Forums » Role Playing
Hmmm.
I want to express my appreciation to you guys for providing this free advertisement and recommendation for newer players to TGFT. My appreciation is somewhat lackluster due to the Role Playing forum being completely irrelevant, but it does exist.
I would like to see two things with respect to this plugin- even as a TGFT member who uses this plugin on all of his characters.
1) A disclaimer regarding the character data being collected
2) Eventual development of a login system where players can choose to actively participate in it's use.
That said, I hardly think this is any more risky than using other guild specific plugins that ping the guild server even when not logged in. While it may not be transmitting specific character data, I suspect the players IP address along with known active players at the time or other information could be used to correlate player alts. But I trust the leadership of each of the guilds my characters are members of, and so far as I can tell they trust me with the data that their respective proprietary plugins provide in that I am not going to use the plugin in such a way as to undermine the guild's interests.
Moreover, as far as I can tell, this plugin is only directly available from the TGFT forums as a shared guild specific plugin with fucking TGFT right there in the name. If the end user cannot grasp the idea that there might be some level of self interest in the guild freely sharing the plugin then shame on them for being ignorant or naïve.
Edited to change Suggestions Forum to Role Playing (Shows how often I visit without someone pointing something out)
I want to express my appreciation to you guys for providing this free advertisement and recommendation for newer players to TGFT. My appreciation is somewhat lackluster due to the Role Playing forum being completely irrelevant, but it does exist.
I would like to see two things with respect to this plugin- even as a TGFT member who uses this plugin on all of his characters.
1) A disclaimer regarding the character data being collected
2) Eventual development of a login system where players can choose to actively participate in it's use.
That said, I hardly think this is any more risky than using other guild specific plugins that ping the guild server even when not logged in. While it may not be transmitting specific character data, I suspect the players IP address along with known active players at the time or other information could be used to correlate player alts. But I trust the leadership of each of the guilds my characters are members of, and so far as I can tell they trust me with the data that their respective proprietary plugins provide in that I am not going to use the plugin in such a way as to undermine the guild's interests.
Moreover, as far as I can tell, this plugin is only directly available from the TGFT forums as a shared guild specific plugin with fucking TGFT right there in the name. If the end user cannot grasp the idea that there might be some level of self interest in the guild freely sharing the plugin then shame on them for being ignorant or naïve.
Edited to change Suggestions Forum to Role Playing (Shows how often I visit without someone pointing something out)
You're welcome Fluffy.
I suppose bad publicity is always welcome if you belong to the group of people scraping the bottom of the gene pool to bring even more immoral and ethically challenged persons to the fold.
I suppose bad publicity is always welcome if you belong to the group of people scraping the bottom of the gene pool to bring even more immoral and ethically challenged persons to the fold.
Along with the extensive history of other negative rhetoric against TGFT, I don't perceive this as bad publicity at all. This thread is divisive. The few non vets who read this thread will be split into various subsets- pro/anti tgft, pro/anti skv, indifferent or think this game is full of idiots and that their time is better spent elsewhere. Absolutely nothing wrong with any of that.
Of the players who have been around any length of time, I doubt there will be much change in their views.
Cheers.
Of the players who have been around any length of time, I doubt there will be much change in their views.
Cheers.
goddamit that was majestic Fluffy
You have a very interesting name, sirfropsalot. Every time I look at it I can't help but to hear: "Sir, I fap a lot!"
Screwball would be turning in his grave, but like you said fluffy, that's been happening for years...
"Moreover, as far as I can tell, this plugin is only directly available from the TGFT forums"
It is also available on Voupr, which is an independent public plugin repository for Vendetta with no TGFT affiliation.
"That said, I hardly think this is any more risky than using other guild specific plugins"
And you shouldn't use those plugins either if you care about privacy. Obviously the people who are trying to make this all about bashing TGFT are being silly.
"If the end user cannot grasp the idea that there might be some level of self interest in the guild freely sharing the plugin then shame on them for being ignorant or naïve."
It may be "normal" in today's age for software to do this sort of thing, but once upon a time, slavery was also normal. It still is, in some places. Normal isn't always right. People should expect this kind of behavior, but that doesn't mean they should accept it.
It is also available on Voupr, which is an independent public plugin repository for Vendetta with no TGFT affiliation.
"That said, I hardly think this is any more risky than using other guild specific plugins"
And you shouldn't use those plugins either if you care about privacy. Obviously the people who are trying to make this all about bashing TGFT are being silly.
"If the end user cannot grasp the idea that there might be some level of self interest in the guild freely sharing the plugin then shame on them for being ignorant or naïve."
It may be "normal" in today's age for software to do this sort of thing, but once upon a time, slavery was also normal. It still is, in some places. Normal isn't always right. People should expect this kind of behavior, but that doesn't mean they should accept it.
Heh, there are times when I wonder about folk.
We are playing an open sandbox game that is called Vendetta. Spying on each other, theft, dodgy politics, skullduggery and backstabbing have always been a way of life in here. You may have noticed we are discussing this in a Role Playing forum.
For years TGFT has been cast in this play as the corporate villain of VO. Fine by me, I think that is a rather fun role to play. I for one intend to carry on Role Playing in that way. If you don't like that then choose a role to oppose us in any way you wish.
So I fully support the TGFT corporate lua division. They enjoy playing with the big pile of lua lego the devs have given them. If they create stuff which upsets the rest of you then tough, get over it.
We are playing an open sandbox game that is called Vendetta. Spying on each other, theft, dodgy politics, skullduggery and backstabbing have always been a way of life in here. You may have noticed we are discussing this in a Role Playing forum.
For years TGFT has been cast in this play as the corporate villain of VO. Fine by me, I think that is a rather fun role to play. I for one intend to carry on Role Playing in that way. If you don't like that then choose a role to oppose us in any way you wish.
So I fully support the TGFT corporate lua division. They enjoy playing with the big pile of lua lego the devs have given them. If they create stuff which upsets the rest of you then tough, get over it.
I agree in principal. In my opinion, the plugin should have provided some user information up front, but I don't believe it was mandatory. Regardless, players have a choice. I have a real problem with the modern insistence that everything have a label and that every curve in the road be sign posted. I think such negates the need to take responsibility for one's own decisions. So I would say that this provides a potential learning experience for those people who would blindly use this product. One that fortunately has very insignificant consequences as opposed to downloading and installing most 'freeware'.
This plugin is hardly necessary, nor the only means in the game to discover players alts. It wasn't so long ago that Westy was bound and determined to out my pirate alt despite my main having helped him during his trident build. Of course, most folk already knew who that character is, which is why I found it amusing.
This plugin is hardly necessary, nor the only means in the game to discover players alts. It wasn't so long ago that Westy was bound and determined to out my pirate alt despite my main having helped him during his trident build. Of course, most folk already knew who that character is, which is why I found it amusing.
You are not the only one Ecka...
I have been away from VO for a long time and I am still trying to adjust to the new VO reality.
Some skullduggery was always present but nowadays things have progressed beyond limits that we once deemed acceptable in VO.
Everyone is free to role-play whatever he wants and how he wants, after all - this is just a game.
During the years I was very active in VO I never had any issues with TGFT and always considered you a friendly bunch but.... things have changed for the worse and I think a lot of people have lost their moral compass in the process.
Playing with code is ok if you keep it within your guild I suppose, but to make a spyware that works like a 'honey pot' for gullible players and effectively turns the whole VO player base into involuntary TGFT spies is something I still cannot accept.
Maybe I am just too old for this and cannot cross the moral boundaries I have set, who knows.
Anyway, if Incarnate is OK with this, I have to respect his ruling, it's his game after all.
I have been away from VO for a long time and I am still trying to adjust to the new VO reality.
Some skullduggery was always present but nowadays things have progressed beyond limits that we once deemed acceptable in VO.
Everyone is free to role-play whatever he wants and how he wants, after all - this is just a game.
During the years I was very active in VO I never had any issues with TGFT and always considered you a friendly bunch but.... things have changed for the worse and I think a lot of people have lost their moral compass in the process.
Playing with code is ok if you keep it within your guild I suppose, but to make a spyware that works like a 'honey pot' for gullible players and effectively turns the whole VO player base into involuntary TGFT spies is something I still cannot accept.
Maybe I am just too old for this and cannot cross the moral boundaries I have set, who knows.
Anyway, if Incarnate is OK with this, I have to respect his ruling, it's his game after all.
Just don't catch Ecka on a bad day or he will threaten to publish your IP address in 100.
I'm having a rare moment where I'm siding with Kierky and Bojan. Of course Anyx has similar functionality that isn't being mentioned here.
Incarnate, you've lost the plot mate.
I'm having a rare moment where I'm siding with Kierky and Bojan. Of course Anyx has similar functionality that isn't being mentioned here.
Incarnate, you've lost the plot mate.
None of this is new to me. I'm already wary of any server based plugins, and I know how easy it is to identify alts from IP address alone. Honestly, it's a simple matter of moving the TGFT plugin out of the plugin folder to stop it from loading when I start up VO to play my non-TGFT alts.
I've used TGFT server based plugins for a while now, and it's ridiculously easy to take advantage of the benefits without any of the tradeoffs. Ecka and Lisa, has "failure" showed up in any of your alt lists? You have my permission to publish any information related to failure here, because I know you have none. ;) I'll not say anything more, to not give my certain alt(s) away.
I've used TGFT server based plugins for a while now, and it's ridiculously easy to take advantage of the benefits without any of the tradeoffs. Ecka and Lisa, has "failure" showed up in any of your alt lists? You have my permission to publish any information related to failure here, because I know you have none. ;) I'll not say anything more, to not give my certain alt(s) away.
you just did give it away joylessjoker by trying to make yourself look clever ... idiot....
Sure sure, prove that I'm an idiot. Dig up data on me. Tell the world who my TGFT alts are, if you can. You have 399 members to work through. Failing to find me, a failure? How poetic.
Joyless, you think we actually care who your silly alts are?? You think some of us might not have an idea without access to the data? TGFT has an open alt policy. Maybe if you are abusing your access to tgft info to hunt tgft with an alt, the alt finder might find you! You assume the intent is to find alts, not tgft abusing their alts.
What is with all the paranoid people here? TGFT, alt wise, is neutral to all even if you have an alt IF you don't use tgft tech against tgft.
What is with all the paranoid people here? TGFT, alt wise, is neutral to all even if you have an alt IF you don't use tgft tech against tgft.
Hey kbrittle, it's funny how you keep throwing around the word neutral, despite making enemies out of everyone lately. I guess I should expect as much, since you're not the brightest bulb in the box.
The rest of your previous post is further evidence of how dim you are.
Maybe if you are abusing your access to tgft info to hunt tgft with an alt, the alt finder might find you!
Really, I feel silly having to explain to you after it's already been discussed to the point of nausea in this very thread. The "Alt finder" is a simple, primitive PHP script file that collects your character-specific data when the client side is on, obviously functioning by making matches using the password and the IP address. Read my recent post above very carefully for a method that a 5 years old kid can do to avoid sending character information to this PHP script that he wants to hide from TGFT. For example: the TGFT plugin is inactive when I am on failure, and I move it back into the plugin folder when I am on a certain TGFT alt. Therefore you wouldn't find any association with my main character "failure" to this TGFT alt if you looked.
This is probably why Inc shrugged it off so nonchalantly, because it's a double bladed sword that people can use against you. There's not much you can do to detect the alts using the described simple method to hide themselves without going on a crazed witch-hunt and letting go legitimate guild members. This is bad for you if they're feeding data to enemy guilds.
Yes, I have been abusing the plugin like hell recently. I have been feeding an individual who hates TGFT with passion juicy data from the TGFT plugin on my alt. I am confident that even though I am announcing this and telling you exactly what I'm doing, you won't be able to detect my alt! Lalalala
Given how many enemies you've made lately, i wouldn't be surprised if there's about 5 separate alts doing it right now aside from mine.
So that's why you should care about my "silly alts." Find them and tell the world who they are. Oh wait, you cannot. That's so sad and too bad.
The rest of your previous post is further evidence of how dim you are.
Maybe if you are abusing your access to tgft info to hunt tgft with an alt, the alt finder might find you!
Really, I feel silly having to explain to you after it's already been discussed to the point of nausea in this very thread. The "Alt finder" is a simple, primitive PHP script file that collects your character-specific data when the client side is on, obviously functioning by making matches using the password and the IP address. Read my recent post above very carefully for a method that a 5 years old kid can do to avoid sending character information to this PHP script that he wants to hide from TGFT. For example: the TGFT plugin is inactive when I am on failure, and I move it back into the plugin folder when I am on a certain TGFT alt. Therefore you wouldn't find any association with my main character "failure" to this TGFT alt if you looked.
This is probably why Inc shrugged it off so nonchalantly, because it's a double bladed sword that people can use against you. There's not much you can do to detect the alts using the described simple method to hide themselves without going on a crazed witch-hunt and letting go legitimate guild members. This is bad for you if they're feeding data to enemy guilds.
Yes, I have been abusing the plugin like hell recently. I have been feeding an individual who hates TGFT with passion juicy data from the TGFT plugin on my alt. I am confident that even though I am announcing this and telling you exactly what I'm doing, you won't be able to detect my alt! Lalalala
Given how many enemies you've made lately, i wouldn't be surprised if there's about 5 separate alts doing it right now aside from mine.
So that's why you should care about my "silly alts." Find them and tell the world who they are. Oh wait, you cannot. That's so sad and too bad.
screw all of you for making me read this goddamn thread.
Of course Anyx has similar functionality that isn't being mentioned here.
Yes, but we didn't release a plugin which is for public consumption which then subsequently collected information for AnyX or us.
Yes, but we didn't release a plugin which is for public consumption which then subsequently collected information for AnyX or us.
The TGFT plugin is great though. It gives everyone carte blanche to kill anyone in sector with you because they are giving away your location to TGFT without your permission and they can't prove that they aren't before you blow them out of the sector.
The TGFT plugin is great though. It gives everyone carte blanche to kill anyone in sector with you because they are giving away your location to TGFT without your permission and they can't prove that they aren't before you blow them out of the sector.
Exactly.
Exactly.