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Hi,
I would like to know how many real "humans" are playing this game.
Is it:
a) 10 - 250
b) 251 - 1000
c) 1001 - 2000
d) more than 2000 ?
Every now and then it seems like players are goofing around with alts chars and alt accounts.
I'm loosing my interest in this game if here is only few (10-250) real players.
Could someone give me a rough player count?
I would like to know how many real "humans" are playing this game.
Is it:
a) 10 - 250
b) 251 - 1000
c) 1001 - 2000
d) more than 2000 ?
Every now and then it seems like players are goofing around with alts chars and alt accounts.
I'm loosing my interest in this game if here is only few (10-250) real players.
Could someone give me a rough player count?
I'm not sure if you're asking for peak user count, or total community size. I'm assuming the latter, since you talk about people goofing around with alts.
On Android alone we've seen about 10,000 new users in the last month (which is not great for an Android title). That's "ambient" level influx, without any advertising, or paid user acquisition, platform-featuring, press articles, or anything else (much of which is coming in the near future). So, although they're currently poor numbers for a mobile game, it's still a bit "quiet" and "hidden" while we're tweaking the F2P stuff, and improving the server architecture.
The total Android session count for the same period is obviously many times the new-user count.
A Play Store or iOS App Store "feature" (front-page kind of thing) may potentially push it up around 100x, so probably about 30k new-people per day (although more may show up all at once, hard to tell). Our download size will reduce the number we get, but it'll still be a lot.
I know you're asking about the game "as a whole", which covers all platforms, but I'm just giving numbers on one platform because I think it gives some notion that the population is not trivial, even if they're spread out and you don't always see them. Also, I think it foreshadows a bit of what's to come..
Once we launch on iPhone, Steam, and elsewhere.. yeah. We have a lot of Space, and that'll probably be a good thing.
On Android alone we've seen about 10,000 new users in the last month (which is not great for an Android title). That's "ambient" level influx, without any advertising, or paid user acquisition, platform-featuring, press articles, or anything else (much of which is coming in the near future). So, although they're currently poor numbers for a mobile game, it's still a bit "quiet" and "hidden" while we're tweaking the F2P stuff, and improving the server architecture.
The total Android session count for the same period is obviously many times the new-user count.
A Play Store or iOS App Store "feature" (front-page kind of thing) may potentially push it up around 100x, so probably about 30k new-people per day (although more may show up all at once, hard to tell). Our download size will reduce the number we get, but it'll still be a lot.
I know you're asking about the game "as a whole", which covers all platforms, but I'm just giving numbers on one platform because I think it gives some notion that the population is not trivial, even if they're spread out and you don't always see them. Also, I think it foreshadows a bit of what's to come..
Once we launch on iPhone, Steam, and elsewhere.. yeah. We have a lot of Space, and that'll probably be a good thing.
Thanks for a very detailed answer.
Nice to hear you are having more "traffic" than I thought.
Nice to hear you are having more "traffic" than I thought.
As a very active player of this game, I can tell you that there are many people flying around. Many just remain quiet on chat and many just don't want to be seen. While I of couse always would like "more" people to play VO, I think the main problem is today's new player's attitude:
Noob A downloads and installs VO. Then he thinks "cool man! a pvp game in space with realistic PvP, not such crap you have in other games !" (Note that he is right, VO's Player to player combat is by far the best I have seen.)
The noob then launches VO, runs through the tutorial without reading, gets on chat and asks where PvP is, ignores all veteran advice to level up a little before attemtping PvP, makes his way to Sedina B8 and gets blasted. He repeats this three times and then gets frustrated.
The problem is that the youth doesn't want to read anymore or spend time to unlock a more decent ship.
The game itself is awesome.
Noob A downloads and installs VO. Then he thinks "cool man! a pvp game in space with realistic PvP, not such crap you have in other games !" (Note that he is right, VO's Player to player combat is by far the best I have seen.)
The noob then launches VO, runs through the tutorial without reading, gets on chat and asks where PvP is, ignores all veteran advice to level up a little before attemtping PvP, makes his way to Sedina B8 and gets blasted. He repeats this three times and then gets frustrated.
The problem is that the youth doesn't want to read anymore or spend time to unlock a more decent ship.
The game itself is awesome.
The problem is that the youth doesn't want to read anymore or spend time to unlock a more decent ship.
We've been getting many international players who learned English as a second or third language, so the premise that they are too immature or impatient to read is unfair. "Learn English or fuck off" is unnecessary. Also, the UI has been designed for PC, and it badly needs to be revamped for optimal mobile experience.
On top of that, they are competing with veteran PC players. Getting station camped and losing all crystals while trying to escape frantically pressing buttons on a tiny touch screen is a very unpleasant experience. I did that to f2p players on multiple occasions, and I can attest it's very demoralizing. If you ask me, there should be separate instances for android and PC players.
We've been getting many international players who learned English as a second or third language, so the premise that they are too immature or impatient to read is unfair. "Learn English or fuck off" is unnecessary. Also, the UI has been designed for PC, and it badly needs to be revamped for optimal mobile experience.
On top of that, they are competing with veteran PC players. Getting station camped and losing all crystals while trying to escape frantically pressing buttons on a tiny touch screen is a very unpleasant experience. I did that to f2p players on multiple occasions, and I can attest it's very demoralizing. If you ask me, there should be separate instances for android and PC players.
"Noob A...asks where PvP is...ignores all veteran advice..."
PC users do this to. Don't blame android. Blame the player.
"Learn English or fuck off"
My sentiments exactly.
PC users do this to. Don't blame android. Blame the player.
"Learn English or fuck off"
My sentiments exactly.
russkie est?
I have limited experience on a tablet and I find that when I'm on it I'll do almost anything to avoid chatting. I'd suggest, when the time is there, that the voice-chat system be revisited.
ten THOUSAND new android users per month? wtf???? I don't care if those are low numbers for an android game, those are INSANE numbers for VO. Given how incredibly non-populated VO seems, one can only assume the retention rate is extraordinarly low.
That's over 300 NEW users per day.....
That's over 300 NEW users per day.....
That's less than 5 per nation per hour on average.
one can only assume the retention rate is extraordinarily low.
Ding ding ding.
Ding ding ding.
and I wonder why my suggestion to see ship types in nearby sectors (not nationality or player id) didn't get a bunch of +1's. It would make space a bit smaller and increase player interaction which may increase retention.
@biretak - cause it was a bad idea.
Given how incredibly non-populated VO seems, one can only assume the retention rate is extraordinarly low.
The other problem, is that for VO to "seem" populated (with the current game mechanics), we would need 10k+ simultaneous.
Mobile retention is a big challenge, attention spans there are far lower than on the PC, and expectations are very different.
As always, we have a great deal of work to do, and not enough time/labor to do it.
But, for all that, we are getting quite a number of people who are sticking around for long periods (weeks to months), playing pretty often, some moving to PC, etc. I'm pretty happy and optimistic about the response from F2P on Android, even if we haven't seen the financial benefits yet.
The other problem, is that for VO to "seem" populated (with the current game mechanics), we would need 10k+ simultaneous.
Mobile retention is a big challenge, attention spans there are far lower than on the PC, and expectations are very different.
As always, we have a great deal of work to do, and not enough time/labor to do it.
But, for all that, we are getting quite a number of people who are sticking around for long periods (weeks to months), playing pretty often, some moving to PC, etc. I'm pretty happy and optimistic about the response from F2P on Android, even if we haven't seen the financial benefits yet.
Keep up the good work! I found this game on the app store and downloaded it for android, it was a suggestion for a similar game and I thought what the hell, its worth a shot. I now have a computer and I play whenever I can. I think that the one instance for all approach is great. Yeah, mobile users have a harder time and cant truely play the game as intended but they get to experience the entire package and of course many are telling them that pc is way better. As for you nutwads that like to station camp android newbs and complain about player retention, try playing on mobile once and see how you fare in any ship in B-8 without droidbuttons or a controler.
Great work Incarnate and Guild Software, keep it up. We are all happy you have given us this great game, even if some won't admit it.
Great work Incarnate and Guild Software, keep it up. We are all happy you have given us this great game, even if some won't admit it.
"The problem is that the youth doesn't want to read anymore or spend time to unlock a more decent ship. "
I actually see this as the problem. If I can afford it, I should be able to buy it with very few exceptions. Instead new players are crippled from the start by being restricted to only having access to crap. There is no rational linear progression to better ships and equipment that you get in one of the old single player games. There is only an artificial limiter imposed by the license system. Any limitations in a game like this should be by what the player can afford as well as standing. Yet these new players are forced to grind their way up to having enough status somewhere to be moderately safe while being completely outclassed by players who want to shoot them. Meanwhile I've got hundreds of greyhounds stockpiled, XC's all over the place and more than a few X1's stashed away.
I actually see this as the problem. If I can afford it, I should be able to buy it with very few exceptions. Instead new players are crippled from the start by being restricted to only having access to crap. There is no rational linear progression to better ships and equipment that you get in one of the old single player games. There is only an artificial limiter imposed by the license system. Any limitations in a game like this should be by what the player can afford as well as standing. Yet these new players are forced to grind their way up to having enough status somewhere to be moderately safe while being completely outclassed by players who want to shoot them. Meanwhile I've got hundreds of greyhounds stockpiled, XC's all over the place and more than a few X1's stashed away.
Much of the current mission architecture is based around the license system. It's also not such a horrible grind. There are so many missions that become available so quickly, one could easily rank up to License 4 in everything but Trade and Mining without ever repeating a mission; it's been this way since 2010, and today there are even more options.
I also find the core of the game is not so much about what ship you are flying as what area or game system you are interacting with. The early game is basically just learning the ropes.
I also find the core of the game is not so much about what ship you are flying as what area or game system you are interacting with. The early game is basically just learning the ropes.
Of all the things that are a long and arduous grind in this game, I wouldn't say early license levels are one of them. A lot of the early missions are generous with their XP rewards.
It's funny you mentioned standing, Fluffy. That's the real grind. Unless you've got guildmates who have all the procurement missions mapped out and a fleet of Tridents to haul 1000's of widgets for you, it takes far longer to get good standing at a couple of greyspace subfactions than it does to get combat/weapons level 4.
What Vendetta is really lacking in the early game is group activities. People don't play a multiplayer online game to be doing single player missions for days. They want to team up and tackle big targets and they want to do it now.
It's funny you mentioned standing, Fluffy. That's the real grind. Unless you've got guildmates who have all the procurement missions mapped out and a fleet of Tridents to haul 1000's of widgets for you, it takes far longer to get good standing at a couple of greyspace subfactions than it does to get combat/weapons level 4.
What Vendetta is really lacking in the early game is group activities. People don't play a multiplayer online game to be doing single player missions for days. They want to team up and tackle big targets and they want to do it now.
"There is no rational linear progression to better ships and equipment that you get in one of the old single player games."
Bullshit.
"Any limitations in a game like this should be by what the player can afford as well as standing."
How are licenses any different from standing? Both systems are arbitrary numbers that stop you from doing things until you complete a bunch of menial tasks.
"Instead new players are crippled from the start by being restricted to only having access to crap."
What? Newbies don't have instant access to any decent gear and have to earn better stuff? Holy shit, call the UN, this is a crime against humanity! No successful game has ever used mechanics like that!
I really don't think you're arguing on behalf of the newbies here. It sounds to me like your real complaint is that you can't just transfer a bunch of money and proc goods to your alts and have them fully operational minutes after creation. Tough shit.
Bullshit.
"Any limitations in a game like this should be by what the player can afford as well as standing."
How are licenses any different from standing? Both systems are arbitrary numbers that stop you from doing things until you complete a bunch of menial tasks.
"Instead new players are crippled from the start by being restricted to only having access to crap."
What? Newbies don't have instant access to any decent gear and have to earn better stuff? Holy shit, call the UN, this is a crime against humanity! No successful game has ever used mechanics like that!
I really don't think you're arguing on behalf of the newbies here. It sounds to me like your real complaint is that you can't just transfer a bunch of money and proc goods to your alts and have them fully operational minutes after creation. Tough shit.
This thread reminds me of the challenger explosion.