Forums » Suggestions
Maybe it was because I prefer to play pirate, which means I have much less use for a prom than I do for a valk, or maybe it was because as a Serco player I've just become numb to how much the prom has gotten shit on over the last 9-10 years or so, but that drooling moron's thread about how the Serco should have to do an X-1 style test mission for access to the SCP got me thinking...the Serco should have that kind of test mission.
And, they should get an upgraded SCP variant for doing it -- just like the Itani have with the X1.
The X-1 was an attempt to address one of the valk's only inherent weaknesses, its rotund collision mesh -- also known as the flare/gauss/rail-catching potato shape. It already had a ton of armor, was the best chaser in the game when the X-1 was added, had a ton of firepower, and was more nimble than the IBG. The Valk was and is constantly flown for a reason in VO: it's the 'do pretty much everything and never be unable to escape' ship. But the X1 made it even better, by making it harder to hit.
Whatever the Serco get in terms of an experimental SCP would ideally lessen (I mean, the X1 still isn't a vulture in terms of profile) a significant inherent weakness in the SCP. The SCP's weakness sure isn't armor or firepower, though, and its profile is already quite small so long as the pilot faces his target - squashing the model like the X1 wouldn't work. Adding more of what it does well (guns and/or HPs) isn't the idea either.
The SCP's biggest weakness is that it's not a Valk in terms of speed. But changing that would be like if the X1 had been given 19000 HP instead of a model squash. So that's out, too.
To get the SCP-X dialed in, I think we need a combo of tweaks: first, address the weakness that has been nerfed into the SCP over the years by nudging the thrust and spin torque back up to where it was a couple nerfs ago. Second, make it stealthier, cutting its radar detection range by 1/2 of whatever it would otherwise be. Not a great advantage in 1v1 combat like a flatter profile (X1) but potentially very helpful in group combat and complimentary to the enhanced maneuverability more thrust and spin torque would allow.
Flame away, Itani dogs :)
And, they should get an upgraded SCP variant for doing it -- just like the Itani have with the X1.
The X-1 was an attempt to address one of the valk's only inherent weaknesses, its rotund collision mesh -- also known as the flare/gauss/rail-catching potato shape. It already had a ton of armor, was the best chaser in the game when the X-1 was added, had a ton of firepower, and was more nimble than the IBG. The Valk was and is constantly flown for a reason in VO: it's the 'do pretty much everything and never be unable to escape' ship. But the X1 made it even better, by making it harder to hit.
Whatever the Serco get in terms of an experimental SCP would ideally lessen (I mean, the X1 still isn't a vulture in terms of profile) a significant inherent weakness in the SCP. The SCP's weakness sure isn't armor or firepower, though, and its profile is already quite small so long as the pilot faces his target - squashing the model like the X1 wouldn't work. Adding more of what it does well (guns and/or HPs) isn't the idea either.
The SCP's biggest weakness is that it's not a Valk in terms of speed. But changing that would be like if the X1 had been given 19000 HP instead of a model squash. So that's out, too.
To get the SCP-X dialed in, I think we need a combo of tweaks: first, address the weakness that has been nerfed into the SCP over the years by nudging the thrust and spin torque back up to where it was a couple nerfs ago. Second, make it stealthier, cutting its radar detection range by 1/2 of whatever it would otherwise be. Not a great advantage in 1v1 combat like a flatter profile (X1) but potentially very helpful in group combat and complimentary to the enhanced maneuverability more thrust and spin torque would allow.
Flame away, Itani dogs :)
April Fools day is a couple months away still, Dr. Noobter.
"it's the 'do pretty much everything and never be unable to escape' ship."
Things the valk can't do:
1. Trade
2. Bomb
3. Chase down a hound
4. Fire heavy weapons
Other ships that can't do that stuff, but can also escape with inevitable success:
1. IBG
2. SVG
3. Rev C Cent
4. Superlight
"...nudging the thrust and spin torque back up to where it was a couple nerfs ago"
There is zero argument for the SCP needing more thrust or spin torque. It's already spins around like nothing else, given it's size and armor, and it's not an intercepter. You probably already forgot, but you just recently got yourself a new intercepter.
"it's the 'do pretty much everything and never be unable to escape' ship."
Things the valk can't do:
1. Trade
2. Bomb
3. Chase down a hound
4. Fire heavy weapons
Other ships that can't do that stuff, but can also escape with inevitable success:
1. IBG
2. SVG
3. Rev C Cent
4. Superlight
"...nudging the thrust and spin torque back up to where it was a couple nerfs ago"
There is zero argument for the SCP needing more thrust or spin torque. It's already spins around like nothing else, given it's size and armor, and it's not an intercepter. You probably already forgot, but you just recently got yourself a new intercepter.
I think there's definitely room for a new Prom variant, but it can't be an upgrade on the SCP. I'd rather see massive trade-offs such as a drastic cut in armor in exchange for upgrading its L port to a turret.
I think there's definitely room for a new Prom variant, but it can't be an upgrade on the SCP.
Why not? The IDF was a perfectly fine Valk and yet the X1 is very much an upgrade to it.
Why not? The IDF was a perfectly fine Valk and yet the X1 is very much an upgrade to it.
/me hands Dr. Lecter a tissue
Because the SCP is still very, very good at what it does, as evidenced by Itani in X1s still whining about themselves getting decked if they have the audacity to try and fight one. You'd be amazed how little a slightly slimmer frame helps you against well-placed flares- that upgrade wasn't to help it against SCPs, but against Vultures. Vultures were owning the piss out of Valks, and the X1 was the best way of dealing with that while not impacting on how dominant the SCP is in a brawl.
Besides, the SCP is amazing as far as defensive ships go. As long as it has the agility to dodge swarm salvos, it's a great ship. Unbeatable in its class. Not outclassed by a Corvus variant of a Vulture, like the IDF was.
Besides, the SCP is amazing as far as defensive ships go. As long as it has the agility to dodge swarm salvos, it's a great ship. Unbeatable in its class. Not outclassed by a Corvus variant of a Vulture, like the IDF was.
-1 if you want a valk, play Itani and stop crying.
-1 if you want a valk, play Itani and stop crying.
What about the suggested Experimental Variant makes you think it would be at all like a valk? The Itani got a souped-up version of their national pride ship...why shouldn't the Serco get the same treatment?
The real question is how could the Devs have let this slide for so long.
Because the SCP is still very, very good at what it does, as evidenced by Itani in X1s still whining about themselves getting decked if they have the audacity to try and fight one.
That makes as much sense as saying there was no need to balance the SCP before, because the Serco could whine that teh Valk could always run away from the SCP and two or three valks could always dance around to whittle down the prom. Prommy still got the nerf bat.
What about the suggested Experimental Variant makes you think it would be at all like a valk? The Itani got a souped-up version of their national pride ship...why shouldn't the Serco get the same treatment?
The real question is how could the Devs have let this slide for so long.
Because the SCP is still very, very good at what it does, as evidenced by Itani in X1s still whining about themselves getting decked if they have the audacity to try and fight one.
That makes as much sense as saying there was no need to balance the SCP before, because the Serco could whine that teh Valk could always run away from the SCP and two or three valks could always dance around to whittle down the prom. Prommy still got the nerf bat.
Exiled is like Ecka, he only has a small bag of insults to throw at you and he just cycles between them. "Why don't you login" "stop crying and play itani" etc.. etc..
Anyway, I think academically speaking, the equivalent change you're searching for is actually just a significant improvement to the prometheus' spin torque. If it could move faster that would open up new options for weapon loadouts since the low spin ratio is the only thing stopping it using energy effectively.
Anyway, I think academically speaking, the equivalent change you're searching for is actually just a significant improvement to the prometheus' spin torque. If it could move faster that would open up new options for weapon loadouts since the low spin ratio is the only thing stopping it using energy effectively.
1) Cut the armor.
2) Increase speed and turbo boost, reducing drain.
3) Replace the large port with 2 small ports, making a combat effective 4 port heavy attack ship.
2) Increase speed and turbo boost, reducing drain.
3) Replace the large port with 2 small ports, making a combat effective 4 port heavy attack ship.
Serco Vulture Guardian Mk2 (difference comparison)
Weapons: 1 Large Port (-2 Small Ports, +1 Large Port)
Mass: 4000kg (+200kg)
Spin Torque: 7.5Nm
Armor: 6000 (-3000)
Thrust: 230N (-5N)
Max Speed: 60m/s (-5m/s)
Turbo Thrust: 255N (-5N)
Turbo Speed: 220m/s (-5m/s)
Turbo Energy: 54/s (-1/s)
Cargo: 2
Weapons: 1 Large Port (-2 Small Ports, +1 Large Port)
Mass: 4000kg (+200kg)
Spin Torque: 7.5Nm
Armor: 6000 (-3000)
Thrust: 230N (-5N)
Max Speed: 60m/s (-5m/s)
Turbo Thrust: 255N (-5N)
Turbo Speed: 220m/s (-5m/s)
Turbo Energy: 54/s (-1/s)
Cargo: 2
Serco Prom XRP (Experimental Reduced Profile)
Exact same stats as the SCP, with a reduced collision profile.
Requires a test mission, increased price, sold at some border/barracks stations.
Exact same stats as the SCP, with a reduced collision profile.
Requires a test mission, increased price, sold at some border/barracks stations.
The Prometheus is not supposed to be a "match" for the Valkyrie. It even says in the game's description:
Although it will never match the easy maneuverability of its lighter cousin, the Vulture, it can handle a variety of heavy cargo and weapons while still remaining relatively light on its feet.
Which it already accomplishes very well.
If anything the Valkyrie X-1 needs an armor nerf as a downside to its reduced profile. 11600 -> 9500
Although it will never match the easy maneuverability of its lighter cousin, the Vulture, it can handle a variety of heavy cargo and weapons while still remaining relatively light on its feet.
Which it already accomplishes very well.
If anything the Valkyrie X-1 needs an armor nerf as a downside to its reduced profile. 11600 -> 9500
I like how the itani are the only ones complaining.
I like the stealth idea a lot. +1
The x prom shouldn't be nerfed anywhere; as the valk x1 didn't have any compromises. Really that's just it, the valk got better without having to sacrifice anything. So the X Prom shouldn't either.
I like the stealth idea a lot. +1
The x prom shouldn't be nerfed anywhere; as the valk x1 didn't have any compromises. Really that's just it, the valk got better without having to sacrifice anything. So the X Prom shouldn't either.
I'm complaining. I'm not Itani. The X1 was necessary to make the Valkyrie not terrible in direct combat. The SCP has no glaring weaknesses aside from being unable to finish its prey, which the SVG can take care of nicely. The stealth idea is something that would work better as an addon.
So what you're saying is that the Itani Defense Force needs to conclude the X-1 prototype experiment and fold in the new low-profile design to the rest of the Valkyrie lineup?
Go for it. *trollface stamp of approval*
Go for it. *trollface stamp of approval*
The X1 was necessary to make the Valkyrie not terrible in direct combat.
Um, no. The X1 was a higher level ship that was even better than the IDF, while the IDF was still very much on par with the SCP... just not at the same tasks.
That an IDF could not survive an encounter with a SCP by charging the SCP and shooting it out non-stop is not and was not the issue. That would be like saying an SCP-X that could go 70m/s non-turbo and had 55 drain with a 225 m/s turbo was "necessary" to make the SCP not terrible in hit and run combat.
The SCP has no glaring weaknesses aside from being unable to finish its prey
This is beyond stupid, and is akin to saying the Valk has no glaring weaknesses aside from being unable to win a toe-to-toe slugfest with a SCP. The SCP was once the dominant toe-to-toe combat ship (nerfs have left it powerful but more "balanced"), while the Valk was and is the dominant hit and run combat ship (nerfs have added 100kg to the already improved X1).
Um, no. The X1 was a higher level ship that was even better than the IDF, while the IDF was still very much on par with the SCP... just not at the same tasks.
That an IDF could not survive an encounter with a SCP by charging the SCP and shooting it out non-stop is not and was not the issue. That would be like saying an SCP-X that could go 70m/s non-turbo and had 55 drain with a 225 m/s turbo was "necessary" to make the SCP not terrible in hit and run combat.
The SCP has no glaring weaknesses aside from being unable to finish its prey
This is beyond stupid, and is akin to saying the Valk has no glaring weaknesses aside from being unable to win a toe-to-toe slugfest with a SCP. The SCP was once the dominant toe-to-toe combat ship (nerfs have left it powerful but more "balanced"), while the Valk was and is the dominant hit and run combat ship (nerfs have added 100kg to the already improved X1).
"I'm complaining. I'm not Itani."... " I'd rather see massive trade-offs such as a drastic cut in armor in exchange for upgrading its L port to a turret."
Right so, what you're doing is suggesting that the Prom be "upgraded" to having significantly less armour and significantly less weapons options.
Quick question, are you...
A: high
B: stupid
C: both high and stupid
or
D: assuming that everyone else is either A, B or C?
+1 to Savet.
+1 to Doc.
Right so, what you're doing is suggesting that the Prom be "upgraded" to having significantly less armour and significantly less weapons options.
Quick question, are you...
A: high
B: stupid
C: both high and stupid
or
D: assuming that everyone else is either A, B or C?
+1 to Savet.
+1 to Doc.
No, I'm suggesting that an experimental Prom could take some greater liberties than "squish model and boost stats a little".
The X1 did not involve any balancing tradeoffs--it was simply made better. The SCP-X should be implemented in the same manner.