Forums » Suggestions
Penalize people who have high latency, or bad connections.
So, controversial I know, especially because some people cannot help it, but it is now being used by people who did not historically lag to either annoy people by lag-fighting, or escape with impunity. I would post some names, but not only is this frowned upon but I agree that it solves nothing. I think what I may do instead is set up a youtube channel with a "wall of shame", at least this cannot get moderated away!
Anyway, people are using high lag situations, as it is well known that lag is kind of compensated for by the server in the laggers favor (usually), for example, someone who is running in a straight line while under heavy latency appear to jump back and forth (by comparability massive amounts, 500m+ in some cases), making hitting them nearly impossible. Also during a fight, if you fit two gauss to a vulture, and then saturate your connection, the vult will not only jump around, but the shots fired by the ship will be almost invisible! (same with a lot of other weapons, but gauss, gatling and rails seem to be the most used).
The problem is that you do not want to punish people with genuine high latency connections, as this may alienate a part of the player base - sorry, I say screw them - something needs to give. My suggestion would be to make players that are high latency move slower. Limit the movements of these ships so that the server can keep up with their movements. Some ships (like the Ec-98) that move at around 50ms under normal speed do not seem to be as twitchy or jumpy as their faster counterparts when laggy. So, if a player has a sustained ping of over 300 (or maybe based on some other factor than ping, devs have a better idea about network metrics they can measure) for at least 10 seconds their ship should be limited to 50ms while under normal movement, and to around 150ms when under turbo. This limitation should last as long as 60 seconds, and should stack. This will not stop genuine laggy players from "playing" but it may stop them trying to engage in things like PvP, and let us face it, manufacturing. Nobody should be immune to attack in gray spaces, and they shouldn't get the benefit from having a bad (or forced bad) connection.
The current situation just simply wants to make me run qbittorrent in the background so at least I have a fair playing field when it comes to laggyness. I really should not be penalized when it comes to having a better connection than average!
P.S. I am primarily a VR player, but also play on mobile. I do not lag, so please do not hit me with the "what about the mobile players!" excuse. Also if you "lag switch" expect to appear on a youtube channel near here soon(tm).
Anyway, people are using high lag situations, as it is well known that lag is kind of compensated for by the server in the laggers favor (usually), for example, someone who is running in a straight line while under heavy latency appear to jump back and forth (by comparability massive amounts, 500m+ in some cases), making hitting them nearly impossible. Also during a fight, if you fit two gauss to a vulture, and then saturate your connection, the vult will not only jump around, but the shots fired by the ship will be almost invisible! (same with a lot of other weapons, but gauss, gatling and rails seem to be the most used).
The problem is that you do not want to punish people with genuine high latency connections, as this may alienate a part of the player base - sorry, I say screw them - something needs to give. My suggestion would be to make players that are high latency move slower. Limit the movements of these ships so that the server can keep up with their movements. Some ships (like the Ec-98) that move at around 50ms under normal speed do not seem to be as twitchy or jumpy as their faster counterparts when laggy. So, if a player has a sustained ping of over 300 (or maybe based on some other factor than ping, devs have a better idea about network metrics they can measure) for at least 10 seconds their ship should be limited to 50ms while under normal movement, and to around 150ms when under turbo. This limitation should last as long as 60 seconds, and should stack. This will not stop genuine laggy players from "playing" but it may stop them trying to engage in things like PvP, and let us face it, manufacturing. Nobody should be immune to attack in gray spaces, and they shouldn't get the benefit from having a bad (or forced bad) connection.
The current situation just simply wants to make me run qbittorrent in the background so at least I have a fair playing field when it comes to laggyness. I really should not be penalized when it comes to having a better connection than average!
P.S. I am primarily a VR player, but also play on mobile. I do not lag, so please do not hit me with the "what about the mobile players!" excuse. Also if you "lag switch" expect to appear on a youtube channel near here soon(tm).
"but it is now being used by people who did not historically lag to either annoy people by lag-fighting, or escape with impunity."
Now?
Dude.
This has been happening for YEARS. It's part of VO.
Best idea I could come up with was an indicator of latency so at least you can assess whether or not it's even worth engaging (or continuing to engage) someone.
Now?
Dude.
This has been happening for YEARS. It's part of VO.
Best idea I could come up with was an indicator of latency so at least you can assess whether or not it's even worth engaging (or continuing to engage) someone.
This is something we're aware of, and have some plans to try to address. It gets pretty technical, and lengthy to explain, so I'm not going to go into it right now.
Understand that it's a big project, with a really large amount of testing and validation required, to make sure we don't actually make the game worse, for most of the people, most of the time. For instance, PvP has different value trade-offs from PvE.
But, anyway, be aware that this is something that's on our list. It has been for a very long time, but I hope to get to it somewhat sooner than later.
People are welcome to continue commenting with ideas or thoughts or whatever, we'll review it whenever look at implementing different options.
Understand that it's a big project, with a really large amount of testing and validation required, to make sure we don't actually make the game worse, for most of the people, most of the time. For instance, PvP has different value trade-offs from PvE.
But, anyway, be aware that this is something that's on our list. It has been for a very long time, but I hope to get to it somewhat sooner than later.
People are welcome to continue commenting with ideas or thoughts or whatever, we'll review it whenever look at implementing different options.
I don't know if slowing down a laggy pilot is the right path to take. I love that anyone can play the game, and unfortunately one of the negatives of the 299 792 458 m / s issue is that people on the other side of the earth are going to have a bit lag just due to distances. Then add in other factors like mobile networks and wifi, and someone ~12km from the servers might to flagged as laggy. I don't think the devs should slow down their ships.
However, i do think after a certain ping, their auto aim should be disabled. And at a certain point past that level of lag, their weapons should start getting weaker. That way, they are not having a large of impact on combat yet at the same time they can carry on mining, trading, and manufacturing with very little impact on their play.
However, i do think after a certain ping, their auto aim should be disabled. And at a certain point past that level of lag, their weapons should start getting weaker. That way, they are not having a large of impact on combat yet at the same time they can carry on mining, trading, and manufacturing with very little impact on their play.
Thanks for the replies, I apologize if it is something that is already noted, I did skim a few pages before posting the idea and although I saw a few threads on server lag, I saw nothing of this kind of thing.
Anyway, it is nice to know it is something that is being looked at, I know my suggestion is kind of harsh, but in my evil testing with myself and a friend from work we kind of surmized that the lower speed ships are WAY less jumpy when a connection is bad. Although like mentioned by We all float it might actually penalize people who have honestly no choice but to play that way, and while I agree that is kind of harsh, you can never please everyone all of the time.
Just for reference I usually use my phones Wifi, and am in Europe with a 50Mbit connection. My ping is usually around 140ish, and I rarely get accused of "lag" or being jumpy. If I am on my cellular data, it depends highly on my location; but usually if I am stationary and playing then again my ping is OK - if I am on a train commuting then I expect to lag. It is only when I get into very busy sectors that I have any issue, and then I think it might be not network related.
Anyway, it is nice to know it is something that is being looked at, I know my suggestion is kind of harsh, but in my evil testing with myself and a friend from work we kind of surmized that the lower speed ships are WAY less jumpy when a connection is bad. Although like mentioned by We all float it might actually penalize people who have honestly no choice but to play that way, and while I agree that is kind of harsh, you can never please everyone all of the time.
Just for reference I usually use my phones Wifi, and am in Europe with a 50Mbit connection. My ping is usually around 140ish, and I rarely get accused of "lag" or being jumpy. If I am on my cellular data, it depends highly on my location; but usually if I am stationary and playing then again my ping is OK - if I am on a train commuting then I expect to lag. It is only when I get into very busy sectors that I have any issue, and then I think it might be not network related.
My ping was at 1,200 something a few weeks ago when i was playing. That's why i abstain from PVP - i lag and rubber band like a madman. My wifi is just utter garbage, but i still like to trade and socialize with 100 when i feel like doing so. My ping used to be glued at around 80 when i used to PVP and i still lagged, but it's not to the extent of some of the known laggards.