Nuff said.

Its the frontier. Lawless and far from civilization. It aint downtown.

Sorry Pa, I'm not buying it. :-)

Perhaps I will go ahead and elaborate. Just by trading Odia / Bractus this morning, the lack of stations caused the routes that I consider adequate to dry up fast. Yes, I know there are 5 stations in Odia. However, 3 of them are barracks, which generally have a weak selection of trade items. The fact that I have been burned too many times makes me disinclined to take them up on the good deals I can find there on weapons (and yes, I used to trade weapons almost as often as commodities). So, as my routes dry up, I find that I become pushed into nation space to conduct my business. My understanding was that Pirates Online was revamping the structure of the game and its economy to push more profitable trade into Grey space. Currently, I'm experiencing the opposite effect.

I'm all for variety.

Let's put Reavers in Bractus. That would be interesting AND add variety!

I've always thought there should be MAJOR design differences between Itani/Serco/UIT/grayspace stations AND ships. But I also realize that the game doesn't have 4 artists/designers sitting around waiting for things to do.

The pirate stations would be more like mobile cruisers rather than stationary objects. You'd have to track them down.

Im with Pa, greyspace is lawless, it's not a metropolis.

If anything I think the stations should be well defended, warlord-like strongholds. Sort of a "safe haven" in hell kind of mentality, the one place where pirates and privateers would relax in the lawlessness of grey-space.

I also think you'd see more static and mobile defenses around them, and but I definitely think that would also include variety. These outposts are clearing houses for technology stolen or smuggled from all the other factions, to be sold on the black market.

I think jack up the prices a little for profiteering merchants, and expand the wares, but leave a relatively limited station selection.

While I like your description Pyroman, and would be willing to accept your suggestions as a partial solution, I could argue that Grey space should be home to even more stations than what you see in established nation space. If you look at any industry in its early years, you tend to find a huge number of competitors vying for a piece of the market. As the sector matures you those competitors either fail, merge or get bought out by larger competitors until you have a handful of competitors left. Ie. the auto, oil, pc and cell phone industries. If the idea really is that Grey consists of newly found and needed resources.... If not, I'll just head back into Serco space and make my fortune there. :P

That said, does it really make sense that Edras which is connected to two systems that have 4 or more stations each only has 1? That next door Pelatus has only one? Does it make sense that 3 out of 5 Odia stations are barracks? Is the hive that much worse there? Or that both stations in Bractus are barracks? What they heck are they defending? Again, Pelatus barracks. What about the xith? Finally, we see a mining station in Edras. Perhaps we don't necessarily need more stations, but redistributing some of the redundant ones and changing their types might balance things out a bit better.

That or start killing off unneeded systems like Betheshie, Pelatus, Bractus, Artana Aquilus, etc.

Edit: Ok, this was me being something of an ass. However seriously, some stations in grey and even in nationspace should be multipurpose.

There is a simple way to bring trade to grey.... eliminate the sale of all weapons from all grey stations so they must be trucked in by the players.....commodities only.

There is a simple way to bring trade to grey.... eliminate the sale of all weapons from all grey stations so they must be trucked in by the players.....commodities only.

worst. idea. ever.

maybe make them more expensive? but don't get rid of them.

"There is a simple way to bring trade to grey.... eliminate the sale of all weapons from all grey stations so they must be trucked in by the players.....commodities only."

Congrats... you just killed Grey space. However, there is an easy way to bring trade to Grey... two ways actually.

1. 98% of the traders grow a spine.

2. The devs introduce to either each system or station one to three unique items that sell for a minimum of twice the purchasing price in nation space.

Actually the two ideas work well in unison.

When the Devs finally stop thinking about how to make Grey "lucrative" and crush the spine of in-nation trading by making the max profits per hour accheviable less than 100,000 credits using an XC... then we'll see Grey get used. After the ores are re-distributed out of nation space? Even more use.

Noobs? Their gear is fairly cheap, so they don't need to make more than 100k per hour, even if they're fighting. Vets who want to RP national military folk? Most of their costs are currently covered by the BS system, as they should be.

The only people who need to make tens, if not hundreds, of millions of credits are plutocrats and outlaws. The former play the game to amass credits, and the latter by definition can't buy from legitimate sources. Oddly enough, those are the same two groups who should find themselves unable to play the game if they try and live most of their lives outside Grey.

Yeah I am sure a player controlled economy in grey would totally kill the game......

I have addressed this in another thread, but when the average number of active players is around 30, of which possibly 5 are bots at any given time. How many damned traders do you think there are actively running commodities? I normally would have said routes, but that aspect is dead. Grey space is being used. I see traders other than myself moving goods frequently. Including when groups like CLM or CHRN are active. Some of them in XC's. How many regular active players do you guys think actually see themselves as traders as their primary rp anyway?

Its time to face up to the fact that the real problem is lack of players. I lose confidence in VO every day because I don't believe that new player I just talked through a problem is really going to be here next week or even tomorrow.

That said, if you think I'm going to trade just so the pirate community has someone to target then brother, I want some of what your smokin.

Actually Lecter, the only cost effective way to do the border missions is to repair at the cap ships and not die. Ever. Anything less is a financial loss unless your flying freebies.

"Yeah I am sure a player controlled economy in grey would totally kill the game"

No, I'm certain it wouldn't.

"There is a simple way to bring trade to grey.... eliminate the sale of all weapons from all grey stations so they must be trucked in by the players.....commodities only."

However, the above ill conceived trip into "hippydom" would.

So you're saying to make stations by default sell nothing, and whatever players decide to take down there and sell goes into a limited inventory / display for sale? Be interesting if players could throw up their own prices which would then allow other players to move in and sell at even lower prices.

We can already sell stuff to each other at whatever price we want. The only reason to have the comodities is for the return trip. Removing the weapons from grey would mean Players would either haul stuff in themselves or pay a trader to haul it in. Instant trade in grey.. It would be nice to be able to sell it to the stations on consignment but not 100 percent required.

Eventually I would like to see the entire economy become player controlled but that is a long way off. Fluffy Is correct that the lack of traffic is due in part to the player base and in part because there is no real need for trade in grey.

It is a shame some people around here dont get the fact that as long as PVP is the sole reason to play VO the player base will never grow. Ruining Nationspace trade will not bring one thing to grey.... sorry.

Ruining Nationspace trade will not bring one thing to grey

Thanks for confirming my well-informed conclusion that your IQ is somewhere in the mid to high double digits.

Physician heal thyself.....

Hey PaKettle, theres a guy from Sigma Shipping here with 200 cubic units of "A Clue"™ in Dau.He needs you to sign for it. Apparently, like 98% of all traders he won't set foot in Grey because he's an inflexible coward.

All making people haul in their own weapons is going to do, is anger the PvP set and give pirates access to free weapons. Oh, wait... they could get some one to escort them, I sure hope the escort makes it the whole way against every pirate/guy wanting weapons between point a and point b.

All in all, I wonder how many weapons PaKettle has stockpiled in Grey already?