Alright i just wanted to whine about this, feel free to shoot this suggestion down.

popcorn just suck and the spread doesn't make up for the medium weight, shit DPE/DPS.

Its just a terrible weapon compared to the mark 2 neutron blaster even for its supposed close ranged combat role its nothing compared to a gauss cannon or any neutron/positron blaster.

Rails are pretty fine in most regards with the exception of the limited vectors one can fire in (because of the way vo communicates weapon firing data to save bandwidth or something) I would like to see something like a faster fire rate on the mark1,2&3 variants like say 1.2 1.3 1.4 respectively if you're gonna make a weapon grossly inefficient at DPE you might as well give it a bit better than completely mediocre DPS.

The gat cannon should be as accurate as the hive Gatling cannon deal quite a bit more damage (think like 500 something) with the current auto-aim. as it stands right now its worse than the plasma eliminator.

The screamer needs at least one of these buffs to be a half decent PVP weapon
1: lose quite a bit of weight, get extra ammo (say 18~20)
2: a 3~6 m proximity enhancement with less safety-fuse time.

As it is right now screamer missiles are RIDICULOUSLY hard to land hits with, and very easy to dodge, the 10ms per second doesn't make up in the slightest for a 10m reduction in proximity and the long safety fuse on the rocket makes it completely useless at less than 100m.

Missles in general suck harder than most professional Thai hooker with the exception of the Swarms and Gemini missles. all missles that detonate on contact are so ridiculously useless and all of them should at least have a 3~7m proximity.

We've had plenty of threads about buffing these addons before most of them probably started by me, I thought I'd put them all in one place.

*I'd post all the gunstats and crap but I'm lazy today*

**Edit - PS: If you don't really think I didn't take other situations than 1 versus 1 player on player situations read the whole damn suggestion, most of these buffs aren't enormous unless the weapon is in dire need of one, Hopefully enough to give these weapons a greater place in all aspects of vendetta combat.

I've logged over 2500 hours in this game on this account and at least 250 hours in botting alone if not more. I can say with confidence that my weapon buff suggestions aren't overbuffs at all, and will not significantly change the role of current weapons but will make them an acceptable alternative instead of something that's a large disadvantage. PK's across all accounts add up around 7k and my botkill count something around 25k.

I'm sure i'm going to get the "the guns you're talking about have niche uses and don't require buffs"

And I'm going to tell you to actually going to tell you that there are much better guns for those roles have a few examples.

popcorn at point blank/close range is completely overpowered by light blasters and gauss I dare you to test it out.

Rails make a decent support weapon, but are nothing compared to a well flown light fighter in pretty much any situation.

Gat cannons* are completely useless in ANY combat situation and are completely inferior to other large energy weapons in ALL aspects. I really hope I don't need to explain this in to you guys in more detail...

screamers are only useful VS extremely heavy ships that aren't boosting.

missles that detonate on contact... errrr they're so terrible I could dodge them in an fully loaded spam rag.

*derp I wrote gat turret instead of gat cannon.

Gatling turrets don't need to be buffed. They're very good on ships such as the Prometheus and Centaur.

Popcorn, screamers, Firefly/Yellowjacket/Stingray missiles, and Concussion railguns all need at least slight buffs. I'm not too sure about rails right now. Not every weapon is meant for direct 1v1 fights.

The gat turret should be as accurate as the hive Gatling cannon deal quite a bit more damage (think like 500 something) with the current auto-aim. as it stands right now its worse than the plasma eliminator.

This is the only point I disagree with you on. Gat cannons need a huge buff, but I was kicking arse in the furball last night with a sunnie/AGT combination. Get behind someone with that in a small ship like the Warthog I was using and they're doomed. I can name at least a half-dozen people that annihilate light ships using AGT/flares in 1v1's.

@slime: Not every weapon is meant for direct 1v1 fights. fair point slime but.

Ok name one legitimate useful use for each of these: popcorn,screamer,gat-cannon,contact missles, where these: accurate light blaster,jackhammer,megaposi,swarms,rockets aren't vastly superior.

@tarenty: the gat cannon with an extra 200 damage per shot would make a very efficient weapon with great DPS its more than enough to make it decent.

@peytros: We're not talking about the gat turret. I meant for this thread to be about buffs to make weapons compare to the everyday used all around guns like the N2 Megaposi Jackhammer ect...

yeah gat turrets in a furball are way over powered cause of their huge auto aim cone, if someone is not actively dodging the gat user its pretty much just turbo up to them and spam shit.

really what else would ye spam fer fun pey? : )

Popcorn should probably just be removed entirely. Unless a super fast and super squishy ship is added that's only good at close range... which would be the only thing popcorn could be effective against.

You have to be careful not to balance all of these weapons for 1v1. Some weapons are devastating in furballs but weak in 1v1.

For example, a quad rail hornet will lose most of the time to an equal pilot in a n3/vulture. But if you let a quad rail hornet sneak up on you in a furball, you're dead before you can react. I used to use these for killing Proms in furballs back in the day before they were nerfed. If you buff rails so that they're better in 1v1, they become OP in furballs.

Or for another example; missiles in 1 v 1 are mediocre at best right now. If you buff them so that they're more competitive in 1v1 (more accurate/faster/bigger prox detonation), they become OP in furballs. Not a lot of people remember, but there actually was a brief time when missiles were tough as hell to dodge, they had to be nerfed.

Balance is going to be very difficult until Vendetta actually has a decent population, or the playable area is reduced to force players closer together. Until one of those happens its hard to determine what's really effective.

Yeah the gatling *cannon* needs a buff for sure. Popcorns should probably weigh less for what they are too...

As for Fireflies and Yellowjackets... that one just doesn't make any sense. Either make Fireflies available at -/-/-/-/- or make them do more damage and go faster. As of right now there's absolutely zero reason to use them in the game when Yellowjackets are available at an earlier level, do more damage, have a larger blast radius, and have more ammo.

@ghost: they can't do that because of the current netcode or something, this game actually lacks tons content and this includes addons and ships imo removing something entirely isn't a good move imo.
even more so if its unique.

could you elaborate how a gat cannon, contact missles are better in furballs?

I never said anything about the ADVrails, i just think the other rails lack enough DPS to actually compare do enough damage in a furball, plus the netcode makes all rails suck ass at greater ranges even on stationary targets.

even if missles had something like 5m prox they still woudn't be nearly as effective as a jackhammer or a sunflare because you can hear the beeps and they're slow as hell since they always fly at a static 80m/s unlike flares that you don't get any warnings and have a ridiculous 30m proximity. I'm not saying they need a substantial damage buff but the whole detonate on contact makes them 100% useless even in a furball if someone launches any kind of guided missles at me that isn't swarms I just ignore them completely and keep focusing my current target the only ones that have the slighest chance of hitting are gems and they have 10m prox and thats twice the amount of prox I'm suggesting.

yellow jackets deal good damage but have an insanly slow turn rate. Fireflies are by far the worst weapon in the game I mean the govbus is better alternative every situation anyone has ever been in.

No balance is something that's very easy to accomplish with a small community, I've played smaller games that have had less cumulative community than vo (mostly FPS mods where the weapons were extremely well balanced)*.

*vo isn't a classical FPS but it still has a relatively large cumulative community, the thing that the devs lack are tools and stuff see this extremely old a1k0n post: http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/1/9173#105696 *read the last two paragraphs* if the devs had these we could get some near perfect balance.

Anyways I took into account furballs,botting and other situations than 1v1pvp into my buffs.

A fixed mount weapon like the gat cannon should in fact weigh less and do a lot more damage then an auto aim turret. They should in fact be just as deadly as the Megaposi.

Not a lot of people remember, but there actually was a brief time when missiles were tough as hell to dodge

Strat remembers such a time ;)

The point I'm trying to make is just that it's very difficult to balance weapons accurately as the scale of combat is most likely going to shift heavily *if* there ever is a large or even mild influx of players. Then when they have to rebalance the weapons, it will have just been wasted time.

Look at the prom. They balanced that for the current scale of combat at the time. It was OP in 1v1 so it got nerfed. Now, in the ways of end game ships, it's one of the most difficult ones to use in mid scale group combat and they'll eventually need to go back and rebalance it.

I'm not saying things are balanced, there are clearly weapons that need to be looked at. But in order to make adjustments that will be accurate and not need to be readjusted later anyways, you'll need the undivided attention of one dev for a length of time and you'll need at least 12 players who can consistently get together and have a 6v6 with different layouts.

Otherwise we'll just continue to get the same kind of balance changes that we've had in the past. Devs adding 100kg to a ship here and there and then going back to work on other things. While it's nice to know that the devs are listening and making an effort with such tweaks, these changes need a lot more attention/testing/retesting if they're going to be done correctly.

Ghost +1

Remove gat-turret at L-weapon - replace with gat-cannon with buffs as suggested by Spidey. That is my only comment.

Less considered suggestion: Make gat-turret an actual TURRET weapon and add a modified combat moth or some-such ship that actually makes sense for people to fly on turrets in combat.

Or at the very least, rename the gat turret. It confuses newbies. But yeah, I'd rather see it as a turret port item. Of course, I may be biased.

+1 to moving the AGT to the Turret port. Likewise to buffing the GatCannon to the point of usefulness.

As for missiles, yeah, they need a thorough rebalancing. I understand the concerns of certain veterans that they might become a bit too powerful in engagements involving more than two combatants, but I find that their guidance has been a bit over-nerfed when they regularly miss stationary Orun Collectors. There's a difference between trying to ensure that they don't become unbalanced in certain situations, and making them totally useless in all situations.

Missiles are not useless. They're great for bombing runs on capital ships.

...and that's about it...

but still: not useless.

only two types of missles are useful swarms and geminis, we were talking about missles that detonate on contact.

Well, spidey, one of the main disadvantages of screamer is awful energy drain.. it's still not useless.

But sure +1 for new variants of screamer and popcorn gun