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first of all, i do not want to whine about placing mines inside a sector as such.
/rant
my concern is, that when you are trying to demine other people's mines, it is immensely myopic in terms of warfare to place mines of your own when there already are other people's mines.
why? it makes it unnecessarily harder for the demining crews to take care of the (enemies) mines, because one has to assume that every mine is hostile, thus taking up more time cleaning up the really dangerous ones, meanwhilst the other(s) can mine away happily.
/end rant
/rant
my concern is, that when you are trying to demine other people's mines, it is immensely myopic in terms of warfare to place mines of your own when there already are other people's mines.
why? it makes it unnecessarily harder for the demining crews to take care of the (enemies) mines, because one has to assume that every mine is hostile, thus taking up more time cleaning up the really dangerous ones, meanwhilst the other(s) can mine away happily.
/end rant
You should note that the very act demining is considered hostile to the miner himself. The reason being that you're taking money out of his pockets and are making it harder for him to continue his task. So be prepared to take a little hostility from this individual. Also, sane or respectable players have reasons for mining. Observe your environment and carefully to see what that reason is. Chances are once that threat is eliminated, he will stop mining.
Most often he's being cornered into a station by several players who are trying to kill him. If I see that him being cornered and griefed is justified, either because this particular miner has a habit of killing newbies or attacking unprovoked, I'll join in with the demining session.
If however I see that a particular group is simply bullying this person around and he has no other means of defense but to mine, I leave his mines alone and simply avoid confronting him. At this point I'd either have the option of helping this miner out by killing his opponents, or talking them out of cornering him and leaving him alone so that his perceived threat will be eliminated. The LAST thing you want to do is to attack a miner after he has agreed to stop mining. That'll just make the situation worse!
Point is, the issue of station mining isn't as clear-cut as you'd think. There are several reasons why people continue to do it. I'm more inclined to think that when station defenses will be implemented, the whole issue of station mining and griefing will be gone completely. Nevertheless, for now if I see someone mining stations just for fun or randomness, rest assured that person will not earn a lot of respect. Most often this won't be the case though.
Most often he's being cornered into a station by several players who are trying to kill him. If I see that him being cornered and griefed is justified, either because this particular miner has a habit of killing newbies or attacking unprovoked, I'll join in with the demining session.
If however I see that a particular group is simply bullying this person around and he has no other means of defense but to mine, I leave his mines alone and simply avoid confronting him. At this point I'd either have the option of helping this miner out by killing his opponents, or talking them out of cornering him and leaving him alone so that his perceived threat will be eliminated. The LAST thing you want to do is to attack a miner after he has agreed to stop mining. That'll just make the situation worse!
Point is, the issue of station mining isn't as clear-cut as you'd think. There are several reasons why people continue to do it. I'm more inclined to think that when station defenses will be implemented, the whole issue of station mining and griefing will be gone completely. Nevertheless, for now if I see someone mining stations just for fun or randomness, rest assured that person will not earn a lot of respect. Most often this won't be the case though.
Problem is, that many players are just looking for excuses to mine,
and take the smallest hostile act as a worthy excuse to do so.
and take the smallest hostile act as a worthy excuse to do so.
Mod, feel free to trash this as it has served it's purpose.
*sigh*
Not again...
Not again...
Hm... yes Urza, thank you Urza.
Post edited. That was foolish of me.
Archon.
Post edited. That was foolish of me.
Archon.
Arolte, I'm curious for your excuse for mining the s12 station when it was already tested and confirmed that we could land there. Those red n00bs in busses present a tactical threat to you?
Heh... well.
Arolte: You claim all bugs should be reported as soon as they are found
and not exploited, right? Well then; perhaps it's time starting to follow your
own guidelines...
*sigh*
Arolte: You claim all bugs should be reported as soon as they are found
and not exploited, right? Well then; perhaps it's time starting to follow your
own guidelines...
*sigh*
Dagger.......
Fenix.......
Why is it i have to remind you 2 to be nice so often... Please. If you cant post something without posting flamebate (dagger, your post is practicly screaming "Arolte, you're a hypocrite!!!")
Fenix, just drop it. You continue to attack him in every post.
Fenix.......
Why is it i have to remind you 2 to be nice so often... Please. If you cant post something without posting flamebate (dagger, your post is practicly screaming "Arolte, you're a hypocrite!!!")
Fenix, just drop it. You continue to attack him in every post.
Well... I can't say I don't think he is a hypocrite.
you could save that for ingame private messages, email, ect. you dont have to bring it to the forum where everyone else has to deal with it.
Be Nice
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The Vendetta message board is intended as a communications medium between the Vendetta userbase and Guild Software, Inc. Users are welcome to discuss general game-related topics, make suggestions, or voice constructive criticism about our products.
This area is meant to be a positive place for constructive discussion of the game. Flames and other rude behaviour will not be tolerated. Offenders may have their accounts deleted. If you have a suggestion about the game, we would love to hear it. If you disagree with someone, please keep it good-natured. Thanks.
I have my reasons. Ask me in game next time and I'll answer your questions. This is neither the time nor place to discuss such matters.
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ookaayy...
/me glares at the people turning this thread into flaming goodness and agrees with arolte about staying on topic
anyway...
to arolte:
i did not voice any concern about the act of mining itself. it is a valid tactic, although mostly frowned upon.
if there are mines (for no matter what reason they were laid) and people are trying to demine, "friendly" mines are just making things worse, as explained by me in the initial post.
the reasons why people mine vary from situation to situation and person to person. i don't really care about those reasons in this thread. i care about countermining.
/me glares at the people turning this thread into flaming goodness and agrees with arolte about staying on topic
anyway...
to arolte:
i did not voice any concern about the act of mining itself. it is a valid tactic, although mostly frowned upon.
if there are mines (for no matter what reason they were laid) and people are trying to demine, "friendly" mines are just making things worse, as explained by me in the initial post.
the reasons why people mine vary from situation to situation and person to person. i don't really care about those reasons in this thread. i care about countermining.
arolte, please read toshis post again and then look at your post and explain to me where he even slightly made a remark going towards that answer you gave.
I understood it as this:
somebody is mining, and as a countermeasure, one of the alies is mining to.
Now, how in godsname can you discern between your own/allies mines and the enemies mines without trying to shoot them down. It could prove helpfull if they had another color, maybe blue ??.
this way youll promptly see if the mines are on your side or not.
cheers
I understood it as this:
somebody is mining, and as a countermeasure, one of the alies is mining to.
Now, how in godsname can you discern between your own/allies mines and the enemies mines without trying to shoot them down. It could prove helpfull if they had another color, maybe blue ??.
this way youll promptly see if the mines are on your side or not.
cheers
Arolte: The act of placing mines is an act of hostility because mines HURT, ALOT. They're a nuisance and just in general piss people off, the miner should expect hostility, the de-miner is already under attack and is trying to prevent it.
Oh I know. My post was more of a FYI. Just saying, don't be surprised if your actions make the situation worse.
uh...riight.....
euhm so demining makes it worse ??
im sorry I cant follow that line of thinking.
Dont mine, no honor in that. If you result to mining then:
1) you do it as a flagdefense --> allowed
2) you do it to piss people off --> so dont be surprised to get a whole batch of people after you. As a little sidenote, people tend to have vengefull spirits. People dont forget fast, an eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth. So if you shoot someone down who is just flying happily along, or if you mine him down, then dont be surprised when the victims come together to gangbang you. and using mines at that time is just lame because you dont take the consequences of your actions. You run away from them.
cheers
im sorry I cant follow that line of thinking.
Dont mine, no honor in that. If you result to mining then:
1) you do it as a flagdefense --> allowed
2) you do it to piss people off --> so dont be surprised to get a whole batch of people after you. As a little sidenote, people tend to have vengefull spirits. People dont forget fast, an eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth. So if you shoot someone down who is just flying happily along, or if you mine him down, then dont be surprised when the victims come together to gangbang you. and using mines at that time is just lame because you dont take the consequences of your actions. You run away from them.
cheers
No, I don't mean demining makes it worse. I'm saying how people often misinterpret the reasons behind demining and mining, which may result in even worse conflicts than the one you had to begin with. You can't just view it as black and white or right and wrong. It's not as simple as that. You need to look at the logic behind why these people do what they do in order to solve the problem. Yes, you could argue that it's just a game... but since humans play the game there will always be that human element of psychology attached to it. That is of course if you want to get real in depth with the topic.