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Its ok if no one else can see your vote mute count but can you change it so the person can see their own count. That way people will know when they are close.
i think thats the point ...
vote mute needs work. For a good portion of hours every day it's completely useless, as there's less than the 20 people needed to actually mute someone online.
Okay so we can use /ignore. Great. That just means the idiot mouthing off can say anything about us and we won't even know what's said, or be able to respond. Sure, we don't have to be bothered by whatever the idiot in question is saying, but we get to look like a pussy if we're the ones targeted by him (for not responding to whatever, standing up for ourselves.)
I'm willing to accept that most of the time VO doesn't have serious issues with this, but the last few days (since I've come back to it) certain people are taking it too far (ikillyou mainly.) People like this who come online to do nothing but flood 100 with obscenities should just be banned, then we wouldn't need to argue the great Mute vs. Ignore debate.
To the devs, if you keep chatlogs of 100, do a quick search of the player "ikillyou" and I think you'll agree this is not the image you want for VO.
Okay so we can use /ignore. Great. That just means the idiot mouthing off can say anything about us and we won't even know what's said, or be able to respond. Sure, we don't have to be bothered by whatever the idiot in question is saying, but we get to look like a pussy if we're the ones targeted by him (for not responding to whatever, standing up for ourselves.)
I'm willing to accept that most of the time VO doesn't have serious issues with this, but the last few days (since I've come back to it) certain people are taking it too far (ikillyou mainly.) People like this who come online to do nothing but flood 100 with obscenities should just be banned, then we wouldn't need to argue the great Mute vs. Ignore debate.
To the devs, if you keep chatlogs of 100, do a quick search of the player "ikillyou" and I think you'll agree this is not the image you want for VO.
At some point, it becomes difficult to protect people from themselves.
People that are afraid to use ignore, because they might miss something said about them, and feel the need to defend themselves from trivia, are the primary prey of trolls. But it might take extraordinary measures to protect these kinds of people. At some point, it is easier to fix the victims, rather than the offenders.
Please grow up.
People that are afraid to use ignore, because they might miss something said about them, and feel the need to defend themselves from trivia, are the primary prey of trolls. But it might take extraordinary measures to protect these kinds of people. At some point, it is easier to fix the victims, rather than the offenders.
Please grow up.
The troll defending trolling. You've a long history of it here Roda, in fact you were the main reason I stopped paying for this game months ago.
Just because you and a handful of others would like to see this game stay at a population of less than 50...
I swear the best thing the devs could do would be to declare this a private game for the little Cult of VO, and shut down new membership. It's not like the community has or will ever grow the way things are going.
What I saw going on today in 100 was just ridiculous. The same thing, with the same person behind it, a couple days ago. This is crying out for some small ounce of moderation. It's a Pay to Play game, that requires some service to keep it enjoyable for everyone, and not just for you.
Just because you and a handful of others would like to see this game stay at a population of less than 50...
I swear the best thing the devs could do would be to declare this a private game for the little Cult of VO, and shut down new membership. It's not like the community has or will ever grow the way things are going.
What I saw going on today in 100 was just ridiculous. The same thing, with the same person behind it, a couple days ago. This is crying out for some small ounce of moderation. It's a Pay to Play game, that requires some service to keep it enjoyable for everyone, and not just for you.
Please stay on topic you can argue about that some where else..
Armonia: Don't you think people should be able to see their own count? Thats all i was asking for.
Armonia: Don't you think people should be able to see their own count? Thats all i was asking for.
Okay sorry for something of a hijack. I see the whole vote mute thing as a bigger issue. :/
To answer you directly, showing one's own vote count makes it too easy to abuse. Basically an ill intentioned player can spam until he hits 17, 18, 19 even, then shut up til the next day, and get away with it.
I do think that showing others the count when they use the vote mute function is beneficial though. It adds some visual evidence that it really does count, and some feedback that when they make that decision they're not alone in it.
To answer you directly, showing one's own vote count makes it too easy to abuse. Basically an ill intentioned player can spam until he hits 17, 18, 19 even, then shut up til the next day, and get away with it.
I do think that showing others the count when they use the vote mute function is beneficial though. It adds some visual evidence that it really does count, and some feedback that when they make that decision they're not alone in it.
tbh, no. the reason:
"oh shit, i have 19 votes, i better behave now..."
the bigger man walks away, if someone is talking shit and you dont respond, you actually look/sound more mature. don't stoop to their level.
/me agrees with roda ... grow up.
"oh shit, i have 19 votes, i better behave now..."
the bigger man walks away, if someone is talking shit and you dont respond, you actually look/sound more mature. don't stoop to their level.
/me agrees with roda ... grow up.
Armonia: "/me agrees with roda ... grow up."
Fine. Then Guild should post on the registration page that this game is UNMODERATED. In big bold letters. It's shameful and disgusting the level of crap I witnessed in 100 yesterday. For any Pay to Play game to ignore that kind of user, well, they don't deserve the money then.
I give up. The core players hate the idea of new players (but seem to adore their spammers and trolls), Guild seems to share or at least placate that viewpoint, the moderation policy (which only consists of locking forum topics whenever it gets too real around here) sucks... Devs, enjoy that $10, it's the last you're ever going to see from me (which again, is what your core players want anyway.)
Fine. Then Guild should post on the registration page that this game is UNMODERATED. In big bold letters. It's shameful and disgusting the level of crap I witnessed in 100 yesterday. For any Pay to Play game to ignore that kind of user, well, they don't deserve the money then.
I give up. The core players hate the idea of new players (but seem to adore their spammers and trolls), Guild seems to share or at least placate that viewpoint, the moderation policy (which only consists of locking forum topics whenever it gets too real around here) sucks... Devs, enjoy that $10, it's the last you're ever going to see from me (which again, is what your core players want anyway.)
must...not...lock...THREAD
That's a bit heavy with the hyperbole there Lonely Trader. It's true, the game is often not moderated by guides. I'm on at least daily, but have not witnessed anything mutable or bannable in quite some time (and I apparently was not on when the person you referenced was spouting off). There's a thin line between moderation and oppression, and it seems that line shift with one's own perspective. VO may be a bit too far on the permissive side of that line for you today. On the other hand, it's interesting to me how many people change their mind when I've dealt with THEIR behavior.
That's a bit heavy with the hyperbole there Lonely Trader. It's true, the game is often not moderated by guides. I'm on at least daily, but have not witnessed anything mutable or bannable in quite some time (and I apparently was not on when the person you referenced was spouting off). There's a thin line between moderation and oppression, and it seems that line shift with one's own perspective. VO may be a bit too far on the permissive side of that line for you today. On the other hand, it's interesting to me how many people change their mind when I've dealt with THEIR behavior.
One of the ways this problem could be solved is with more guides. The devs know that more guides are needed, though when they will have time to get to addressing it is another issue.
Heh, just saw that Whistler added to his comment. I would agree with what he said, and go on to say that I did see what ikillyou was spouting, and he did deserve a mute/ban. It was the most clear-cut example I'd seen in a long time. It wasn't so much talking shit as being an unending fountain of rancid faeces, over everything he could reach. In short, exactly what muting was made for. In a lot of cases I think muting is not necessary, but in this instance I absolutely have to side with Lonely Trader.
And some of us core players really like new players. I do what I can whenever I can to help them out. Hell, I'm writing a mission string right now for newer players. I think the phenomenon you're seeing here is that some of the loudest voices are the angriest voices that tend to spill over into trollish territory. Which is alright as far as it goes, but especially in this case it is too shortsighted. This community has had issues in the past with muting and whether or not people deserved it, and I think some people forget that we occasionally get real, honest to goodness trolls in here, and the best thing for everyone is that they get muted. I mean, come on, we're supposed to have a great community here. I think we do, but telling people to grow up because they don't like unadulterated filth being poured out on 100 is not my idea of good community.
Heh, just saw that Whistler added to his comment. I would agree with what he said, and go on to say that I did see what ikillyou was spouting, and he did deserve a mute/ban. It was the most clear-cut example I'd seen in a long time. It wasn't so much talking shit as being an unending fountain of rancid faeces, over everything he could reach. In short, exactly what muting was made for. In a lot of cases I think muting is not necessary, but in this instance I absolutely have to side with Lonely Trader.
And some of us core players really like new players. I do what I can whenever I can to help them out. Hell, I'm writing a mission string right now for newer players. I think the phenomenon you're seeing here is that some of the loudest voices are the angriest voices that tend to spill over into trollish territory. Which is alright as far as it goes, but especially in this case it is too shortsighted. This community has had issues in the past with muting and whether or not people deserved it, and I think some people forget that we occasionally get real, honest to goodness trolls in here, and the best thing for everyone is that they get muted. I mean, come on, we're supposed to have a great community here. I think we do, but telling people to grow up because they don't like unadulterated filth being poured out on 100 is not my idea of good community.
I am glad the devs removed the count info from the vote, and I think we should try it this way for a while to see how well it works.
Sorry your thread is getting hijacked, but it is.
I think ikillyou should have been muted. Instead, I ignored him and promptly forgot he even existed.
Vote is a tool. Ignore is a tool. Ignore is to protect you. Vote is to protect others. If your feelings get hurt, use ignore. Refusing to use ignore is demonstrating your weakness for trolls.
Someone will always disagree with any decision made, no matter what decision is made, and putting guides in the middle of this issue is a fast way to add flame targets. Better ideas on how to provide players with better tools to deal with trolls is far more valuable than any number of guides.
Sorry your thread is getting hijacked, but it is.
I think ikillyou should have been muted. Instead, I ignored him and promptly forgot he even existed.
Vote is a tool. Ignore is a tool. Ignore is to protect you. Vote is to protect others. If your feelings get hurt, use ignore. Refusing to use ignore is demonstrating your weakness for trolls.
Someone will always disagree with any decision made, no matter what decision is made, and putting guides in the middle of this issue is a fast way to add flame targets. Better ideas on how to provide players with better tools to deal with trolls is far more valuable than any number of guides.
Imho, guides, when online, deal with trolls and other offenders quite effectively.
VO would benefit with more active guides.
When there are no guides present, players have to deal with offenders themselves using tools at their disposal (ignore & mute).
Sometimes things can get out of hand and they turn into a muting lynch mob.
I found "/ignore" to be the best option available to players ingame.
Instant peace and tranquility.
VO would benefit with more active guides.
When there are no guides present, players have to deal with offenders themselves using tools at their disposal (ignore & mute).
Sometimes things can get out of hand and they turn into a muting lynch mob.
I found "/ignore" to be the best option available to players ingame.
Instant peace and tranquility.
im just curious if you guys think this should be a utopia ?
people will be belligerent, rude.. whatever. tbh, i dont agree with vote mute, who are any of us to tell the player he cant speak to anybody? /ignore is just as affective, and if everybody he is offending /ignore him, it would be the same as muting. he can still fly around, he can still shoot you and he can still terrorize the universe. this whole 'we have the best community' has gone to your heads. yes, we have many, many, many nice people in our community, but we need to have EVERYBODY in this game to help it explode. core players do not want this game to stay at 50 players, however, imo, i think they should stfu and let people play. none of us have the right to ban a player, maybe a guide or a dev, but that is a tough decision. this is not VendettaOnlineUtopiaforMetobehappy.com if you go to grey, you will be shot. you will be harrassed. all of the CORE players should be more willing to help new players (since guides are scarce and cant be applied for, and you need to have a signature from god to be one. but i will not go on about that)
Lonely Trader: VO IS unmoderated to an extent ... isnt every mmo?
conclusion: stop bitching and /ignore
people will be belligerent, rude.. whatever. tbh, i dont agree with vote mute, who are any of us to tell the player he cant speak to anybody? /ignore is just as affective, and if everybody he is offending /ignore him, it would be the same as muting. he can still fly around, he can still shoot you and he can still terrorize the universe. this whole 'we have the best community' has gone to your heads. yes, we have many, many, many nice people in our community, but we need to have EVERYBODY in this game to help it explode. core players do not want this game to stay at 50 players, however, imo, i think they should stfu and let people play. none of us have the right to ban a player, maybe a guide or a dev, but that is a tough decision. this is not VendettaOnlineUtopiaforMetobehappy.com if you go to grey, you will be shot. you will be harrassed. all of the CORE players should be more willing to help new players (since guides are scarce and cant be applied for, and you need to have a signature from god to be one. but i will not go on about that)
Lonely Trader: VO IS unmoderated to an extent ... isnt every mmo?
conclusion: stop bitching and /ignore
Well, Armonia, if you take away all the moderation then trolls will discover they can blither away in 100 to their hearts' content. As well as specifically target anyone who reacts. Whether you like it or not, there is a rough standard for moderation that most online games seem to try to adhere to, which is what Lonely Trader was probably talking about. It's not written down or anything, it's just there to stop blatant trolls from turning chat into garbage.
Going down this road a little bit further, you say that you can use /ignore to not see what someone is saying. That's fine, as far as it goes, but what about new players who arrive and see a stream of filth on 100 going entirely unchallenged? It wouldn't have deterred me from getting to know the game, but hell, I turned off chat for the first few days because all I really cared about was the flight system, and everything else was just icing. Most new players aren't going to be like that. They're not going to know how to ignore people, and so everyone else is going to be blindly talking about something else while the newbie is wondering what is wrong with everyone. Some will stick it out, and some will not. That doesn't mean that that's a desirable outcome.
And to agree with you on a point, as I posted earlier I think there should definitely be more guides to handle these kinds of situations. I had a talk with Inc recently about pretty much exactly this topic, and we'll see where it goes.
Oh, and as a last point, on the topic of banning players vs "stfu and let people play" I don't think we should ban players who want to play. The people in question are the ones who come in with the sole purpose of trolling on 100. peytros might be an ass sometimes, but he's absolutely a valid player, and he doesn't even deserve to be muted most of the time (to use a single current example).
Going down this road a little bit further, you say that you can use /ignore to not see what someone is saying. That's fine, as far as it goes, but what about new players who arrive and see a stream of filth on 100 going entirely unchallenged? It wouldn't have deterred me from getting to know the game, but hell, I turned off chat for the first few days because all I really cared about was the flight system, and everything else was just icing. Most new players aren't going to be like that. They're not going to know how to ignore people, and so everyone else is going to be blindly talking about something else while the newbie is wondering what is wrong with everyone. Some will stick it out, and some will not. That doesn't mean that that's a desirable outcome.
And to agree with you on a point, as I posted earlier I think there should definitely be more guides to handle these kinds of situations. I had a talk with Inc recently about pretty much exactly this topic, and we'll see where it goes.
Oh, and as a last point, on the topic of banning players vs "stfu and let people play" I don't think we should ban players who want to play. The people in question are the ones who come in with the sole purpose of trolling on 100. peytros might be an ass sometimes, but he's absolutely a valid player, and he doesn't even deserve to be muted most of the time (to use a single current example).
Whistler: thank you for not locking the thread but i think its gone to off topic to be saved :( you can lock it now :(
I do hope that one day someone can start a /vote mute thread about a specific change and the responses will be on that specific topic.
I do hope that one day someone can start a /vote mute thread about a specific change and the responses will be on that specific topic.
JB, I think that as others have said, letting the offender see his number of votes is not a real good idea. Gives them a point to work towards and then back off. Letting the voter see the count when they vote would be helpful. Don't let up on your thread. Good debate is healthy, even if it is off topic:)
As far as what happened yesterday...there is a big difference betweeen your normal "troll" and "ikillyou". "ikillyou" was completely out of line, using racial slurs and the like for the amusment of himself. I was thinking having receintly read the terms, he should have been banned. While I tend to let offensive comments roll off, not everyone should be asked to put up with it. I didn't /ignore since I usually just ignore that crap by default, but I could really see how someone could have taken offense to what he was saying.
As far as what happened yesterday...there is a big difference betweeen your normal "troll" and "ikillyou". "ikillyou" was completely out of line, using racial slurs and the like for the amusment of himself. I was thinking having receintly read the terms, he should have been banned. While I tend to let offensive comments roll off, not everyone should be asked to put up with it. I didn't /ignore since I usually just ignore that crap by default, but I could really see how someone could have taken offense to what he was saying.
/leave 100
Problem solved.
Problem solved.
I was successfully muted on Saturday and I found it to be a pleasant and rewarding experience.
It was sad, too, because as soon as I was muted, Sherpa logged in and I wanted to say "HI". (Hi Sherpa!) So, meh.
I could not talk in normal chat, sector chat, system chat, group chat or anything. I could not use voice in group thru teamspeak. I could not post in the forums. However, I could still talk in BAR chat. If you're being thorough, might as well cut that out as well. In most instances, though, /ignore or /leave 100 will work better.
It gave me peace and quiet, and enough time to get ready for the Super Bowl, which was actually a damn good game this year. Thought the Cards might pull it out.
P.S. To be clear I was actually ASKING to be muted, since I've never been muted and I'd like to see what the fuss is about.
It was sad, too, because as soon as I was muted, Sherpa logged in and I wanted to say "HI". (Hi Sherpa!) So, meh.
I could not talk in normal chat, sector chat, system chat, group chat or anything. I could not use voice in group thru teamspeak. I could not post in the forums. However, I could still talk in BAR chat. If you're being thorough, might as well cut that out as well. In most instances, though, /ignore or /leave 100 will work better.
It gave me peace and quiet, and enough time to get ready for the Super Bowl, which was actually a damn good game this year. Thought the Cards might pull it out.
P.S. To be clear I was actually ASKING to be muted, since I've never been muted and I'd like to see what the fuss is about.
There will come a time when 20 individuals who might be considered griefers congregate, and use the /vote mute system to enforce their ideals. Perhaps that time is even now. I look forward to a VO where everyone speaks in bar chat.