If a heavy, lumbering ship like a Rag can sneak up on you and unload a full array of rockets, and hit you, it doesn't seem that unreasonable to me that a more lightweight fighter craft would get plastered. When this sort of thing happens to me, and it does, it's pretty frustrating.. but I'm more inclined to berate myself for not being aware enough to notice/evade them.

As a matter of note, the trigger radius for the Sunflare is 30 meters, and damage drops off considerably with distance. So, getting tapped at 30m does not equate with a direct hit.

Shape: Yes, it's a tactics adjustment. Using a Valk Vengeace with two flares and a single Neut III is an interesting combination. For a fighter, the risk of double-damage (from the enemy rapidly closing the distance to intentionally cause you damage) also keeps distance in the equation. Alternating between different weapons which have different strengths at varied ranges is.. interesting, I think. Not to mention, rockets are a limited capacity weapon. Running out is pretty likely to happen, and having an energy weapon as backup is.. comforting, at the very least. (this from someone who mostly flew a double-flare Vulture in the 3.x era Test).

Well, the problem is, that the rag doesn't really lumber. If I sneak up, I automatically win, but if I fight a light fighter, and I spam one in the direction they're moving and one slightly to the side... they can't escape.

the main problem is not with the light fighter flare combos. Because of the double damage issue. Those are pretty fun (though, the person with flares can easily pull a suicide run for the draw).

The problem is the Rags/Centaurs/Proms that don't need to worry about the double damage issue. They just keep charging.

Even if you can pull a flanking maneuver, (which is very hard, but I've been getting better at it), the proms/centaurs/rags, can usually ram you, and use the disorientation time to plaster you with AGT etc... or to back off and hit with more rockets.

The only time I have been killed by a rocket packing heavy ship (rag, cent, prom) is if I have either let them get out of my field of view and been distracted, or tried to play chicken with them and pulled out too late.

I sometimes get grief when I'm fighting for boosting round in large arcs, cutting back in to shoot, but it works. Stay out of their effective range and get them to let off rockets at you. They will eventually run dry. Kill them. I only have problems if someone uses rockets and the AGT

which just so happens to be what every prom pilot is using.

I duelled Shape in his rag'o'rockets with my aggresso... and managed to dodge 15/16 salvos. Its not as uber as people are making out, in fact its extremely limited due to the fact that strafing is not just one-dimensional.

As regards to proms and rockets, something needs to be done to make the light fighters be able to carry them and use them. VN and me sparred a bit, the best I managed to do in my SGV was get him to about 40% with flares. They are the counter, but while you're carrying twin flares, you're only as agile as they are. That's the problem here.

well, I'm also not what one would call an excellent rocket user. I use Neuts generally, I'm only just now learning rockets, I didn't expect to beat an alpha.

But, in that particular duel, I was dodging at a distance fine. And I've seen people (like amarus) deadly with rockets at closer distances, and that was with the old school proms.

/me points to his suggestion about synergy meaning a reduction in weight when packing an energy and a rockettube. And a penalty when not utilizing the weaponports.

Anyway got nothing else to say except if it could be possible to change the radarblip from a bot and a player so they don't look the same.

cheers

id just like to put a word in for the people who do things besides pvp.

i was running about 300m away from a guy in a valkyrie, in my big fat centaur aggresso, which had about 20% hull left (what is that, like 3500) and suddenly i see yellow dots. so i switch directoin and turbo some more,,,, only to see BLAMMO im dead.

-----

now, at first i was mad! but then i started using flares myself.
ok kinda fun.

but i only wish there were some kind of countermeasure for
us poor traders. ok i was actually doing ctc when i died, but you can imagine the problems for traders since they can be hit
at 300m by a bunch of rockets even when turboing.

i would like maybe a little 'Starflare mine' , that is kind
of small, and doesnt really do any damage, it just serves
as a rocket-blocker... the rocket will hit it and go 'blammo'
on it instead of on your ship.

it should also be really bright and cool looking. really pretty. with light glinting off at the right angle it should almost blind
you. thats my opinion.

If you're 300m away from a guy in a valk and you're a trader, you're pretty dead no matter what he's using. You can escape flares, although it's harder now with weights... and if you try to run with 20% health then yeah, you're in for a time.

Well an interesting counter measure is....

SELF-DESTRUCT... oh wait this probably wont get you the effect you wre hoping for.

But anywway it is usually more effective to fly straight into the enemy so they will get hit by the backfire from the missle which may kill or disrupt them as well (albeit you may not survive it).

But anyway I do agree (and there have been several threads on this) that there should be a countermeasure against missles and rockets. Even a flak system would be nice to have. Basically it would produce objects to trigger the rocket (albeit this may nt oalways save you).

ananzi: the countermeasure to that is mines--proximity and concussion work really well for that. if you'd dropped a mine while someone was chasing you, chances are they'd be blown off course before they can line up

I don't mind if we all have to switch to flares now, but we definetively have to do something to allow light fighters to carry them. My valk is 6200kg with a triflare combo, and it moves like a behemoth. Don't get me wrong, I hate flares, but they are so much better than anything else that you have to use them if you want to live another day...

Then don't use a triflare valk. I see no further problems with either the valk's or the flares' weight(s).

Incarnate, I agree and like what you did to the flares. Keep it up! :)

M. Duncan

I would like to see a decent manouvrability for my all time favorite, namely the dual gauss dual flare hornet... in stead of the deathboat it is :(

harvest mouse

the guy fired the flares well before any mines i dropped would
have had any effect on him. the flares would have still hit me
and id be dead.

now, if the flares would blow up when they get within 30m of
a mine....

(1) Then don't use a triflare valk.
(2) I see no further problems with either the valk's or the flares' weight(s).

Maybe its (1) that makes you not see (2). Would you agree?

yes, lets all stop using different weapons setups and all use the same thing. pfft.

I'm not suggesting that we all stop using different setups. I'm just saying that a triflare valk is guaranteed to be heavy. If he doesn't like weight, then he shouldn't use it. I don't mind weight, so I'm happy with what I use.

Thats always going to be a problem as long as faction gaining is possible everywhere.

Gaining admire one place should change another, so if everone wants a prom, they have to give up certain factions (ie, Itani) if they want a valk, same... ...I want a valk right now too, flares rule, but I do not believe I should be able to have a valk and a prom at the same time.

UIT would be a little harder to balance, but a good start would be if your working for one subfaction, another thinks your siding with a competitor, working out the competitors is easy.

Gaining Admired by corvus should damage all standings at least to +199.

me hopes this thread gets moved to suggestions.