Forums » Suggestions
Everyone here knows that people have more credits than they should due to blatant abuse of static trades over the course of several years. Incarnate, do you have any plans on how to fight this? There are players out there with billions of credits, and I don't think things were intended to be this way. It's actually very discouraging to see something like this, and it kind of makes the game stale.
I suggest that measures should be taken to remove this money out of the game, not directly as it would probably cause too much trouble, but maybe increase the prices of in-game items? I don't know, I'm open to suggestions since the amount of money people have put together is insane.
I suggest that measures should be taken to remove this money out of the game, not directly as it would probably cause too much trouble, but maybe increase the prices of in-game items? I don't know, I'm open to suggestions since the amount of money people have put together is insane.
You, apparently, haven't seen my bank balance...
Not everyone has exorbitant amounts of cash on hand... raising the prices for everything would merely screw the non-cash rich and send the economy into a spiral of misery and pain for the average player.
-1 to increased prices.
Is someone abusing their stockpile of funds? What behaviors are you seeing that lead you to believe this is truly an issue? Let's address bad behavior, without punishing those that aren't behaving badly.
Not everyone has exorbitant amounts of cash on hand... raising the prices for everything would merely screw the non-cash rich and send the economy into a spiral of misery and pain for the average player.
-1 to increased prices.
Is someone abusing their stockpile of funds? What behaviors are you seeing that lead you to believe this is truly an issue? Let's address bad behavior, without punishing those that aren't behaving badly.
I totally Agree with piment , some players managed to get billions of credits via exploits/Bugs. They filled their pockets long ago & they are hoarding it , they already got a trident - all they does is shoot newbies in greyspace or keep making the suggestions which makes it more hard for the newbies.
Like just for example - Some rats are pushing for economy change because they infini mined and stocked thousands of ores in past & they even got all those high end licenses/Badges easy.
I know it's very hard to find who did what exactly what & it's alot of dev's precious time waste but atleast devs shouldn't listen to them and imply all their suggestions , just like Economy change it will benefit all those exploiters who stocked ores via infini mining.
Like just for example - Some rats are pushing for economy change because they infini mined and stocked thousands of ores in past & they even got all those high end licenses/Badges easy.
I know it's very hard to find who did what exactly what & it's alot of dev's precious time waste but atleast devs shouldn't listen to them and imply all their suggestions , just like Economy change it will benefit all those exploiters who stocked ores via infini mining.
You have not pointed out how having billions of credits gives someone an advantage. Where would you spend it? There is nothing in-game that costs anywhere near a billion.
You have also not pointed out how the game has been made stale with some people having billions of credits. If anything, they infuse the economy by buying stuff.
Why are ores even coming into the picture? How are you being inhibited by Infini mining being removed from certain asteroids? You can always mine the tons of other roids that exist in the game.
You have also not pointed out how the game has been made stale with some people having billions of credits. If anything, they infuse the economy by buying stuff.
Why are ores even coming into the picture? How are you being inhibited by Infini mining being removed from certain asteroids? You can always mine the tons of other roids that exist in the game.
"You have not pointed out how having billions of credits gives someone an advantage. Where would you spend it? There is nothing in-game that costs anywhere near a billion."
Having Billions of credits are giving them advantage over everything , they don't need to trade , mine , Manufacture or need conquerable stations anymore , All they does is shoot newbies & only suggest the things which only benefits them
"Why are ores even coming into the picture? How are you being inhibited by Infini mining being removed from certain asteroids? You can always mine the tons of other roids that exist in the game."
Ores are coming into the picture because of recent Rats who are pushing devs for this Economy change , Devs Removed infini mining which is a good thing - but never took the action against the people who infini mined & stocked ores.
It is our duty to let devs know why exactly Rats are pushing for it.
&
You won't be able to mine because those exploiters got everything and will continue to shoot other player mining ships , everyone knows the Asteroid locations or They will just Boil the Asteroids above 100-150k temperature.( it takes 8+hours for roid to cool down , they will just shoot the players when they're online and make sure to boil roids before they sleep)
Everyone knows most of the players can open 4 + accounts at same time , they will place all those mining bots to boil roids.
The only way to get ores will be to buy the ores from Exploiters , the ores which they stocked from infini mining & they will charge any price for it and get further benefit from this
Having Billions of credits are giving them advantage over everything , they don't need to trade , mine , Manufacture or need conquerable stations anymore , All they does is shoot newbies & only suggest the things which only benefits them
"Why are ores even coming into the picture? How are you being inhibited by Infini mining being removed from certain asteroids? You can always mine the tons of other roids that exist in the game."
Ores are coming into the picture because of recent Rats who are pushing devs for this Economy change , Devs Removed infini mining which is a good thing - but never took the action against the people who infini mined & stocked ores.
It is our duty to let devs know why exactly Rats are pushing for it.
&
You won't be able to mine because those exploiters got everything and will continue to shoot other player mining ships , everyone knows the Asteroid locations or They will just Boil the Asteroids above 100-150k temperature.( it takes 8+hours for roid to cool down , they will just shoot the players when they're online and make sure to boil roids before they sleep)
Everyone knows most of the players can open 4 + accounts at same time , they will place all those mining bots to boil roids.
The only way to get ores will be to buy the ores from Exploiters , the ores which they stocked from infini mining & they will charge any price for it and get further benefit from this
Yeah, they got their money from trading, why would they need to trade again? It's not like they haxed the game into giving them the money.
If your argument is static routes, so many people have exploited it at this point that punishing everyone for it will just cripple the game.
They still need conquerable stations. Money can't buy that.
I agree action should have been taken against those who infini mined, but how will you identify them? And how will you punish them? Infini mining too has been exploited for a long time by a lot of players. If GS can identify exploiters and clear out their stocks of exploited ores, i'd happily +1 that.
If your argument is static routes, so many people have exploited it at this point that punishing everyone for it will just cripple the game.
They still need conquerable stations. Money can't buy that.
I agree action should have been taken against those who infini mined, but how will you identify them? And how will you punish them? Infini mining too has been exploited for a long time by a lot of players. If GS can identify exploiters and clear out their stocks of exploited ores, i'd happily +1 that.
They can't punish them or find everyone exactly who exploited but they can atleast stop implementing their suggestions which Benefits all the exploiters.
I don't have any problem with devs , there is currently only 2 devs & they're doing their best , that is Support tickets , Fixing Bugs , Working on new content and much more , this is the best space combat mmorpg ever.
But i have problem with those toxic Exploiters who run their mouth in 100 after killing newbies ( when they try to grind ) and keep Suggesting the stuff in suggestions under various alts which only benefits them.
I don't have any problem with devs , there is currently only 2 devs & they're doing their best , that is Support tickets , Fixing Bugs , Working on new content and much more , this is the best space combat mmorpg ever.
But i have problem with those toxic Exploiters who run their mouth in 100 after killing newbies ( when they try to grind ) and keep Suggesting the stuff in suggestions under various alts which only benefits them.
This thread has gone stupid.
Infinimining... The only way to get ores will be to buy the ores from them , the ores which they got from infini mining & they will charge any price for it and get further benefit from this
... really?
No. The devs fixed infinimining. Move on. Boiling every 'roid in the universe? Sure. Go ahead and try.
I understand Piment's concerns, I just disagreed with his proposed method. Again, if there are people behaving badly, let's address the bad behavior. Stop trying to propose global actions that serve no purpose other than to punish the people that actually play when the game isn't free.
I get it. There are players that have "billions" banked. If the devs want to know which players have billions, I'm sure they can select * from players where dolladollayall=billions ... apparently there are so many cheaters, they may want to add a limit 10 or something, or they may start a never ending query.
Get over it, get on with it. If the game is stale, it's stale for the ones that "have billions"... not for those of us for whom the struggle is real.
If you have empirical evidence then produce it, so we can ask Inc and Ray to 1) fix the loophone/cheat, 2) punish the offender or 3) accept the situation and tell us to just deal with it (i.e. turret bots)
Infinimining... The only way to get ores will be to buy the ores from them , the ores which they got from infini mining & they will charge any price for it and get further benefit from this
... really?
No. The devs fixed infinimining. Move on. Boiling every 'roid in the universe? Sure. Go ahead and try.
I understand Piment's concerns, I just disagreed with his proposed method. Again, if there are people behaving badly, let's address the bad behavior. Stop trying to propose global actions that serve no purpose other than to punish the people that actually play when the game isn't free.
I get it. There are players that have "billions" banked. If the devs want to know which players have billions, I'm sure they can select * from players where dolladollayall=billions ... apparently there are so many cheaters, they may want to add a limit 10 or something, or they may start a never ending query.
Get over it, get on with it. If the game is stale, it's stale for the ones that "have billions"... not for those of us for whom the struggle is real.
If you have empirical evidence then produce it, so we can ask Inc and Ray to 1) fix the loophone/cheat, 2) punish the offender or 3) accept the situation and tell us to just deal with it (i.e. turret bots)
Like i said
It is our duty to let devs know their intentions behind the Economy Update which rats are pushing incarnate for.
"Stop trying to propose global actions that serve no purpose other than to punish the people that actually play when the game isn't free"
It doesn't make it okay to Exploit the game if you pay for the game or Joined early.
ROC clearly mentions:- "You will not exploit any bug in Vendetta Online and you will not communicate the existence of any such exploitable bug (bugs that grant the user unnatural or unintended benefits in game), either directly or through public posting, to any other user of Vendetta Online. You will promptly report any such bug via the bug report form at https://www.vendetta-online.com/x/bugreport"
It's very time consuming to figure out who did , what , when , where ? I know that and i'm not asking devs to perma ban them .
But dev's shouldn't implement the suggestions which benefits the exploiters more from the past.
It is our duty to let devs know their intentions behind the Economy Update which rats are pushing incarnate for.
"Stop trying to propose global actions that serve no purpose other than to punish the people that actually play when the game isn't free"
It doesn't make it okay to Exploit the game if you pay for the game or Joined early.
ROC clearly mentions:- "You will not exploit any bug in Vendetta Online and you will not communicate the existence of any such exploitable bug (bugs that grant the user unnatural or unintended benefits in game), either directly or through public posting, to any other user of Vendetta Online. You will promptly report any such bug via the bug report form at https://www.vendetta-online.com/x/bugreport"
It's very time consuming to figure out who did , what , when , where ? I know that and i'm not asking devs to perma ban them .
But dev's shouldn't implement the suggestions which benefits the exploiters more from the past.
Yes. As I said, submit empirical evidence, not supposition, conjecture, and opinions about what might happen in a hypothetical edge-case.
Stop with the conjecture about why people are proposing changes. Respond with why those proposals are a bad idea. Believe me, Incarnate is much smarter than you are giving him credit for. He knows when people are trying to work the system and are suggesting unbalanced and undesirable features.
It doesn't make it okay to Exploit the game if you pay for the game or Joined early.
Pardon me? I never said that. Again, you overreach and this time imply that I meant something completely different than what I wrote.
And thanks for quoting the ROC. I completely forgot that there were rules. /me rolls eyes
Stop with the conjecture about why people are proposing changes. Respond with why those proposals are a bad idea. Believe me, Incarnate is much smarter than you are giving him credit for. He knows when people are trying to work the system and are suggesting unbalanced and undesirable features.
It doesn't make it okay to Exploit the game if you pay for the game or Joined early.
Pardon me? I never said that. Again, you overreach and this time imply that I meant something completely different than what I wrote.
And thanks for quoting the ROC. I completely forgot that there were rules. /me rolls eyes
The problem with simply adding a zero or two to the prices of everything is that it will actually hurt noobs more.
The 'rats' you seem to be so worried about DarkPortal (and seem to think should have their suggestions ignored out of hand) don't just have piles of credits and ores. Many of us, myself included have enormous holdings of leftover equipment. 15 years builds up a lot of leftover ships and weapons.
Increasing prices without increasing payouts for missions to match would cripple new players to the extent that being pirated would go from a nuisance to a disaster, as they would take a lot longer to make good the losses. It would also do nothing to my income/expenditure ratio, as my main source of income is piracy, the stealing and selling of goods and the ransoming of cargoes. I consider charging traders to pass unmolested to be ransoming cargo, just without the trader having to lose his ship, get another, and buy the cargo back. It would devalue the current credit holdings, but since my holdings are quite diversified, it wouldn't make enough of a difference to make a perceptible impact.
What can be done? I do not know entirely.
Increasing the prices of the highest end ships, maybe, however again the vets are largely good enough to get by with mk1 hulls, while the noobs need the higher end equipment to make up for a lack of experience. So that is likely to backfire as well.
Fix the remaining static trade routes? That would help going forward.
Perhaps create a new resource sink. More capitol ships come to mind. Maybe allow players to craft items normally only attainable via bot drops, like Synthetic Silk-steel using normal silk-steel and some ores, that would help deplete the huge hordes of ores people are holding onto.
Making the payout from the trading guild missions better would help level the playing field. Most noobs do not enter the game knowing good trade routes, or other ways to make credits. Increasing the payouts for the early bot hunting missions might work, but again, a vet will have a marked advantage.
Trying to find a way to really level the playing field without the veterans skills and experience quickly negating the change, I would guess on a timescale of 2 weeks to 2 months is REALLY hard. It might not be possible without making the game unrecognizable as 'vendetta online'.
The 'rats' you seem to be so worried about DarkPortal (and seem to think should have their suggestions ignored out of hand) don't just have piles of credits and ores. Many of us, myself included have enormous holdings of leftover equipment. 15 years builds up a lot of leftover ships and weapons.
Increasing prices without increasing payouts for missions to match would cripple new players to the extent that being pirated would go from a nuisance to a disaster, as they would take a lot longer to make good the losses. It would also do nothing to my income/expenditure ratio, as my main source of income is piracy, the stealing and selling of goods and the ransoming of cargoes. I consider charging traders to pass unmolested to be ransoming cargo, just without the trader having to lose his ship, get another, and buy the cargo back. It would devalue the current credit holdings, but since my holdings are quite diversified, it wouldn't make enough of a difference to make a perceptible impact.
What can be done? I do not know entirely.
Increasing the prices of the highest end ships, maybe, however again the vets are largely good enough to get by with mk1 hulls, while the noobs need the higher end equipment to make up for a lack of experience. So that is likely to backfire as well.
Fix the remaining static trade routes? That would help going forward.
Perhaps create a new resource sink. More capitol ships come to mind. Maybe allow players to craft items normally only attainable via bot drops, like Synthetic Silk-steel using normal silk-steel and some ores, that would help deplete the huge hordes of ores people are holding onto.
Making the payout from the trading guild missions better would help level the playing field. Most noobs do not enter the game knowing good trade routes, or other ways to make credits. Increasing the payouts for the early bot hunting missions might work, but again, a vet will have a marked advantage.
Trying to find a way to really level the playing field without the veterans skills and experience quickly negating the change, I would guess on a timescale of 2 weeks to 2 months is REALLY hard. It might not be possible without making the game unrecognizable as 'vendetta online'.
LNH,
I liked your response. Very well thought out and... honestly thought provoking.
We've strayed pretty far from Piment's original request to balance the bank accounts, and level the playing-field for people that didn't abuse the game economy loop-holes. Although, I would argue the mechanics were intentional and using them wasn't really abuse, it was more like the traderoutes were OP and needed to be nerfed... like my poor abused Goli.
That said, you brought up some excellent points and counter-points that deserve some considerations.
1) increase high-end ship prices
Agreed, this is probably a bad idea... for the reasons you listed and more.
2) fix remaining static routes
Definitely. This might also invalidate several guild plugins/tools that are designed to specifically leverage this game weakness. Some people will squawk... loudly.
3) new high-end goodies to suck up surplus resources. (Resource sink.)
I'm a big fan of this.. problem is, you reward the bad actors with even more tools they can use to abuse the system. Plus, Inc has stated a hesitancy to introduce new assets (cost and time and increased scope) due to focusing on the redux. My perception is that the main body of the existing universe is mostly frozen (my words, not his) except for bug fixes, minor tweaks, and enhancements. Any ideas in this category may have to wait until the redux is released.
I'd like to see expensive guild owned stations... which means those wealthy people would be putting funds and resources into a SHARED asset. Thus reducing their cash holdings and ores/commodities without giving them a personal distinct combat advantage.
Also, let players buy intangible or perishable items... like holographic signs. Or let players sponsor race payouts. "This week's corporate sector race brought to you by CLM. Liberating cargo, universe wide... now accepting applications for membership." And so on.
4) trade guild payouts increases
Hmm. Agreed. I'm a fan of scalable missions. Level based mission payouts, increased risk based on level, or missions that are only available to specific levels of players. I.e. lvl 1-4 combat gets 20 bots, Lvl 5-8 gets 50, and level 9-12 gets a queen and bots, and so on... also, missions that are meant for one person should abort or the bots "flee" or call for assistance (mo danger!) When more pilots pop in to assist.
Imagine the hydra scaling up if a player owned Capship pops in to assist with the kill...
Good food for thought. But we're way off Piment's original topic. Lol
*thread hijacked*
I liked your response. Very well thought out and... honestly thought provoking.
We've strayed pretty far from Piment's original request to balance the bank accounts, and level the playing-field for people that didn't abuse the game economy loop-holes. Although, I would argue the mechanics were intentional and using them wasn't really abuse, it was more like the traderoutes were OP and needed to be nerfed... like my poor abused Goli.
That said, you brought up some excellent points and counter-points that deserve some considerations.
1) increase high-end ship prices
Agreed, this is probably a bad idea... for the reasons you listed and more.
2) fix remaining static routes
Definitely. This might also invalidate several guild plugins/tools that are designed to specifically leverage this game weakness. Some people will squawk... loudly.
3) new high-end goodies to suck up surplus resources. (Resource sink.)
I'm a big fan of this.. problem is, you reward the bad actors with even more tools they can use to abuse the system. Plus, Inc has stated a hesitancy to introduce new assets (cost and time and increased scope) due to focusing on the redux. My perception is that the main body of the existing universe is mostly frozen (my words, not his) except for bug fixes, minor tweaks, and enhancements. Any ideas in this category may have to wait until the redux is released.
I'd like to see expensive guild owned stations... which means those wealthy people would be putting funds and resources into a SHARED asset. Thus reducing their cash holdings and ores/commodities without giving them a personal distinct combat advantage.
Also, let players buy intangible or perishable items... like holographic signs. Or let players sponsor race payouts. "This week's corporate sector race brought to you by CLM. Liberating cargo, universe wide... now accepting applications for membership." And so on.
4) trade guild payouts increases
Hmm. Agreed. I'm a fan of scalable missions. Level based mission payouts, increased risk based on level, or missions that are only available to specific levels of players. I.e. lvl 1-4 combat gets 20 bots, Lvl 5-8 gets 50, and level 9-12 gets a queen and bots, and so on... also, missions that are meant for one person should abort or the bots "flee" or call for assistance (mo danger!) When more pilots pop in to assist.
Imagine the hydra scaling up if a player owned Capship pops in to assist with the kill...
Good food for thought. But we're way off Piment's original topic. Lol
*thread hijacked*
Pandoram (Darkportal), you are explicitly banned from Suggestions, and have been for years. You're banned because your contributions are of low quality, and your perspective is so biased to a particular set of goals, that you're unwilling to ever consider whether an idea is in the best interests of the game, as a whole, instead of you personally (seen many times, in general, without even having read this thread yet).
You also have a history of using fake accounts to circumvent your ban or mute status (like this), as well as creating accounts just to post here to "agree" with your ideas.
I've told you, several times, not to do this. You've given me no choice but to escalate administrative action against you and your various accounts.
Anyway, back on topic now. Feel free to continue discussing, people who are not fake Pandoram alts.
You also have a history of using fake accounts to circumvent your ban or mute status (like this), as well as creating accounts just to post here to "agree" with your ideas.
I've told you, several times, not to do this. You've given me no choice but to escalate administrative action against you and your various accounts.
Anyway, back on topic now. Feel free to continue discussing, people who are not fake Pandoram alts.
Well now... that's an interesting twist...
Edit: hit submit accidentally.
Edit: hit submit accidentally.
Unfortunately, I have to post publicly about this stuff sometimes, when it involves threads where people have made fake alts, because otherwise people may not understand why certain "individuals" never come back to post further in a discussion. Similarly, I can't just remove violating posts, because that makes the thread itself nonsensical.
Anyway, let's move on and keep this on-topic from here..
Anyway, let's move on and keep this on-topic from here..
Understood.
Well... we basically subverted Piment's original thread... but the sentiment is the same.
Rich people are too rich. Down with the 1%ers that cheated to get their moolah and capships. How can we pillage their bank vaults without robbing them blind and damaging the game?
Increase top-shelf ship prices (no!)
Fix the loopholes (static routes and infinimining [done]) (yes!)
Introduce expensive new stuff (we wish!)
More level-appropriate missions (food for thought)
Wheee!!
Well... we basically subverted Piment's original thread... but the sentiment is the same.
Rich people are too rich. Down with the 1%ers that cheated to get their moolah and capships. How can we pillage their bank vaults without robbing them blind and damaging the game?
Increase top-shelf ship prices (no!)
Fix the loopholes (static routes and infinimining [done]) (yes!)
Introduce expensive new stuff (we wish!)
More level-appropriate missions (food for thought)
Wheee!!
One solution, after any credit exploits are resolved, is to create a few high bling/gameplay neutral things that can be purchased for an exorbitant amount of credits.
I’m sorry, i must have missed how this is a positive thread. Can someone point it out to me?
I’m sorry, i must have missed how this is a positive thread. Can someone point it out to me?
This isn't a very positive thread. If you want to inspire people to post more positively, then perhaps you should say that.
Instead, you sound more like someone who is being sarcastic, and possibly resentful that there hasn't been more administrative time dedicated to pushing this thread to be positive (perhaps compared to past action against you?).
I don't have the energy and time to spend all of my time, including the weekend, trying to monitor and adjust all aspects of all threads on the Forums.
Time investment in any given moderation, and any given thread, is based on what is available in the moment.. and we do our best.
That doesn't mean the goal of the Forum isn't to foster positivity in discussion of gameplay enhancement. Or that I'm happy about factional irritation and finger-pointing spilling onto this forum.
Of course, sarcasm doesn't help with that either. Now I've spent the last while responding to you about that, instead of commenting on the subject at hand.
Moving on, please stay ON TOPIC..
This isn't a very positive thread. If you want to inspire people to post more positively, then perhaps you should say that.
Instead, you sound more like someone who is being sarcastic, and possibly resentful that there hasn't been more administrative time dedicated to pushing this thread to be positive (perhaps compared to past action against you?).
I don't have the energy and time to spend all of my time, including the weekend, trying to monitor and adjust all aspects of all threads on the Forums.
Time investment in any given moderation, and any given thread, is based on what is available in the moment.. and we do our best.
That doesn't mean the goal of the Forum isn't to foster positivity in discussion of gameplay enhancement. Or that I'm happy about factional irritation and finger-pointing spilling onto this forum.
Of course, sarcasm doesn't help with that either. Now I've spent the last while responding to you about that, instead of commenting on the subject at hand.
Moving on, please stay ON TOPIC..
Fix the loopholes (static routes and infinimining [done]) (yes!)
There are still static routes in the game.
That being said I don't think having a lot of money is a big issue. A little scarcity would be nice, but it would just put players that have all that money in a even more powerful position. Anyway, unless you want to speed build a capitol ship or quickly fix faction standings, credits are rather useless after making a few million.
There are still static routes in the game.
That being said I don't think having a lot of money is a big issue. A little scarcity would be nice, but it would just put players that have all that money in a even more powerful position. Anyway, unless you want to speed build a capitol ship or quickly fix faction standings, credits are rather useless after making a few million.