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Another thread on "HONOR"?!?! Gahhhhh!
Can't we make a separate forum category for these kinds of discussions? Then I can ignore them properly.
Can't we make a separate forum category for these kinds of discussions? Then I can ignore them properly.
hey leebs, here have a swig of tequila!
My feelings mirror some already here, many a time I have warped into a sector with two or more members of Viper and had one distract me while the other boomed me. Do I consider this ganking? not really, I am a pirate in the game, they are the law. We have multis all the time. Several of them, several of us. Its fun, we all enjoy it. Check out this thread..
http://vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/7/14588
Now that was a multi, not a gankfest.
Now you take certain individuals in the game. They use whatever tactics they think is right, interupting arranged fights to get an easy kill,generally annoying people etc. In this instance, members of the community sometimes get together and target that person. It may be one on one, or it may be two or more on one. This is the community policing itself.
But two or more experienced players attacking a player that has done nothing and has much less experience, just to say "ha ha we pwnd you" THAT is ganking and in my opinion wrong. These people deserve the above treatment in my opinion and lots of it.
Unfair fights regarding ship setup etc. You die in a battle because you chose the wrong set up, you learn a lesson and you choose another setup when fighting that person.
If your too low a level to get the equipment you need, you can either A) avoid that person til you can get what you need and then go blast them to smithereens, or B) you find someone in the game that has the experience and you ask them to boom them for you til you CAN do it yourself.
Now people speak of honor...check out this thread for a very good discussion on that subject.
http://vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/7/13922#176025
MysticRogue
Commander CLM
http://vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/7/14588
Now that was a multi, not a gankfest.
Now you take certain individuals in the game. They use whatever tactics they think is right, interupting arranged fights to get an easy kill,generally annoying people etc. In this instance, members of the community sometimes get together and target that person. It may be one on one, or it may be two or more on one. This is the community policing itself.
But two or more experienced players attacking a player that has done nothing and has much less experience, just to say "ha ha we pwnd you" THAT is ganking and in my opinion wrong. These people deserve the above treatment in my opinion and lots of it.
Unfair fights regarding ship setup etc. You die in a battle because you chose the wrong set up, you learn a lesson and you choose another setup when fighting that person.
If your too low a level to get the equipment you need, you can either A) avoid that person til you can get what you need and then go blast them to smithereens, or B) you find someone in the game that has the experience and you ask them to boom them for you til you CAN do it yourself.
Now people speak of honor...check out this thread for a very good discussion on that subject.
http://vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/7/13922#176025
MysticRogue
Commander CLM
Well said Mystie.
Gankings fun.
My thoughts: (I'll try to keep it short)
Channel 100 is the catch all for conversation. You have people just chatting, joking, talking about the latest things, how to play the game, complaining, and people role playing. I think it gets confusing. When people scream about ganking, it's sometimes hard to put into context. I skim 100 and barley ever post to it. I ignore ganking and unfair fight remarks. There has been times when I was fighting 2 or 3 pirates at a time. I kept going back for more punishment, and at the same time being called a ganker. It's useless to argue on 100, so I just ignore it.
I role play as Viper and that is the only role playing I do. We have group fights with pirates and I enjoy it very much. I strive for group fights. That is, in my opinion, an underlining goal for the Vipers.
The bottom line to fair fights is: Respect the other players. Role play chat on 100 if you must. But as long as you truly respect all other players in private chat, your behavior/game play and theirs will reflect accordingly. You will know your adversaries and you will know what is acceptable with them.
[eidt]It is a hard learned lesson when you don't respect players. But it is the key to enjoying the game[/edit]
Channel 100 is the catch all for conversation. You have people just chatting, joking, talking about the latest things, how to play the game, complaining, and people role playing. I think it gets confusing. When people scream about ganking, it's sometimes hard to put into context. I skim 100 and barley ever post to it. I ignore ganking and unfair fight remarks. There has been times when I was fighting 2 or 3 pirates at a time. I kept going back for more punishment, and at the same time being called a ganker. It's useless to argue on 100, so I just ignore it.
I role play as Viper and that is the only role playing I do. We have group fights with pirates and I enjoy it very much. I strive for group fights. That is, in my opinion, an underlining goal for the Vipers.
The bottom line to fair fights is: Respect the other players. Role play chat on 100 if you must. But as long as you truly respect all other players in private chat, your behavior/game play and theirs will reflect accordingly. You will know your adversaries and you will know what is acceptable with them.
[eidt]It is a hard learned lesson when you don't respect players. But it is the key to enjoying the game[/edit]
now I'll say my prayers and ask that this be the last Ganking and Unfair Fights thread.
Too late MB, the next Ganking/Honor thread is already in the making.
MysticRogue, you are right on. I completely second you. Thanks for your opinion and for saying this as you have. :)
M. Duncan
Cdr. Viperguild
M. Duncan
Cdr. Viperguild
By using the term ganking do you mean using teamwork to win a fight?
I suppose that seeing i have never played this game YET I am unable to really comment, but in most space based or any games if you use teamwork you will achieve much morthan trying to do the same thing on your own.
In war there is never a thing called being fair just look at some of the tactics used by all sides of the war in Iraq.
I suppose that seeing i have never played this game YET I am unable to really comment, but in most space based or any games if you use teamwork you will achieve much morthan trying to do the same thing on your own.
In war there is never a thing called being fair just look at some of the tactics used by all sides of the war in Iraq.
covolt09 speaks : I suppose that seeing i have never played this game YET I am unable to really comment, but..
OMG. Douglas Adams! You are ALIVE!
OMG. Douglas Adams! You are ALIVE!
To me, it is all situational. Duels and consentual 1v1 have one set of rules - anyone who doesn't follow them is either new or lame. Nonconsentual Xv1 is another story - anything goes - if I'm flying by and one or more people attack I'll cut loose with whatever I have available and likely keep right on going. Being called a spammer or runner in that case doesn't bother me at all.
Wars and warlike missions are kindof inbetween. Sometimes guilds at war agree on a place and some basic rules - othertimes anything goes. I'm more of the anything goes persuasion but will bear with guild imposed limits until someone else breaks them. I've been on both sides of 3v6 type fights and it's a blast with or without every weapon and ship setup in the book.
KOS targets are probably where the biggest whining comes from. If someone is on my or my guild's KOS list I just may open up on them anywhere at anytime with practically any setup I think might serve me well. If someone on my KOS list is in the middle of a duel with someone else, I might attack - depends on my relationship with the pilot they're fighting. This is the source of much screaming and whining.
Guess I'm saying in my longwinded way that I think anything goes unless you have a prior agreement. Just don't whine, if I had a choice between killing a whiner, a spammer, a ganker, or a runner, I'd kill the whiner every time.
Wars and warlike missions are kindof inbetween. Sometimes guilds at war agree on a place and some basic rules - othertimes anything goes. I'm more of the anything goes persuasion but will bear with guild imposed limits until someone else breaks them. I've been on both sides of 3v6 type fights and it's a blast with or without every weapon and ship setup in the book.
KOS targets are probably where the biggest whining comes from. If someone is on my or my guild's KOS list I just may open up on them anywhere at anytime with practically any setup I think might serve me well. If someone on my KOS list is in the middle of a duel with someone else, I might attack - depends on my relationship with the pilot they're fighting. This is the source of much screaming and whining.
Guess I'm saying in my longwinded way that I think anything goes unless you have a prior agreement. Just don't whine, if I had a choice between killing a whiner, a spammer, a ganker, or a runner, I'd kill the whiner every time.
its simple.
if i kill someone, its a daring act of skill and cunning.
if someone kills me, they are a no good low down dirty scuzz bucket. if they used missiles, they are a spamming moron. if they used a centurion, they are a coward who can't fly a real ship. if they are using any faction specific stuff, like a prometheus, neutron mk III, etc, then they are 'cheating'. if i use a faction specific thing, like a valkyrie, i am 'flying smart'.
if someone flies away from me for more than 500m, they are a runner. if i fly 1000m out, then turn around and make a run on them, i am 'using tactics'.
if i run away back to a base and get healed, i am just saving money, being thrifty, because i am such a poverty stricken pilot. if someone else goes back to base to get healed, they are a no good low down dirty coward, and they are lucky i dont station camp them!
its very simple. if you dont understand this, you must not follow american politics very much
if i kill someone, its a daring act of skill and cunning.
if someone kills me, they are a no good low down dirty scuzz bucket. if they used missiles, they are a spamming moron. if they used a centurion, they are a coward who can't fly a real ship. if they are using any faction specific stuff, like a prometheus, neutron mk III, etc, then they are 'cheating'. if i use a faction specific thing, like a valkyrie, i am 'flying smart'.
if someone flies away from me for more than 500m, they are a runner. if i fly 1000m out, then turn around and make a run on them, i am 'using tactics'.
if i run away back to a base and get healed, i am just saving money, being thrifty, because i am such a poverty stricken pilot. if someone else goes back to base to get healed, they are a no good low down dirty coward, and they are lucky i dont station camp them!
its very simple. if you dont understand this, you must not follow american politics very much
Hypocrisy is indeed the policy of PvP in Vendetta...
You forgot one:
If me and my buddies gank someone, it's teamwork; if I get ganked, all those who did it to me are skilless n00bs who must gank in order to get PKs.
If me and my buddies gank someone, it's teamwork; if I get ganked, all those who did it to me are skilless n00bs who must gank in order to get PKs.
Literally, ganking means uneven odds, or multiple versus a single pilot, But it is also often used to refer to duel ganking, when someone violated the agreed terms of a mutual combat, and quite often, a third party interfering with someone else's duel.
The logic here is,
a) If you interrupt my honorable duel, then
b) You must not respect me or my commitments to other players, thus
c) Your sense of honor must be broken or warped, thus
d) there is no point in me trying to extend any honor towards you, because it would be a waste of effort
So most people don't gank duelers, unless they feel both duelers are without any sense of honor.
Example: If I see TumbleMonster dueling, then only his opponents reputation is of consideration, since I've seen tumble gank players I consider honorable.
Keep in mind, that many players throw the word "ganker" around loosely. Be sure your an eye witness, or hear it from trusted sources, before you accept someone else's assignments of labels.
I have heard someone use the terms consensual combat, and nonconsensual combat. There are no rules in nonconsensual combat. I have also heard it said "The aggressor of nonconsensual combat has no grounds for complaint", but that doesn't seam to stop them. I laugh when I hear pirates scream "Ganker".
The logic here is,
a) If you interrupt my honorable duel, then
b) You must not respect me or my commitments to other players, thus
c) Your sense of honor must be broken or warped, thus
d) there is no point in me trying to extend any honor towards you, because it would be a waste of effort
So most people don't gank duelers, unless they feel both duelers are without any sense of honor.
Example: If I see TumbleMonster dueling, then only his opponents reputation is of consideration, since I've seen tumble gank players I consider honorable.
Keep in mind, that many players throw the word "ganker" around loosely. Be sure your an eye witness, or hear it from trusted sources, before you accept someone else's assignments of labels.
I have heard someone use the terms consensual combat, and nonconsensual combat. There are no rules in nonconsensual combat. I have also heard it said "The aggressor of nonconsensual combat has no grounds for complaint", but that doesn't seam to stop them. I laugh when I hear pirates scream "Ganker".
Honour is something that is inherently individual. Forcing concepts of honour upon others is derisible, no matter who is doing it. This applies to real life as it does to games which involve more than just one person playing.
Oh, and: Ganking
Oh, and: Ganking
Ultimately, ganker pilots (ones who kill steal and interupt other people's fights) may get kills in the short term, but in the end they end up which a much lower kill count than the guy being ganked. For one, the gankee has more (and usually much less skilled) targets available. Second, people don't really like the behavior, and will punish the gankers accordingly.
I love multies. But I don't like being ganked, and there is a distinct difference. A gank group will swarm and rocket a target overwhelmingly. There is no way to win against 2-3 rocket rags or rocket mauds. They simply have too much shit flying through the air.
I love multies. But I don't like being ganked, and there is a distinct difference. A gank group will swarm and rocket a target overwhelmingly. There is no way to win against 2-3 rocket rags or rocket mauds. They simply have too much shit flying through the air.
Ganking can be seen as overkill in a way. 3 on 1 with most pilots would be considered a gank. 2 on 1 is also a gank provided the pilot being teamed up on isn't adept at fighting. It should be noted though that ganking is not simply uneven odds. 4 on 3 is not a gank, that's just a furball. 8 on 2 could be seen as a gank. But 8 on 6 wouldn't necessarily be a gank. It's all relative I guess.
i say, go with the flow