Um...I suggest that if you are a key holder to a station, and you kill/damage turrets or Station Guards while its under attack, you don't get KOS to your own station. Makes it kinda hard to defend if your attacking a player whos attacking your station and a station guard jumps in front of your fire. I mean turrets respawn at like 10-12% so even if you kill your own turrets you still kinda lose, and if you kill your own guards on purpose while its under attack you kinda lose more. So, I see no problem in taking away key holder KOS while the station is under attack. And I realize that you might think "well duh, if your killing your guards or turrets then the station is under attack so why even have KOS," but it could be set to come into effect if multiple turrets sustain a certain amount of damage so in order to exploit it you would have to do way more than it would take to just kill the guards and run and come back and pick up the loot.

No.

If you damage your own turret while 'defending' you aren't doing a very good job of defending.

Damaging a station guard, on the other hand, I can see happening more often unintentionally. Plus it seems like a potential exploit for the attackers to lead a station guard into the crossfire of a defender to get the turrets to attack the defender.

How about instead, if you shoot your own station guard, only that station guard will become hostile and return fire. Then you'd only become KOS if you actually kill the guard (or damage a turret). Isn't that more like how it works with station guards at regular stations anyway (outside the NFZ)?

If anything, the issue here calls for 'intent' to take some effect in whether a player is labeled as hostile. For example, if you damage a guard without targeting it (or if your missiles were not targeting the station guard that flew right in front of it) then you should not be designated as hostile.

In every instance where I have defended a station, I have never damaged a station guard or turret... and I am a lousy pilot. If there is anyone out there worse at handling a ship than me then they deserve what ever happens.

-1 to OP

Get out.

Well ryan reign, it helps if you survive long enough to be able to encounter said problem. But, back to those of you who know what I am talking about! Meridian, sometimes if your running around repairing your turrets you might accidentally bump one causing very little damage, but your still KOS and get insta-killed in the middle of the heated battle. Also, if you hit a station guard with a volley of swarms or a barrage of flares it dies pretty fast, so the same thing might still happen as most times I hit a station guard it absorbs the kill load meant for the player and it dies, so most of the time I hit a station guard it is dead. I do agree that at most stations you are KOS when you attack within the NFZ but these stations are different. Now, maybe if there was a SF that came out and attacked everyone in violation of the NFZ things would get interesting, but I really don't think that would be to fun for the defenders. Atice, I think your idea is much closer to what I am talking about. If I kill a station guard I am usually not targeting the guard, but I am targeting the player the guard is following and the guard just gets in the way. So, maybe change it so if your not targeting the station guard, you don't get KOS. And, if you do damage to a turret while either not targeting it or while equipped with only repair guns...then that would be awesome. Also, L-mines have been found to be a fun option during conquest, so if there is a way that you can think of to not KOS a player who L-mine kills a station guard, then that would be awesome too. Maybe even perhaps making it so if you use an L-mine you have the option of who it kills, maybe via people in the same group don't get killed. This would help up in deneb as well as I think after some changes it was no longer possible to not damage someone of the same faction with L-mines. Anyways, any thoughts?

i've bumped into them and been KoS'd but never shot them except once I was defending and only 1 turret was really low health so i blew it up, left the system and came back and those attacking bastards had to deal with a respawning turret 10 min later bwa ha haa haaaaa.

if the convoy escorts know enough not to attack you for running into them I don't see why the turrets shouldn't

I like the idea Jmvcilus. As for L-mines, better AI for avoiding friendly L-mines would be nice. Dunno how doable that is, however.

Also, Jmvcilus, use paragraphs. It helps.

spence asshats like you are exactly why it needs to be key removal for 24 hours, not just KOS (granted for that one id say eh kos for station guards..removal for turrets)

Jm you may not like it... but when you lmine the crap out of a station you are basically conceding that you cant defend it properly, and dont deserve to keep it.. This is not make Jmvcilus's gameplay easy so he can pwn...

the station guard bit was put in because it was retardedly easy to exploit for LAW's in the conquerable stations, thus besides having a station, the holder could farm laws with impunity giving him a massive advantage over everyone else. Even if the ships fired back... your repairs/ refills are free so youd just sit there and swarm the crap out of em..pick up the loot..etc etc this way you cant just sit there and kill them its better

Bump damage should not change IFF status. Anywhere. That includes roids. Damage persists, but it no longer make the "bumpers" into an enemies. As collision with capship while docking should not turn that cappie into enemy, fixed a little ago.

Yes, it is exploytable, but to a lesser extent than disturbing consequences of accidental collisions in combat, and also fixes reported problem of escorts attack you if you damage yourself and similar issues.

Since no NFZ in ConqSt, I prefer that when owner shoot his own guard, only that guard turns against him. BUT only if "expenses" are charged to station owner (=ship value) AND ConqSt guards uses only Neut2, to avoid N3 farming.

lol endercp12, My side isn't the only one using L-mines and of the multiple times they have been used I maybe laid a field once.
Also, I put in that there should be circumstances like "not targeting a station guard" or something so you still couldn't just sit there and kill them with no consequences endercp12. Lrn2Read.

Atice, I shall try to paragraph more.

Jm youre right youre NOT the only one using lmines, it doesnt mean its any better for you to do so. As for not targeting them lmine are untargeted they do damage to your friends thats part of learning how to use them properly. Thirdly i was explaining for the people that seemed to not understand why the guards caused a reaction, and last, but not at all least web speak abbreviations make you look juvenile and stupid if you have something to say, at least spell it all out

Why are L-mines bad? It seems like a perfectly legitimate tactic, especially if the defenders are severely outnumbered. I remember when stations were first introduced, before we had experience dealing with a mined dock, Chaos was defending by himself, mining the dock, and successfully preventing half a dozen attackers from docking. The mines are easily defeat-able if the attackers know what they're doing, so it's not an exploit or anything. It's just one of many options in a bag of tricks and it keeps things interesting.

strat didn't you just say in the last thread that stations shouldn't be able to be kept by small groups of people and they should have to band together into larger groups?

Like I said above, the mines are easily defeat-able if the attackers know what they're doing. I don't have an issue with L-mines. Sorry.

If lmines are smart enough to identify and attack ships (and not cargo or roids etc), why aren't they smart enough to have an IFF? They got nerfed pretty heavily in group fights by the friendly fire changes.

the reason its bad strat, is that one person can simply lmine the crap outa the station, then hide, untouchable and simply wait for the enemy to either die trying to run them, or simply launch stay in his lmine field and scoot over and take the station. Theres no defense involved, theres no interaction. With the station guards causing KOS however, the lminer has to wait now until its actually a last ditch effort, and cant sit there and comfortably rule the day uncontested

You do know that you can shoot mines, right?