After what I saw ingame, it got me thinking, why can a UiT pilot attack an Itani pilot, while he is in a group, working for itani, let me explain the scenario that happened, from a 3rd party. (its kinda sad, really, and im not looking for a flamewar)

Ok, so some Itani has been BPing all day, and I mean all day. And then he tells some people he is doing, looking for a group, well, because of his attitude, (or something, its 3rd party) another Itani logs in, decides he's killing the bots too fast, (ie, faster than he can) and decides to call in a UiT friend to kill him. (they didnt manage this, from what I can tell, but well...)

Only fix to this I can see to this is make the BP sector monitored by both Serco and Itani.

But this is sad.

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oh, and dont give me any of this UiT can do anything RP crap, this is an Itani using a UiT to kill an Itani, both in good standing, and he refused to invite the 1st Itani to his group, fits right in with rp eh?

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Maybe give UiT a different mission and exclude em from the in game bonus, of course, people could still get UiT involved for cold hard cash :) but that is an exploit of the crap faction system if nothing else.

actually yoda, your last sentence pretty much sums it up.

its the faction/reputation system thats screwed up, and incarnate knows about it. all we can do for now is be patient.

how does this stop me from killing people?

It doesnt Target 13, but you would lose Itani faction for killing an admired Itani.

@Spell, i know the faction system is borked, quick fix for bp (its pretty popular at times) would be to make the sector montiored, simple as this.

UiT would only be affected if they shot someone on their own side. They should already be hated by the other faction. (no way to gain it back but trade)

Itani would gain Itani standing for Serco kills, and lose Serco standing, and vice versa. (If a Serco/Itani shot an admired UiT with respected faction, they would lose it, but could gain it back by killing a few Serco/Itani, or trade)

Maybe make it a 300 point loss, like a sub faction, fits right in with the game as it is _now_ imho.

i dont like that cuz if im using flares and i hit someone that is itani that would suck

It also sucks more when you and your tani friend decide you dont like the other itani that is bping, that sucks more :P

It's not cool when people behave badly.

What should have been Itani working with Itani working with UIT was Itani and UIT working against Itani.

It wasn't cool at all.

/me nods

Oh so that's why......

-.-;

I totally agree with yodaofborg on this one.

I do as well.

I agree it's a problem, but I do not agree that severely penalizing players ho take part in BP is the answer. the BP sector should remain unmonitored, because, quite frankly, losing all your standing the moment you begin participating is not cool.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again; Friendly Fire regulations need to be fixed. do that, and things like this become less of a problem. If you want to keep FF regs in capitol systems and in the NFZ of nation stations, that's fine... but get rid of them, or reduce their effectiveness everywhere else, please.

I'd like to see ordinance made to only detonate on unfriendly same-nation players when in nation space, but there should be no magic feild protecting them when it detonates nearby...

But you would have low standing in the one that would drop anyway Cunjo? Think about it, a UiT BPing for Itani _cannot_ have good Serco faction. (and would only lose Itani if he blasted an Itani) , and vice versa.

So there's a Itani or UIT that thinks that someone is on a killing spree and feels remorse for the serco pilots being killed. Who's to say they shouldn't be able to stop it?

The BP sector shouldn't be monitored b/c it's effectively gray space. I think that all of Deneb should be an ion storm due to the constant use of the wormholes in that area though =P

The BP sector is NOT effectively grey space: it's very much nation space. The objective in Border Patrol is to defend (or attack) the nation's border: if it's grey space, not nation space, then why is it being defended?

Rather than having it always monitored, I'd like there to be certain things players could do to make it monitored: deploy a sensors package in the sector, build a long-range sensors module in a station & have it target the sector, etc. I'd like it to be that way for all monitored space, not just the BP sector. I started writing up some thoughts on how monitored space should be monitored, but I don't think I ever posted it....

[edit]
Now it's posted: http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/11918
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I agree with Cunjo because some players like to keep their standing near -600 so they can easily knock it one way or the other. Yoda's way would make these folks all KOS if they played BP at all.

--Harpo

So if they chose a side in the war they would have to actually choose a side in the war.

Odd. That makes perfect sense!

Everyone now is too used to being able to be on good terms with everyone, and being able to earn back good fortunes with ease. That's not the way the game should be, or I think is meant to be, played.

This is an RPG without roles. One big reason for that is that you never, ever have to make a choice that you can't fix with a few hours work (with the exception of going under -600 for a grey space corporation). If you are UIT, and decide to join a war, you should become aligned with whoever you join and hated by who you oppose.

I'm gonna totally agree with Starfisher here. You are aiding the Itani in WAR by killing hundreds of Serco ships. Its not like the Serco are supposed to easily forgive you for that. If it was anything close to real life, you would _never_ become trusted by the Serco again. If you don't want to lose reputation with the Serco... then don't go to war against them!

The thing is, UIT players want to be able to play both sides: that's part of the attaction to choosing UIT. And in some ways I think UIT should be able to actively participate on both sides of the war - but the BP mission is not one of them (at least, not in its current incarnation). Essentially how I see it is there are two catagories of actions in the war: overt and covert. The BP mission and other such fly-around-and-blow-Serco-or-Itani-up are clearly overt actions, and as such cannot be hidden from or ignored by the Itani or Serco, and therefore should have direct and immediate consequences on standing.

But eventually I'd love to see more COVERT ways UIT could participate in the war. These would be secretive, off-the-record actions, that could be hidden from or ignored by the Itani or Serco, and so would not necessarily have immediate consequences on standing. Things like arms trading, smuggling, espionage, counter-espionage, etc. Say a UIT player owns a station that specializes in producing a variant of the TPG Sparrow Blaster, with more mass but also higher velocity. A militant Serco guild places an order for 50 of these blasters, to be delivered no later than <X> date to <Y> station. The operator of the station fulfills the order - and then turns around and sells the information "Be wary of an attack by 25 to 50 SVGs shortly after <X>" to an Itani guild with the closest station to <Y>. Now the UIT has made a nice tidy profit off both the Itani and Serco, and since the Itani don't (officially) know that they sold the weapons to the Serco for the attack, and the Serco don't (officially) know that they tipped the Itani off, the UIT keeps his good standing with both - as long as the covert acts against the Itani/Serco remain either undiscovered, or else balanced by covert acts FOR the Itani/Serco, so that they think they are getting more help than the other side.