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Should 'AI wingmen' be allowed in the Nation War event?
There was some talk today about whether or not "bots" (AI wingmen) should be allowed in the Nation War.
Presently, Furies can be constructed and used as 'AI wingmen' (up to 3), and there is also a mission at Orion, available at Combat license 6, that allows one to hire up to 6 Centurions or Vultures. There is nothing in the current Nation War rules against using these, but I am interested in making the Nation War the most fun and accessible event it can be.
Nation War has been running for a long time and though the use of 'AI wingmen' has never been prohibited, I rarely see people use them. However, if their use is detrimental to the overall "fun" of the event, I'd like to hear about it and why.
Quite simply, what are people's thoughts on introducing a rule that either limits or eliminates the use of 'AI wingmen' (Furies and Squadrons) in the Nation War?
To be clear, this is not about the AI wingmen themselves, only whether or not they should be allowed in the context of the Nation War.
Let's keep the discussion civil, please.
Presently, Furies can be constructed and used as 'AI wingmen' (up to 3), and there is also a mission at Orion, available at Combat license 6, that allows one to hire up to 6 Centurions or Vultures. There is nothing in the current Nation War rules against using these, but I am interested in making the Nation War the most fun and accessible event it can be.
Nation War has been running for a long time and though the use of 'AI wingmen' has never been prohibited, I rarely see people use them. However, if their use is detrimental to the overall "fun" of the event, I'd like to hear about it and why.
Quite simply, what are people's thoughts on introducing a rule that either limits or eliminates the use of 'AI wingmen' (Furies and Squadrons) in the Nation War?
To be clear, this is not about the AI wingmen themselves, only whether or not they should be allowed in the context of the Nation War.
Let's keep the discussion civil, please.
they're available to anyone unlike the scp/valk/udv so I says sure why not; doesn't hurt anyone and they're not that hard to deal with.
My reservation is that they introduce npcs to a pvp event, and it reduces the focus on individual skill and collective strategy. Nonetheless I think it's great to test and see how it's appreciated or not over the course of a few nws
Totally against this.
Its a pvp event and bots shouldnt be introduced. Once one player brings them often enough other players will follow suit and then instead of a nation war we have a clusterfuck of bots.
Three years I have been attending every nationwar I can and have only seen them once before last week. Everyone agreed it was a bullshit move the first time which is why it didnt become the norm.
Let it run for a few weeks and see how it goes but I'll keep to my word and wont participate if anyone brings them. I dont and never have came to the nation war to shoot bots, I can do that any other time.
Personally I think that they should be outright banned. Or if not then at least limited like capship usage. As in has to be equally balanced across all teams.
One team (or player if it goes ffa) with a capship has an unfair advantage, hence the rule. Same is true for furies/squadrons, its not as much of an advantage granted but its still there. So why have rules to keep things balanced if they dont apply across the board.
Its a pvp event and bots shouldnt be introduced. Once one player brings them often enough other players will follow suit and then instead of a nation war we have a clusterfuck of bots.
Three years I have been attending every nationwar I can and have only seen them once before last week. Everyone agreed it was a bullshit move the first time which is why it didnt become the norm.
Let it run for a few weeks and see how it goes but I'll keep to my word and wont participate if anyone brings them. I dont and never have came to the nation war to shoot bots, I can do that any other time.
Personally I think that they should be outright banned. Or if not then at least limited like capship usage. As in has to be equally balanced across all teams.
One team (or player if it goes ffa) with a capship has an unfair advantage, hence the rule. Same is true for furies/squadrons, its not as much of an advantage granted but its still there. So why have rules to keep things balanced if they dont apply across the board.
What about limiting bots to every nation war ending in a 7? Is there a downside to something like this?
Only downside to only allowing every ten nation wars is people who pay attention and manage to remember the rule will have an advantage; big whoop. (Probably won't affect me because I'll manage to show up late.)
I don't see an issue with the current rules but given the feedback fuck it ban em; it's gonna piss off the handful of folks who use them though.
Alternatively you could impose a penalty for bringing them; if your team fielded furies you halve the payout or something?
I don't see an issue with the current rules but given the feedback fuck it ban em; it's gonna piss off the handful of folks who use them though.
Alternatively you could impose a penalty for bringing them; if your team fielded furies you halve the payout or something?
Introducing a penalty for bringing AI wingmen is an interesting idea, but it doesn't really get to the root of the issue: space999999 brings up a good point in that having a number of AI wingmen kiting anything that hits you "reduces the focus on individual skill".
Nation War has historically been an event that focuses on the dynamics of combat between human pilots. AI wingmen have never been prohibited, but people... just don't use them most of the time, either because they are not aware they exist, don't have access to them (although players of all nations can get the same types of wingmen, currently), or because it goes against the 'spirit of the event'. That's what I'm trying to determine here: what is Nation War really about (i.e. what makes it the most fun and engaging)?
Rather than trying to balance the presence of AI wingmen (the 'power factor' of which may change due to other gameplay developments), if I'm going to introduce a new rule I'd rather simply ban them or allow them only on special occasions.
Nation War has historically been an event that focuses on the dynamics of combat between human pilots. AI wingmen have never been prohibited, but people... just don't use them most of the time, either because they are not aware they exist, don't have access to them (although players of all nations can get the same types of wingmen, currently), or because it goes against the 'spirit of the event'. That's what I'm trying to determine here: what is Nation War really about (i.e. what makes it the most fun and engaging)?
Rather than trying to balance the presence of AI wingmen (the 'power factor' of which may change due to other gameplay developments), if I'm going to introduce a new rule I'd rather simply ban them or allow them only on special occasions.
Fuck it ban em.
I can see issues with players pressuring other players not to bring them because of the penalty and I figure you deal with enough shit as is to boot.
I can see issues with players pressuring other players not to bring them because of the penalty and I figure you deal with enough shit as is to boot.
I think you hit the nail on the head with the "spirit of the event" thing.
to me the Nation War is a sporting event, like an exhibition match. Its an event defined by its rules, thats what makes it different from standard PVP.
like any other sporting event, equipment or computer aids quickly get regulated out to keep the competition about human skill. think traction control in motor racing, sharksuits (not the inflatable ones) lasted one year at the olympics, etc.
bringing ai wingmen to a pvp game of skill just isnt sporting.
it just isnt cricket, to use an old English saying.
to me the Nation War is a sporting event, like an exhibition match. Its an event defined by its rules, thats what makes it different from standard PVP.
like any other sporting event, equipment or computer aids quickly get regulated out to keep the competition about human skill. think traction control in motor racing, sharksuits (not the inflatable ones) lasted one year at the olympics, etc.
bringing ai wingmen to a pvp game of skill just isnt sporting.
it just isnt cricket, to use an old English saying.