Forums » Suggestions
Conquerable Systems taken to an extreme
Hi All,
Now, let me begin by saying that I know this idea is likely to be contentious, so I just want to say that I'm just putting it 'out there' at an act of brainstorming. Feel free to add pros and cons etc..
I was chatting to some of the other players on channel 100 recently, all debating about what they wanted from the game, and there seemed to be, loosely, two camps: those who like the entrepreneurial side of the game (trading, mining etc.) and those who wanted something more like (to use David Lister's phrase) 'Space Quake'. The people in the latter group felt that there wasn't enough for them to do, and insufficient motivation to go on killing sprees (I suspect some are quite rich, unlike me with my 53cr. I'm not bitter. I'm just poor.). This got me thinking...
Now, OK, I'll confess that this idea is a little pinched from the WarHammer MMORG, but I do think it's a concept that may very well fit in with Vendetta.
Presently, we can, as I understand it, take over a few specific systems/stations (Deneb being a case in point). I've not been involved with these border conflicts yet, because I'm still a wee bit feeble (I entered Itani space last night. Lasted 1 second. I think I glimpsed the turret that killed me.) Is there any mileage in extending this to allow total empire invasion? I mean, allow players to gang up and perform protracted campaigns, with all the strategy and logistics it would entail, with the aim of (say) wiping the Itani completely out (as an example, I'm not biased :-) ). Obviously, it would get harder as you drew closer to the opposing homeworld, and no doubt all sides will have an interest in positioning sophisticated defences in their systems.
I don't think a total destruction/invasion would be easy, and I know there's a number of pitfalls to be aware of/consider:
1) Serco and Itani will obviously be trying to defend their own territories, whilst invading the other's. UIT and Pirates I assume will stay neutral, but that's really up to the player groups that belong to those factions. E.g. The Pirates may gang up and make a play for control of UIT space.
2) How do we deal will player number / ability imbalance? I would suggest making up the shortfall with NPC characters, unless you want to go down the road of assigning new players to one side or another? You could also give the less populous side greater defensive resources, or make ships there cheaper.
3) What would happen if one side did manage to completely conquer the other? Well, firstly, I suspect this would be hard to achieve, with really heavy defenses as you near the home system of the opposition, although a siege would be interesting. I would suspect (or rather, like to think) that other player groups (e.g. when the Serco conquer the Itani) such as Pirates and UIT, see one side gaining the upper hand, they'll see it as in their interests to support the losing side, as once any faction gains two territories, they'll have the resources to take out all other factions.
Anyway, I digress. What happens to the vanquished side (lets face it, we're talking about the Itani here :-) )?
1) One approach is to have them play a rebellion team - working in conquered space, but with equipment and missions to assassinate and sabotage the invaders. I'm still thinking how how this would operate...
2) Another approach is to reboot the universe. I believe WarHammer does this, but it's not an approach I'm in favor of, personally.
3) The loosing players could be migrated (i.e. their home station is set to) a third party faction's space. E.g. grey space or UIT. Like a government in exile type thing. Rather like the French in WWII.
4) A Developer Run 'group' which has a UN like role, could send in NPC suppliers of extra weaponry and credits to the losing team, to give them a fighting chance of recovering their territory? Such a group would have to have a very strict and limited 'mandate' of what kind and degree of interference they would be allowed to impose. It would be fun to have UN-like peacekeeper NPC's for us all to take potshots at though!
There'd also be all sorts of interesting economic repercussions too - the fall of one side could lead to items becoming worthless, whilst others profit greatly from war. I suspect UIT would be courted by everyone for their financial resources, and the Pirates often hired as Mercenaries/Spies/Assassins.
Anyway, I just thought I'd throw the idea out there and see what sticks, but I certainly think it would liven things up, for everyone :-)
As an experiment, we could begin by allowing *everything* to be player conquerable, and then see how much havoc that causes, with a predetermined review date for the experiment to be discussed.
Go on. You know you want to...
Now, let me begin by saying that I know this idea is likely to be contentious, so I just want to say that I'm just putting it 'out there' at an act of brainstorming. Feel free to add pros and cons etc..
I was chatting to some of the other players on channel 100 recently, all debating about what they wanted from the game, and there seemed to be, loosely, two camps: those who like the entrepreneurial side of the game (trading, mining etc.) and those who wanted something more like (to use David Lister's phrase) 'Space Quake'. The people in the latter group felt that there wasn't enough for them to do, and insufficient motivation to go on killing sprees (I suspect some are quite rich, unlike me with my 53cr. I'm not bitter. I'm just poor.). This got me thinking...
Now, OK, I'll confess that this idea is a little pinched from the WarHammer MMORG, but I do think it's a concept that may very well fit in with Vendetta.
Presently, we can, as I understand it, take over a few specific systems/stations (Deneb being a case in point). I've not been involved with these border conflicts yet, because I'm still a wee bit feeble (I entered Itani space last night. Lasted 1 second. I think I glimpsed the turret that killed me.) Is there any mileage in extending this to allow total empire invasion? I mean, allow players to gang up and perform protracted campaigns, with all the strategy and logistics it would entail, with the aim of (say) wiping the Itani completely out (as an example, I'm not biased :-) ). Obviously, it would get harder as you drew closer to the opposing homeworld, and no doubt all sides will have an interest in positioning sophisticated defences in their systems.
I don't think a total destruction/invasion would be easy, and I know there's a number of pitfalls to be aware of/consider:
1) Serco and Itani will obviously be trying to defend their own territories, whilst invading the other's. UIT and Pirates I assume will stay neutral, but that's really up to the player groups that belong to those factions. E.g. The Pirates may gang up and make a play for control of UIT space.
2) How do we deal will player number / ability imbalance? I would suggest making up the shortfall with NPC characters, unless you want to go down the road of assigning new players to one side or another? You could also give the less populous side greater defensive resources, or make ships there cheaper.
3) What would happen if one side did manage to completely conquer the other? Well, firstly, I suspect this would be hard to achieve, with really heavy defenses as you near the home system of the opposition, although a siege would be interesting. I would suspect (or rather, like to think) that other player groups (e.g. when the Serco conquer the Itani) such as Pirates and UIT, see one side gaining the upper hand, they'll see it as in their interests to support the losing side, as once any faction gains two territories, they'll have the resources to take out all other factions.
Anyway, I digress. What happens to the vanquished side (lets face it, we're talking about the Itani here :-) )?
1) One approach is to have them play a rebellion team - working in conquered space, but with equipment and missions to assassinate and sabotage the invaders. I'm still thinking how how this would operate...
2) Another approach is to reboot the universe. I believe WarHammer does this, but it's not an approach I'm in favor of, personally.
3) The loosing players could be migrated (i.e. their home station is set to) a third party faction's space. E.g. grey space or UIT. Like a government in exile type thing. Rather like the French in WWII.
4) A Developer Run 'group' which has a UN like role, could send in NPC suppliers of extra weaponry and credits to the losing team, to give them a fighting chance of recovering their territory? Such a group would have to have a very strict and limited 'mandate' of what kind and degree of interference they would be allowed to impose. It would be fun to have UN-like peacekeeper NPC's for us all to take potshots at though!
There'd also be all sorts of interesting economic repercussions too - the fall of one side could lead to items becoming worthless, whilst others profit greatly from war. I suspect UIT would be courted by everyone for their financial resources, and the Pirates often hired as Mercenaries/Spies/Assassins.
Anyway, I just thought I'd throw the idea out there and see what sticks, but I certainly think it would liven things up, for everyone :-)
As an experiment, we could begin by allowing *everything* to be player conquerable, and then see how much havoc that causes, with a predetermined review date for the experiment to be discussed.
Go on. You know you want to...
it wouldn't work because the carebear alliance would refuse to fight each other.
Well, long term I would support the general idea Dr M. Short term it just wouldn't work . A huge amount of code, too few players about to make it work.
I am all for trying this in deneb, having something to fight about would bring players back into VO , and give newer ones objectives.
This is really a shorter term objective which might be feasable:
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/23532
To be fair, the devs have said that this sort of thing is in the pipeline. Reasonably VO moves forward a step at a time, so try things incrementally.
I am all for trying this in deneb, having something to fight about would bring players back into VO , and give newer ones objectives.
This is really a shorter term objective which might be feasable:
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/23532
To be fair, the devs have said that this sort of thing is in the pipeline. Reasonably VO moves forward a step at a time, so try things incrementally.
Thanks for your responses everyone, I'm pleased that there's so far been support for the general idea, and I think it's the sort of thing that will make vo stand out from the other 'space simulator' type games (esp. eve, not that I have anything against eve, but I think it's in vo's interests to clearly stand out a a very different kettle of fish ).
I haven't done much in Deneb yet, what with my low survival rating and all, but I am now inspired when I get a proper block of time to see if I can rally up some Itani and Serco players, and arrange for a smackdown? What do you think? I've read the suggested thread above, and read other things about Deneb, but I'm a little unclear as to it's present layout (i.e. does it presently have player conquerable stations? What's the story at the moment with capital ships etc..). If someone would like to fill me in, especially on the bits I wouldn't find out by flying around there (assuming I'd survive long enough to see the colour of the sky)..
I'd be up for trying parts of my suggestion above in Deneb first though, although the thread mentioned above covered some of the same territory. Glad to hear that the developers thinking of heading in this general direction - I think it's the way to go :-)
I haven't done much in Deneb yet, what with my low survival rating and all, but I am now inspired when I get a proper block of time to see if I can rally up some Itani and Serco players, and arrange for a smackdown? What do you think? I've read the suggested thread above, and read other things about Deneb, but I'm a little unclear as to it's present layout (i.e. does it presently have player conquerable stations? What's the story at the moment with capital ships etc..). If someone would like to fill me in, especially on the bits I wouldn't find out by flying around there (assuming I'd survive long enough to see the colour of the sky)..
I'd be up for trying parts of my suggestion above in Deneb first though, although the thread mentioned above covered some of the same territory. Glad to hear that the developers thinking of heading in this general direction - I think it's the way to go :-)
I think davejohn has it correct.
The first step is simple: don't reset the sectors in Deneb. After all the sectors are taken, don't reset the sectors, but make the new missions attack/defense.