It's too bad new players can't opt to go through some basic flight practice starting for the first 30 minutes in a system completely separate from the rest of the game universe, a totally safe place (maybe even granting them invulnerability so they can't crash and burn), just to get a feel for the controls of flying in VO. Something with perhaps a race tube to test out their maneuvering skills and a sparring partner bot, another equally equipped ship, to try out combat with.

It would also be great to have a station where they could be guided step by step through the process of navigating through the station interface including: buying trade goods, working mining equipment, navigating through the trade guild missions, setting up weapon groups and switching through them while in space. This would require the station to have no license requirements for buying weapons and ships, and also prices on weapons of 0 credits.

Add a couple more stations and they can be guided through the process of trading, and finding the best price for mined ore.

Obviously once their time is up, their home station would be set to one of the starting points for their nation and they'd be /exploded or deported there, keeping none of their inventory from the newb universe, except perhaps 25,000 credits to get them started.

Something like that, could greatly improve the newb turnover rate, especially if the tutorials in the newb universe are accompanied by pre-recorded audio instructions.

Yes and no, some newbies want to find out what the community is like, and don't want to be stuck off in some "fake" universe for their first few hours (of a limited number).

Anyway, I debated the merits of that in the previously linked Faction thread from 2007. Given the development time involved in various different choices, this is the one I'm going ahead with. You can also see my initial post for other ways I'm changing the newbie "start-out" experience. But, for the moment, instanced newbie sectors won't be among them.

Yes and no, some newbies want to find out what the community is like, and don't want to be stuck off in some "fake" universe for their first few hours (of a limited number).

I did say they'd opt to be stuck into the fake universe, not forced.

However, I do understand how changing the actual game universe to make the starting systems a safe zone would require far less development time, and given the size of guild, I can see how my suggestion would be difficult to implement at best.

Yeah. To re-use my words from April of last year (Friendly Fire / Faction thread):

Instancing newbie start areas is a very old idea, and one we've kicked around, but I'm not convinced that it would be a good development-time to benefit ratio. It wouldn't be very useful beyond the very initial flight training (the first 20 minutes of the game?).. which should already be fairly safe, in theory. It's like the idea of "protecting" anyone.. eventually you have to introduce them to the Real World, and in this case, our real world involves people shooting other people. The sooner they get training about who they can shoot, and who not to shoot, the better, and if it involves a slight danger.. I can live with that. Giving them nerf weapons lessens the danger of them injuring one another or anyone else very seriously, so then the biggest risk becomes more experienced players flying into newbie zones to pick on them.. and we should be able to defend against that.

I've been talking about securing capitol systems for what, a year? Two? This is not a game weakening move, this makes new people less likely to be killed during their initial moments of gameplay (flying around their starting station, or doing tutorials), thus becoming so frustrated that they abandon the game without further inspection. This has been a common complaint for a long time (both emailed to me and posted on review sites), and may be increased by the removal of friendly fire restrictions. We have a terrible turnover rate with new people, and this is part of the reason (definitely not the only reason, and almost certainly not the largest reason, but still: a factor, worth addressing as part of the larger scheme). The fact that we have a tough time retaining players long enough to make it through their trial is certainly a game weakening issue.

I've made a tradeoff by limiting it to only capitols in UIT territory for the moment, and I intend to modify the UIT nation-selection text to better describe the added danger, as well as write a UIT-specific tutorial to further elucidate. But let me be clear: I am going to be making a strong effort to protect capitol systems. I am not going to make them perfectly "safe", just better protected. I think this is one aspect of the best overall solution, given our philosophy of "no safe place" and the propensity for newbie team-killers that we are going to be getting in the near future.

Gee golly willikers, we sure couldn't have an incentive for total n00bs wanting to be safe to sign up for the most compact, tightly defended, and underpopulated nation, now could we?!

Keep UIT the way it is internally, strengthen its borders as you have, and then make the rewards available there commensurate with the dangers. Put Metana back to the way it was, weakening Itani defenses deep inside their space. Make the relative advantages (size, opportunity, security) and disadvantages (small size, lack of opportunity, lack of security) of each nation clear at character creation.

I agree with Lecter.

Also make each nation's defenses a little different from each other.
For example:
Serco: Have more capital ships patrolling Serco space, or maybe just standing guard nearby capitol stations or at the WH. Also, have small assault vessels (svg, or proms) doing the same thing, either patrolling or standing guard ready to attack intruders. This would fit perfectly with the description of Serco having the largest army and being very military oriented. The only thing they got to show this is the Nemesis and its small escort.

Itani: Put small "Goliath" cannons in Deneb, at the Deneb Geira WH. Or even make the 3 large Goliath cannons mentioned in the backstory (Alecto, Megaera and Tisiphone) and put them there along with smaller versions. Also have small contingents of IDF valks patrolling Itani space.

UIT: I guess its current defenses are ok.

Not only would these different defenses make each nation look a little bit more "unique" but it would also make nation space look more alive.

Edit: How complicated would making a Goliath cannon be? This isnt a rethorical question, btw. They wouldnt even need to be destroyable and they could be made using already existing models of station structures, and have them use BGTWKOA anti-capital ship cannons (same weapon TPG Teradon Frigates use). Well, I dont know anything about computer programming much less game development, so I dont know if doing this is possible or how hard and time consuming it would be.

The way UIT space is now (even with better borders), it's much much much too easy to kill newbs who are 10 minutes into their trials, which isn't something to be proud of...

What slime said.

And what I said, about there being no point to deporting team-killers unless I can actually keep them away from the newbies in the capitols (which no one seems to want to read).

UIT space will still be considerably more dangerous than any other major Nation. I will still update the nation-selection information, and maybe that will drive more players to Serco, I don't know. But protected Capitol systems are necessary.

Even with this new system in-place, I reckon I would be able to slip into nation space and cop the odd newb. I just think it will be much harder, and I prefer a challenge. Piracy should be hard, not easy.

[edit]

Heh, I remember copping a newb in Dau just before they introduced turrets in Dau stations. He thought he had logged into the middle of a battle zone, and subscribed to the game! He also came back to try have a go at me. And turned into a fine pilot.

VO in its current state only appeals to hard core gamers. I have had 200/1 more victims never come back, and for this I am sorry Guild :(.

Of course, there have been more than this 1 stick around, but yeah, I think I get about a 400/1 ratio, maybe if you ban me yer newbs will rise. Hell its a quick fix. :P

[edit 2]

At least you can't put the newbs that leave that say "i never saw anyone" on my back :P

For a lot of them, I think it's mostly about giving them a little intro breathing room to get used to the idea of hard-core, and how that works. Give them a brighter shade of gray to learn how to.. fly, and to take missions telling them "Beware of Yoda and Lecter, who are waiting for you outside the wormholes". Then let them make a decision about how they like our play style. At least then it's informed.

Ah, I don't usually kill folk till they can at least fly a ship above EC class, unless they are in Grey space, unless I suspect that person is an alternate character.

Of course, in a game called Vendetta, what can you expect? ;)

[edit]

Wooo, drunk sugestion, but why not make players with 0/0/0/0/0 unable to PVP? IE, folk cant hurt em, they cant hurt folk? They can only hurt AI. You cannot exploit this, cos even if you give advanced rail to a 0/0/0/0/0 bus, cos it wont hurt anything?

Lot of work I know, but as a pirate, it makes sense to protect real newbs, and not give them an advatage for alts.

That's actually an interesting suggestion; It would have to be restricted to one system I think, to avoid exploits (Perhaps your nation simply won't let you out until you have proper training/clearence)

Maybe if this Newb Bus was constrained to one sector and had no cargo space.

Making them invulnerable would open up exploitation prospects. Plus, I just generally dislike "blanket hacks" like that (or like Friendly Fire, for that matter).

I am planning to nerf their weapons against other players, start them in a special sector and station (which only allows newbies), and confine them to the sector, the system, and finally the nation as they work towards three Flight Status licenses. You can read about that in the Friendly Fire Removal RFC post from last year.

But, all of that will take awhile to engineer. For the moment, I have as many things in the pipe as will possibly fit.

start them in a special sector and station (which only allows newbies)

You're going to give them a place that's completely safe, except for the remote chance of attack by other n00blets?

Personally I dislike the idea of having to grind a new character just to be able to fly throughout the universe.

Some kind of 'to hell with the tutorials, I already know what I'm doing' option would be nice, especially for vets wanting to start new characters.

Hold on a minute, if you joining a new game, would you choose a faction that warns you against danger or would you choose another that says it is safe. Seriously... I play a game to be in the action, not to hide in a nation and grind.

PS - could you make the 'Serco' button bigger? Do you think would make a psychological difference? Maybe a script that determines the size of the buttons based on the number of active players from a nation?

LNH: That's why you can take the Basic Flight Test right away. :P

Lecter: Not completely safe, no. A newbie-only sector would be guarded by the same sorts of defenses we already have, just more densely. Think of it as the "lightest possible shade".

They would be safe from other nooblets, in that sector, as their equipped weapons would only be damaging to the Training Drones they had to fight. I would expect people to only spend a short time in this location. Once they passed whatever basic level, they would gain access to leaving the sector and be able to proceed to a "real" station (like the Capitol), where they could then upgrade to "real" weapons. They would then be limited to traveling within the capitol system until they reached another Flight Status test.. level.

Anyway, this is explained in the Friendly Fire Removal RFC that I keep futilely trying to link. The first section, titled New Users and Early Advancement.

Note, I don't think this process should be very time consuming for veteran players starting new alts. But it should at least be required of the first new character on a new account.

Why not do this? Issue 'merit' points to everyone. Player kills in certain areas (i.e. starting systems, some stations, etc) if the user time in game (including all alts) is higher than a set amount or the player is under a set amount in game (trial account, new player, etc) then dock points from them. After a certain number of points docked when the noobslayer enters these systems launch some ultra hard impossible to kill, impossible to evade strike force to kill them uber quick and hard every time, am talking about SF that's so jacked up it's impossible to do anything but die.

Eventually over time the problem accounts will have problems will be 'locked' out of those few systems and the new players will not have to go thru that horror.