Forums » Suggestions

Can Trade be fixed?

Feb 05, 2017 Faille Corvelle link
The daily trade report is fiction, as is the list of "high demand" items listed in a stations welcome screen. Seems the only way to trade profitably is to haul weapons. I just took a dent-load of "locally produced" commodities all around grey and UIT and was not able to sell them for a profit ANYWHERE. That's just silly.
Feb 05, 2017 Death Fluffy link
The trade report and high demand list have been fiction for as long as I've been around. Profits are still based around the idea that most trade should be happening in ships the size of an atlas which is completely contrary to what is actually happening in actual game play. My understanding is that this is due to the proliferation of behemoth class ships which were not originally in game.

Distance from nearest source has no impact on profit making taking something like Hull Panels from Verasis to somewhere like Deneb produces a negligible reward given the amount of work and risk taken to make the delivery.

Weapons should trade at a decent profit, but they shouldn't all be an order of magnitude above commodities. Hive drops should also provide a decent reward.

Trade in Grey space just flat sucks. Years ago I posted about the need for more diverse station types in Grey.

The sharp profit decline curve that effectively makes trade of a widget beyond one XC load pointless. Yes, as I said above, Behemoths weren't meant for trade but what they were meant for and what people actually use in real game play matters.

Finally, there is the loss of discovery. Back before being able to sell huge lots of a widget at the max profit was fixed, what made trade fun and exciting was having to hunt through through multiple systems / stations to find a trade that would provide the max profit with at least a decent reciprocal trade. You would then spend days if not weeks working that route while hoping no one came along and crashed the market before you sold. That was fun! The profits were nice for the effort put in. But the best part was the hunt. Now a knowlegeable player can make 5-10 million credits just flying through Serco space simply by knowing which items always sell well between station types. Or the butterfly method as I like to call it in derision because trade is now boring.

Edit:
Bonus complaint 1) Then there is the parity in profit for high cost / high cube items with low cost / low cube widgets making trade a flat structure rather than taking advantage of the opportunity behemoths provide for trade.

Bonus complaint 2) High cost /High risk widgets like Sedina Chocolates not being worth trading because of the negligible profit.
Feb 05, 2017 Inevitable link
Grey space has the best trade route fluffy. Sell rail mkiis from h6 to m14 in odia and guess what? The profit never drops. A bug/over site that's been in the game since.... forever? That makes trading anything else a waste of time.
Feb 05, 2017 Death Fluffy link
Yes. There are a few others in the game unless they have been fixed. But that is more grinding credits than trade in my opinion. For me trade consists of effort, planning, risk, research and opportunity. Escort missions currently aren't nearly as profitable as they used to be, but they are still my go to method of grinding up my credits just because they force me to travel a bit.

I suspect those static routes were left intentionally so that players that don't like to trade have a quick way to replenish their bankroll for pvp expenses.
Feb 05, 2017 Inevitable link
I agree trade needs an overhaul and I believe n2 is testing something they have planned, but is probably on the back burner for the time being as overhauling the trade system would require a ton of developing time.
Feb 05, 2017 Death Fluffy link
I believe you are correct about n2. I think there need to be some volume limits put in place before that is ready for expansion though. Preferably through some sort of credits available for the station to buy new stock method. Or maybe use the escort system to redistribute / dispose of inventories.
Feb 05, 2017 PaKettle link
I have tried to get the devs to implement a better economy rather then the magical one we currently have but I really haven't seen much interest expressed. I cant say I blame them. Economic theory is boring as can be even for someone like me.

If Incarnate does decide to implement something better he knows how to reach me - I would be happy to show him how to solve a puzzle that has eluded game devs so far....

Infinite supply makes everything worthless however any limit you impose eventually creates a deadlock...
Feb 06, 2017 Ichitomi link
Incarnate did commit to creating the trade overhaul. Following the N2 change, he recently did state
that they are fiddling with the fiddly bits of the economy and that
"we're also trying to build a new economy that's actually based on real shipping traffic".
Feb 07, 2017 Pizzasgood link
Yeah, I'm pretty excited about that. It has the potential to give more widespread impact to things like piracy, blockades, and long-running conflicts.
Feb 07, 2017 PaKettle link
A real economy would in fact act as a driver for almost everything in the game but dont hold your breath. A real economy is an extremely complex creature and would require a lot of dev time to create.
VO is combat focused and an economy is way down the list of priorities.
Feb 08, 2017 Death Fluffy link
The crucial part is balancing the Reward : Risk + Effort. I don't much care which direction GS takes it, though I do have some preferences. Without that being properly balanced, trade will remain something players do via missions to rapidly increase or recover faction standing.

Manufacturing is / was a good start, but not everyone wants to constantly be working on a months long project that effectively bankrupts you. Nor does everyone play VO for the pvp or in my case even the mmo aspect.

Some key problems are a dire lack of scarcity in resources and commodities that do not come from bot drops, static trades and other low risk methods of rapidly making credits that currently surpass trade. Also a lack of a decent player to player trade system makes the prospect of trading manufactured items 'not fun' for me. I mean really. I did the work. Why the hell do I now need to spin around in a friggin circle for half an hour or more in order to complete a trade with another player? To hell with that!