OK, so amidst the great monocle debacle, among technical unsupport problems and other general lack of patience for Eve, I am checking out all sorts of other spacey/scifi-ish MMO's.

I like the actual user skill ofrealtime combat rather than statistics/a bit of strategic skill... Vendetta is good this way.

I have one question - something that I find very important with a game..

Is the economy mostly player driven? eg - collect resources, produce products from resources, sell items for whatever price I want/can sell them at.. Or is the goods market/economy just computer-generated?

This is a real sticking point for me, because it has a great effect on politics/etc - I'd much rather that the reasons groups/corps/whatever they're called here fought, were over resources/money/naturally arising needs, rather than just saying "OK, we're gonna meet at 12, on the battlefield, and fight for to see who is the winner.

Also.. is there any such thing as mining in vendetta? or some similar activity?

I have one question - something that I find very important with a game..

Is the economy mostly player driven?

Ahahahahahaha... [breathe] AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA... [wipe tears, breathe some more]...whew!

No. Nobody cares about much of anything in VO, other than playing space quake for its own sake. Crafting useless cap ships is the only possible exception, but that's still not really something anyone's fighting over.

Guild Software has been babbling about an economy redux into something much more player driven for over half a decade now. I invite you to hold your breath for it happening.

Uhm... you expect people on the Vendetta forum to know about the EVE issues?

Quake in space... sounds like fun :-)

I created this 8 hour trial account a while ago. Never completed it for some reason.

This time I'll probably try the game for a month or so at least :-)

The economy is slightly player-impacted but not player-run. If you sell a bunch of goods at a station, the sell price for those goods will drop. The buy price will not however. (There are rare instances of items that can be sold without their sell price changing though - traders like those ones.)

You do have the option to sell things directly to other players though, for whatever price you can get away with. For example, some things are only available in limited locations, or have restrictions on who can purchase them, so buying them from others can be convenient. Ultra Charge powercells are one of the main player-sold items. There is no market mechanism though - you have to actively seek out a buyer or seller, and then negotiate a price. Also, there is no secure way to exchange the goods - we have a /givemoney command, and we can drop and pick up items, so basically what happens is you drop the goods, they pay for them, and then they scoop them up. The specific order of events varies based on trust. One technique you can use to make it a little safer is to request half the payment first, then drop the goods and let them pick them up, and then get paid the second half.

Since this goes on out in space, if somebody tries to leave without paying, you can try to shoot them down. They could also try shooting you and taking the goods. Or you could wait for them to pay and then shoot them down and take the goods back.

Of course, if you cheat somebody, they will probably never trust you again, and will probably tell everybody about it, so you're kind of shooting yourself in the foot if you don't stay honest when dealing with people.

And yes, there is mining, and some (but not much yet) crafting.

As for reasons to fight, there are a few. The winning side of the Deneb conflict will send a war convoy to blockade the greyspace wormhole of the other side, which causes them some annoyance. The winning side of the Capture the Cargo competition gets the right to buy Neutron Blaster MkIII from stations (the other side, and all UIT characters, can only buy the MkI and MkII models from the stations) - that's another item that people sell player-to-player, especially to UIT characters. And of course there are pirates to fight if you cannot escape and are unwilling to pay the ransom - and if you are a pirate there are traders to fight so that you can make them pay you and/or steal their stuff. Additionally, there are three capturable stations that people fight over. The stations offer free repairs and a number of crafting missions to create certain weapons and parts for building capships. There are also NPCs to fight for the drops - some of which are used in crafting.

spacequake..
yeah, that's how it feels.

Thanks anyway,
enjoy your... spacequake.

This doesn't seem contrived at all.

/me looks at pey pey

*shrugs*

lol

A Newbie's impression of Vendetta

After 1 hour: "My god, it's full of stars!"

After 1 day: "This feels like Space quake"

After 1 week: "WTH, I've been ganked! I quit!"

After 1 month: "You know, I'm starting to get the hang of this"

After 1 year: "I think I'm finally getting the hang of this"

After 8 years: "I must be beginning to get the hang of this..."

LOL Phaserlight... I think I'm now at the 1 month stage...

Combat is really like space quake though... it's sad to me actually... Having a joystick, and having no purpose for it because mouse/keyboard just works so much better. And the flight model would be so easy to fix as well.... Oh well, that's never gonna happen, so might as well enjoy it for what it is.

Phaserlight : Since the game was launched 2004 I take it that nobody can play it yet?

Joystick + Nostromo n52 = Heaven. I could probably kill people more effectively with a mouse than a stick, but I'd rather have fun.

Question: what do you mean about fixing the flight model? Just making it treat space as a vacuum rather than a fluid? Or do you mean something else?

Montschok, the game was playable as a beta and alpha for a fair bit of time before launch, but your conclusion is still valid:
Everyone is a newb, and if you don't think you are, then fuck off, you fucking newb.

Signed up: 2003-06-02

I was attempting to humorously illustrate the concept of beginner's mind.

Regardless of how long I've been playing I try to see the game with fresh eyes. Another way to look at it is never to trade possibility for experience, although the latter does tend to accumulate. "The idea is to remain in a state of constant departure while always arriving. It saves on introductions and goodbyes."

I've been here for so long but I might be beaten by someone with as little experience as a month. (If you have less than a month's experience you're welcome to try). Right now I like where I'm at in combat, I can defeat a number of other players and a number of other players can defeat me. I try to maintain good faction standing, practice regularly, and keep a stash of special ships at key locations. I've learned but I'm never bored.

The combat in VO is unique in this regard, as one player recently put it in game "easy to learn, hard to master." The threespace dynamics, that resistant force keeping everything fluid and contained, and the myriad of player strategies and philosophies, I love all of it.

What Vendetta is and what it could be are at a disparity, but I've seen enough change take place to keep riding the ride. That's not to say I'm never going to want to step off but for right now there's enough to keep me entertained and with this potential I believe more is still to come. A lot more. In that respect genka's right.

So, yeah, in a sense you never really get the hang of it. As soon as you think you do, some other player comes along and teaches you a lesson. With a beginner's mind you learn from it. Next time use that momentum from the flare splash to spin around in a full 360, or turbo out of the way, or dodge it before it's fired. There's enough skill required that the complexity even in 1v1 combat mimics a dance or martial arts.

And this is just the combat. As Rin points out there's a lot more to it. Like one player said: "Why don't you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don't you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don't you say something righteous and hopeful for a change"

The ripple effect exists.

Pizzasgood: What I meant by fixing the flight model is making it work like space should... rolling is fine, Flight Assist mode is a cool idea, and I can buy into the Flight Assist computer being able to use small thrusters to keep you going in the direction your pointing...

What bugs me is that when I turn off Flight Assist... The strafing is WAY to powerful.... It's almost like I have engines facing sideways!!! AND, on top of that, my main thruster (as in the thruster slider on the joystick) has ZERO effect.... I can turn 180 degrees, put it to 100%, and nothing.... just keep going in the same direction I was... have to use directional keys to change to forward moving... totally unrealistic.

I understand that total realism will kill the fun, because you would constantly have to counteract frictionless movement by reversing thrusters, etc. What would work better in my opinion is near realistic physics. Keep the momentum from thrusters, apply a small constant friction, which removes sideways drift from turning etc over time... and for combat, you can still fly towards something, cut your engines, and turn and shoot without changing direction.

Also, on top of that, the turbo is just plain stupid, in a physics sense... If it's a thrust boost, why does the ship slow down when you let it go... what is slowing you down exactly... Some magic friction which only exists above your ships rated maximum speed. It's awful.... in a space physics sense

Just my 2 cents... Not bashing the game... I enjoy it... just a few things that kill immersion for me, that's all.

You sound like a ten year old who's been told that engines push you forward, space has no friction and apples fall down and is eager to share that fascinating information with the rest of the ignorant world.

PS: Seriously? One of your beefs with the VO flight model is that you can't set your joystick up right?

in a space physics sense

VO is sci-fi. What physics are you talking about?

genka: I would love for you to tell me how you set up the joystick to work correctly with this crap flight model... I would actually PAY you to tell me in fact.

On a side note, I figured somebody might feel like I am trying to explain physics to a bunch of idiots... If the shoe fits, wear it... for the rest of us, the explanation is common sense, and what you SHOULD have taken away from the post is that the current flight model is Hollywood sci-fi bullshit... entertaining, but bullshit nonetheless.

Am I begging the devs to fix the flight model? NO
Am I threatening to cancel my subscription due to the flight model? NO
Am I saying it's not fun? NO

What I am saying is it could be made more realistic, without ruining the fun... And, obviously, I am dying to find out how to play with a joystick ;)

pirren: So what you are saying is because it's sci-fi, they can make up their own rules? Then, I vote for green instead of black as space, cube planets, and pink and purple asteroids instead of the boring grey and browns we currently have!

I guess I didn't make myself clear. I'll use shorter sentences this time, as an exercise:

Your understanding of Physics as a subject is naive, at best. Your understanding of Physics as it applies to the world of VO is non-existent. The only way your claim that "VO's flight model is unrealistic" makes sense is by way of several unfounded assumptions. Since these assumptions fly in the face of the observable universe, they are not only unfounded but also demonstrably wrong.

Your attempts to impress those around you with your false erudition, then, are humorously childish. As a result, your claim that a change to the flight model could be made without ruining it are not particularly credible. This is highlighted by the complete lack of actual changes you think might accomplish your goal of making the game more "realistic" without ruining the gameplay.

The result is that you do not sound like a clever physicist trying to explain complex concepts to idiots, as you put it. You sound like a dumb kid, trying to explain shit he doesn't understand to people that have moved far past this naive bullshit. Or, put it another way, you sound like a ten year old who's been told that engines push you forward, space has no friction and apples fall down and is eager to share that fascinating information with the rest of the ignorant world.

PS: How the fuck would I, or anyone else without an equivalent and unknown model of crappy joystick, know how to set it up right? Clearly, PEBKAC.