2. The investment of time and money required for producing a capship warrants perks and advantages like these. Otherwise it's nothing more than "just a bigger ship" and justification for the effort continues to erode.
3. Reduces multi-boxing and other hacks that undermine devs intentions by putting it in the devs control. How many times to people say "if you want to control something, legalize it and become the sole regulatory power over it." .
-1 , Agrees with "ScotiaKnight" :- it removes the fun to manually find players.
So, spotter bots are well-known, they are not a new problem. We've made some recent changes to make them less effective, and we'll be continuing to make more changes until they cease to exist.
---Incarnate
So, spotter bots are well-known, they are not a new problem. We've made some recent changes to make them less effective, and we'll be continuing to make more changes until they cease to exist.
---Incarnate
you can guarantee those ships wont be placed anywhere that puts them in legitimate danger. they will be placed in dau and other magic systems, in nfz's, and used to harass new players. they wont be attacked any more then, than they are now, which is almost never. thats literally the OPS whole playbook. all kinds of fluff excuses to benefit pirates. it benefits no one else.
This makes sense. I think that suggestion has been made before. As a compromise (due to SK's concerns), limit the range the un piloted capship can detect to maybe 2.5k . No more than 5k.
+1
+1
I think the "spotter bot" issue is a different issue altogether. I say this recognizing that I currently manage plugins that send "player seen" events/data to other players using the plugin, which can be used by an unattended client, effectively making it a "spotter bot". I have also run multiple clients on my desktop to utilize that feature on both my "nefarious pirate" character as well as my "money oriented trade character". The value of knowing the location of other players in the game is a benefit to all character types and plugins have been filling the gap for adding this functionality to the game for over a decade. However, I still believe that this is not only practical but logical in terms of maintaining as much realism as the game can muster as well as servicing the idea that your progression in the game should enable new perks, this gives the game depth and keeps people playing.
.. and I'll say it again, building the feature into the game would allow it to be managed by the devs instead of plugin writers. With every implementation of common plugin code into the game, that feature can be disabled in the plugin system therefore giving the game developers control without removing the feature. Incarnate/raybondo could have removed access to the "playerseen" event made available via LUA years ago, they could have set limits on it as well, it isn't that hard to do. I imagine the big question is how to do it without sacrificing other functionalities in the game that have been provided through the plugin system...but none of those questions have anything to do with reading your capship sensors or sending/receiving data to and from your capship which is partially implemented already anyway. In fact it would have almost no effect on the "spotter bot" issue at all.
.. and I'll say it again, building the feature into the game would allow it to be managed by the devs instead of plugin writers. With every implementation of common plugin code into the game, that feature can be disabled in the plugin system therefore giving the game developers control without removing the feature. Incarnate/raybondo could have removed access to the "playerseen" event made available via LUA years ago, they could have set limits on it as well, it isn't that hard to do. I imagine the big question is how to do it without sacrificing other functionalities in the game that have been provided through the plugin system...but none of those questions have anything to do with reading your capship sensors or sending/receiving data to and from your capship which is partially implemented already anyway. In fact it would have almost no effect on the "spotter bot" issue at all.
it would have an effect. it would make it easy and sanctioned. a person with two capships could be in three places at once with zero effort and a single device.
disable it entirely at station sectors and im +100 right behind you. if some of you guys would get on the case of the wanna-be pirates and have them show shred of honor it would be a non issue. most pirates have standards and know where the line is.. but there are clearly some who dont. it only takes one.
theres no excuse to be riding on day 1 players for hours relentlessly. its disgraceful and should be treated as such. it brings shame on all pirates. i raised four players this week from 0 and i had to intervene on behalf of every single one of them so far on more than one occassion.
trident vs ec, trident vs revenant, trident vs atlas mk1.. let players grow up and youll have a prosperous hunting ground. the game is on life support guys.. im not worried about myself. im not hard to find.
disable it entirely at station sectors and im +100 right behind you. if some of you guys would get on the case of the wanna-be pirates and have them show shred of honor it would be a non issue. most pirates have standards and know where the line is.. but there are clearly some who dont. it only takes one.
theres no excuse to be riding on day 1 players for hours relentlessly. its disgraceful and should be treated as such. it brings shame on all pirates. i raised four players this week from 0 and i had to intervene on behalf of every single one of them so far on more than one occassion.
trident vs ec, trident vs revenant, trident vs atlas mk1.. let players grow up and youll have a prosperous hunting ground. the game is on life support guys.. im not worried about myself. im not hard to find.
Once again: Please review the rules for suggestions: https://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/37508
Of particular importance is Rule#5. OP did not provide. Later statements that is "logical" are not useful arguments for game design. How does the suggestion enhance the the game?
Of particular importance is Rule#5. OP did not provide. Later statements that is "logical" are not useful arguments for game design. How does the suggestion enhance the the game?
whistler,
I was clear to all of us... the OP is clearly asking that player capships relay playerseen events to their owner. Meaning if a capship is parked in one sector and the owner is elsewhere, it would send some type of notification to the owner what players have arrived in sector with it. Scotiaknight vehemently disagrees.. but the OP is pretty clear on intent.
I was clear to all of us... the OP is clearly asking that player capships relay playerseen events to their owner. Meaning if a capship is parked in one sector and the owner is elsewhere, it would send some type of notification to the owner what players have arrived in sector with it. Scotiaknight vehemently disagrees.. but the OP is pretty clear on intent.
ScotiaKnight,
It is next to impossible to torture day old players anymore... nfz restrictions, also inability to attack same nation, severe.. and I do mean severe faction repercussions have made this impractical and not a practice of pirate players in the game for a very long time now. The only people who believe this actually happens are those who create a new alt and due to their knowledge of the game, take that new character and go places and do things the game tries to prevent new players from doing. Many recent instances of such a thing I have now discovered were not new players at all, but alts of old players who just wanted to stir the pot. Pirate/nefarious character types are the most difficult type to play effectively in VO due in large part to restrictions made to prevent griefing of new players.
However, this is all cart before horse. It is not just pirate players that relay data to their team mates regarding player location. The first such plugin was written by a trade guild and that same code proliferated out to the other plugins that exist for the same purpose today. It is information that is quite valuable to people who mine, manufacture, trade.. and in fact is more valuable to them than any other player type. Let's not pretend that you don't also tell your team mates where some other player is located. The automation of that functionality is possible because of the LUA plugin system and removing it out right would disable many other widely used plugins that you yourself enjoy. The OP is not just for pirates, it is for everyone who values that type of information and that should also include yourself as a capship owner. What a great benefit it would be to you also if you could park your capship strategically and know when a pirate is making their way towards you while your mining or manufacturing. It is a feature that would be great for everyone indeed.
It is next to impossible to torture day old players anymore... nfz restrictions, also inability to attack same nation, severe.. and I do mean severe faction repercussions have made this impractical and not a practice of pirate players in the game for a very long time now. The only people who believe this actually happens are those who create a new alt and due to their knowledge of the game, take that new character and go places and do things the game tries to prevent new players from doing. Many recent instances of such a thing I have now discovered were not new players at all, but alts of old players who just wanted to stir the pot. Pirate/nefarious character types are the most difficult type to play effectively in VO due in large part to restrictions made to prevent griefing of new players.
However, this is all cart before horse. It is not just pirate players that relay data to their team mates regarding player location. The first such plugin was written by a trade guild and that same code proliferated out to the other plugins that exist for the same purpose today. It is information that is quite valuable to people who mine, manufacture, trade.. and in fact is more valuable to them than any other player type. Let's not pretend that you don't also tell your team mates where some other player is located. The automation of that functionality is possible because of the LUA plugin system and removing it out right would disable many other widely used plugins that you yourself enjoy. The OP is not just for pirates, it is for everyone who values that type of information and that should also include yourself as a capship owner. What a great benefit it would be to you also if you could park your capship strategically and know when a pirate is making their way towards you while your mining or manufacturing. It is a feature that would be great for everyone indeed.
-1
no stations would be perfect. wormholes would be the only real useful place outside of being a defensive option and knowing whos around your ship.. cos at wormholes they arent going to be safe unattended. at very least they will get burned to 4% as an inconvenience.
plus theres plenty of key areas where wormholes and stations co-exist..
plus theres plenty of key areas where wormholes and stations co-exist..
I think "no stations" is a reasonable compromise.. or perhaps no nation space stations is even more reasonable.. put the capship at risk as a price to pay for the service, makes sense to me certainly. Since you can't fire in NFZ of nation stations I do get it.. or maybe it doesn't send the data if it's parked in the NFZ or too far out from a station, that might be an option as well. I'm even indifferent at the idea of removing the faction repercussions of destroying a capship that has been unattended for a certain amount of time.
Why is it a big deal to fly chase/combat ships & manually look out for players instead of leaving several VO clients opened to spot others or asking developers to allow spotting through capships....
Some recent game changes have already made things too easy where a player can see who is online in game via relay. Players getting station under attack notification while offline etc.
Some recent game changes have already made things too easy where a player can see who is online in game via relay. Players getting station under attack notification while offline etc.
"whistler,
I was clear to all of us."
Yes I can read the suggestion and the subsequent posts.
It does not satisfy the rules for posting. As the moderator for the forums it is part of my job to assist posters to make suggestions that are at least close to the format that Incarnate has requested. What we have so far is a suggestion that is not well supported by the OP, which reduces the likelihood of the devs will spend time parsing through all the other posts in the thread. Inc made a lengthy thread with 12 rules - I think it's probably important to him that we follow them.
I was clear to all of us."
Yes I can read the suggestion and the subsequent posts.
It does not satisfy the rules for posting. As the moderator for the forums it is part of my job to assist posters to make suggestions that are at least close to the format that Incarnate has requested. What we have so far is a suggestion that is not well supported by the OP, which reduces the likelihood of the devs will spend time parsing through all the other posts in the thread. Inc made a lengthy thread with 12 rules - I think it's probably important to him that we follow them.
This is a good idea IMO, with the nerfs haxmeister and We all float suggested. Reduced range, unable to detect the ship, not allowed in station sectors and with a "Kill Permission" after say 20 mins of idle time. However this kill permission will not be visible to other players, so they won't know whether killing it will have factional repurcussions or not. It will be hidden from everyone but the owner.
+1 with stated changes.
+1 with stated changes.
I made a suggestion a few years back, that a capital ship's F/A be turned off (brakes) after 30 minutes or so. If that happened, people could push the offending spotting capital ship outside of spotting range. Problem solved.
Plus, now that ships can be set to auto follow the owner, the owner won't be inconvenienced when it comes to retrieving it.
Plus, now that ships can be set to auto follow the owner, the owner won't be inconvenienced when it comes to retrieving it.