Currently the Devs introduce high profit trade runs to gray space. Which has had a limited success. I trade frequently in gray and on average I see very few traders. So, the simple solution is to increase the sale price of nation/faction goods in gray, adjusted by how deep...(or dangerous)...the system is. For example, X produced by UIT/Serco/Itan sells in gray for 2-5 times the purchase price. Conversly, items made only in gray systems sell in nation space for 3-7 times the purchase price.
(This would not apply to common items which can be purchased in gray and nation, only the items unique to a nation, area or subfaction.)

Now we are looking at serious profits. Most likely, high enough profits for "care bear" traders to leave the comfort and relative safety of nation space. Buy item X at a UIT station, sell in Sedina, purchace Sedina item Y and sell in Serco...etc...etc.

Or add more systems to Gray Space.

/me approves Surbius's idea

Wants expanded Grey AND more profits for traders willing to go on the more risky routes.

Surbius, I hear that's actually on the way...at some point...SOON(tm)

[2nd EDIT] Though it would really only bring more traders into gray if the profits from buying gray items to sell in nation space...(and visa versa) if the are worth the potential risk

Either way...larger profits AND expanded gray systems are good ideas.

[EDIT] I think it would be cool if the Devs did not actually tell players about new systems, rather let us find them on our own...lets face it, surprises are fun.

Back in the old day they did release new arease and not tell us.

they even had secret wormholes.

Once upon a time you had to line up 2 roids with holes in them while in full zoom then turbo through both to reach a secret sector.

"Once upon a time you had to line up 2 roids with holes in them while in full zoom then turbo through both to reach a secret sector."

Very very very very very cool!

Once upon a time the HAC was called a mere "Frigate" and it could insta-kill anything, anyone, anywhere.

I like the idea of expanded greyspace trade, but do not like the idea of expanding Greyspace unless the universe as a whole is expanded (ie: Dont carve off existing national space to make grey)

Pyroman_Ace
I tend to agree...thankfully, there is a lot of very empty space out there. Though I do look forward to a time when nation space can be gained and taken.

No, I think the correct route is to lower possible profit margins in Nation/Safe space.

Jack up the prices in Grey, and you're really cutting into what the potential price difference will be between Old/Tame Grey and "New" Coming-Soon(tm) Grey.

Of course, in addition to lowering possible trade returns in Nationspace, it would be great to see all the ship, item, and repair costs -- for everything -- go up an entire decimal place. Basically, people have been hoarding credits for waaaaay too long.

VO needs hyperinflation.

While I agree with expanding grey space, I do not think this is the time. We need more active players before that would be worth while imo.

And while this is will be an unpopular and unwanted suggested (including my own distaste for it) reducing systems by about 1/3 for each set would probably generate more interaction at this point.

K. I'm done. Flame away.

But seriously, I see very few people trading on any of my chars. There are only two players I regularly see in an XC. One PA and one TGFT. I am seeing more of the new mining moths flying about, but they don't seem to be doing more than single trips or traveling to a mining sector. I'm also not seeing moths used for trade in grey. Mostly what I see are newbs in low end ships like the base revenant, trying to get at the good stuff instead of building their licenses. So this is why I sit and pop incoming voys at the Dau / Nyrius wh. At least there I can count on some profitable traffic. Bottom line, like everyone insults me with, I'm more of a trader than most of VO.

Which to me means, we need reasons for players to become traders before we lure them anywhere.

Ok. I'm really done now. Flame away.

I like the idea of expanded greyspace trade, but do not like the idea of expanding Greyspace unless the universe as a whole is expanded
I'm with FistOfRage here. If we expand greyspace... there will be little effect except that we will see FEWER players in grey than we already do. If anything, the rats should be asking for grey to shrink by 1/3rd so the traders that do fly into grey are more easily found (not that I would ever suggest such a thing).

I think we need a serious shift in the economic shift. I feel like many of the vital alloys and raw materials and the like should be purchasable only in grey. At that point, the factions would HAVE to send convoys (and hopefully player traders as well) into grey. Also, it shouldn't be beyond imagination to say that the subfaction stations in grey are there for a profit. Despite the risk of trading and existing in greyspace, these subfactions built stations out there because that is where vital material X is that they need to make very expensive product that many of their UIT-based stations need to do Y. There should be many more high-end items (that many stations request) that are ONLY available in Grey space. This would semi-shaft the serco and the itani, but as their societies are not based on trade, it would be understandable that they buy those necessary goods from UIT-stations at a hyper-inflated price (at which point the chokepoints of edras and ukari become far more interesting).

On a somewhat separate note, retrieval missions should pay a LOT more (vs procurements, where you can load/undock/dock complete mission, repeat).

One word. Manufacturing.

Let this be said, if only once: This game needs more players. VO has a range of players that it can support, somewhere between 50 and 3,000 would be my guess. We are on the bottom of that range at the moment, and if the game were being regularly played by 500 players, the gameplay dynamics would change a lot. (same for 2,000 players).

We need to focus on what makes the game appealing to new players, and what causes them to stay/leave and optimize in the right direction. Eventually the devs will need to eat again, and when that happens I don't want to see VO sold to some big corporate stooge.

More players = the growth of the game and the flexibility to try new things.

my 4c...

Part of what will keep new players here is not only tuning the beginner experience, but giving some meaning to endgame play. Right now there's dueling, player run events, and if you enjoy hive skirmish/CtC/border skirmish. The manufactoring system and reason to trade in grey needs to come. A lot of people like working their way to the top in an mmo, and right now credits beyond a certain point are just for the sake of 'maybe they'll be needed someday'.

A lot of people like working their way to the top in an mmo
The only problem with that is that working one's way to the top involves a lot of grinding. One of the things many of us love about VO is that the top players are the top not because of how much they've played or how many missions they have taken, but rather because of how well they can control their ship. I agree we need some more "end-game" things to work towards, but I would hate for them all to be "grinding" based.

I think Lecter's spot on. My only concern is that such a 'broadband punishment' will punish the new players and the not-so-wealthy more harshly, since they have no hoards to speak of. But perhaps it'd even out.

Let's try it?

Sorry but it wont work. It is not about the money. It is the lack of any real purpose to it. There simply is no real reason to go to grey. The only really unique things in grey are pvp and proc missions for a few factions.

Maybe just more items found only in gray, which would naturally sell for significant profits in nation space.

It's not a grind if you enjoy the game on your way there.