I know we all do it, but still there should be some effect to smashing the Tung Voy to tiny little pieces. This would make standings more effective in a minor way, and making smashing convoys more "risky" (again in a minor way).

In addition failing escorts should have minor standings loss. This will prevent the spawning of escorts 20 at a time, just to see if you can get a dent taxi.

-1 until there are other ways to actually gain standing. You can fight for weeks for someone in a horrible bloody war, but unless you truck their widgets around, No standing for you!

There is standing loss if you kill them in monitored space.

+1. I mean, if I joined a group they should know who I am and they should tank my faction.

-1

Greyspace specifically says UNMONITERED.

-1

because: http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/27738

Unless you can control local factors onboard attacking vessels, there's no reason that you should lose faction in unmonitored space.

-1. Go back to Nation Space, n00b.

-1

VO needs a new captcha style log in test: "Define 'Unmonitored'"

"until there are other ways to actually gain standing." -- I have never had a problem gaining standing. There are several ways, from boring to super boring. That said some of the corp standings are a bit impossible to recover. Better think about if you want to get all your AAPs from convoys before you go blowing up their stuff.

"Greyspace specifically says UNMONITERED." yes it does but it doesn't mean that every member of the convoy suddenly puts on a blind fold and paints their canopy so that they ca't tell who is shooting them. Or that they turn off their radio and never ever send a "help i'm being shot by...." message. Further more if launched the voy, then .... I'm not talking about -900 standings I'm talking about -25 or something. Doesn't seem unreasonable.

@TheRedSpy - I knew there was one somewhere.

@Pizzasgood & Dr. Lecter - go troll elsewhere.

Now see, in this case, your accusation of trolling was valid.

Anyway, the points I made last month in the thread TRS linked are still valid. Counter them or go home.

Ya I already played devils advocate on this one, there's no way a convoy can identify you in unmonitored space if you take every precaution.

"Help I'm being shot by a black Corvus vulture..." Real helpful to folks back home

Another point is that none of the factions have actual control over greyspace. If one faction suddenly killed some guy in a major faction, take UIT for example, then the UIT would be likely to start waring with said faction.

I have never had a problem gaining standing.

Go make a UIT character and fight in the Deneb war or do Hive Skirmishes for a neutral subfaction and tell me how long it takes for you to get Admired.

I'll check back in 6 months.

Or, even easier: Get to +800 with a subfaction from Neutral without doing a Trade Guild mission. See how long it takes you.

Another idea would be that faction losses are system-specific. TPG/UIT have presence in Ukari and Latos, and could probably tell whether or not a convoy is under attack and by whom. In Sedina, on the other hand, Corvus and XX couldn't care less.

@Arf: That's capitalism for you.

"TPG/UIT have presence in Ukari and Latos, and could probably tell whether or not a convoy is under attack and by whom."

No, they couldn't. What part of "Unmonitored" did you not understand?

If you want Big Brother keeping his pervy eyes on your ass, stay in nation space.

We have global chat and PMs. Convoys can't talk to stations from a jump away? We see the names of people when they target them. Convoys can't?

Not that I like this idea. Convoys are there to be molested and ravaged by marauding pirates and VPR.

Global chat is irrelevant. Sure convoys can talk to stations. So what?

They have no proof.

They can scream back to the station that somebody is attacking them all they want, but it's just hear-say.

The ability to perfectly ID a ship is not canon. That's a temporary cludge until the devs get around to letting us disable our ID transponders and otherwise engage in proper stealth gameplay.

I know we all do it -coteyr

Speak for yourself! Murdering those poor unsuspecting NPC's? What will their little NPC families do? Who is going to bring home the Verasi Specialty Foods now that Daddy was killed by bored and greedy players who don't have specific content to support their RP choices... OH, THE HUMANITY!!!!

I'd say +1 to a faction hit if you kill voys you spawned, but that is so easily worked around it doesn't matter. Spawn on alt, log off, log on pirate, pewpewpewBOOM... loot loot loot!

@ Rin: then why do CtC bots get to report back to their home nations? (and why don't war convoys?)

Because they're cheating bastards.

Everybody but CD is defending their favourite exploit...

First, this would make you take "sub-sides" in grayspace.

Next, for this not become a game-killer, we really need more convoys, more often. The same old idea, make a total of X ships in space any time, where number of NPCs to spawn is X-Players online now. With more convoys to attack, every 10min or so departing another from every station, then players would not have to dock, take a Escort mission and then attack their voys...

That fix would make piracy more like piracy, instead of grinding an exploit as of now!

Unless Inc comes here and says that's why escorts exist...

One alternative would be to have a NPC you can tip in the stations' bars to make them launch a voy you can hunt... an official alternative to CD's valid suggestion on use alts to launch voys!

No, my favorite exploit is that convoys automatically forgive you for killing them while you are still in the group. You only get to kill two ships before they kick you out, and attacking them at all does aggro the turrets (but not the escort bots), but it carries no faction penalty even within that faction's monitored space. It's awesome, because it means you can kill them right there in the station sector, just past the NFZ, which makes hauling the loot back go much faster.

That's a completely separate issue from this one though. Even if it were fixed (and I do believe it should be fixed), you'd still suffer no penalty for killing your convoy out in unmonitored space. And rightly so! Because, guess what? It's unmonitored.

Maybe you could argue that since the ships belong to the faction, their word would be trusted. I say bullshit. They're just truck-drivers. I wouldn't just take a truck-driver's word in a murder case even if he were working for a reputable company that does background checks and such. Now how about a truck-driver for a shady company that exists out in the lawless wilds beyond the reach of any government's oversight? Hell no. These guys are just fellow greyspacers who don't quite have the guts to simply take what they want.... or do they? Nobody is going to take their word about what happens in unmonitored space.

You might say that it should still taint my reputation by casting suspicion upon me. Still bullshit. This ain't high-society. This is greyspace, homie! We're all suspicious by default, just by the fact that we're even here. Of course there are going to be nasty rumors floating around that I kill my convoys. Those rumors float around about everybody. I'd be helping to spread them! Make sure all those Tunguska guys know that Ecka is a back-stabbing cannibal! That ARF licks moth pilots in inappropriate places! That Dirty 'oRe... well, this is a public forum so I just won't even go there.

Seriously dude, stop trying to drag your filthy civilization into the purity that is greyspace.