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the only part about the update that i have a proble with is the 1 munit timer on wormehols. I never saw the jump out and back tactic as an exploit. to me it made perfet sence, especialy if i have a FC battery and my oponent has a heavy bat. If i jump and wate for my oponent to jump in then i can jump back and have as long as it takes for his bat to chratg to get away. If you don't want this hapening don't fight near wormehloes.
vulnerability during warp in while not terable will i expect lead to a lot of complaining about warping into roids on in system jumps. and while it may be better to be invulnerable while jumping in i have a hard time saying it needs to be changed back.
vulnerability during warp in while not terable will i expect lead to a lot of complaining about warping into roids on in system jumps. and while it may be better to be invulnerable while jumping in i have a hard time saying it needs to be changed back.
I think you're all nuts, and the changes are great!
Maybe now I can start asking for money/cargo again and still have a chance to kill my target if they refuse/ignore.
It's still easy to get away, especially with any ship that has a 50 drain engine.
In an IDF valk I can still get away from anything, sorry to those I ran from, I swear it's "testing" :P
The 1 minute WH thing I'm still not sure about, I agree that the vulnerability kind of negates WH hopping as a viable tactic, but a behemoth still has a whole ton of armor, and without the 1 minute timer I think it could still benefit from hopping.
In general, I think the nay sayers are freaking out over nothing, it's only been 1 day, give it a chance, try new strategies and re-evaluate your mindsets of the game.
Running was never supposed to be easy, not for a trader, not for a anyone.
I'm still waiting for someone to name any other RPG where you can start a fight and run away when you realize you're going to die.
Maybe now I can start asking for money/cargo again and still have a chance to kill my target if they refuse/ignore.
It's still easy to get away, especially with any ship that has a 50 drain engine.
In an IDF valk I can still get away from anything, sorry to those I ran from, I swear it's "testing" :P
The 1 minute WH thing I'm still not sure about, I agree that the vulnerability kind of negates WH hopping as a viable tactic, but a behemoth still has a whole ton of armor, and without the 1 minute timer I think it could still benefit from hopping.
In general, I think the nay sayers are freaking out over nothing, it's only been 1 day, give it a chance, try new strategies and re-evaluate your mindsets of the game.
Running was never supposed to be easy, not for a trader, not for a anyone.
I'm still waiting for someone to name any other RPG where you can start a fight and run away when you realize you're going to die.
I like Spell's idea of being invulnerable while jumping in, but vulnerable while jumping out. This still solves the running issue, but helps to prevent wh camping. Everything else I really like.
Whats wrong with WH camping? In monitored space the faction system takes care of it, and gray space IS SUPPOSED TO BE VERY DANGEROUS.
The in system jump is all wrong. Why not require a specific amount of energy for in system say 100 or 50. This would certainly even the field.
Being vulnerable during the jump is another matter. THE DAMN ANIMATION IS ALL WRONG AND TOO LONG!!!! The only thing you should see is an immediate and speedy departure from the area. Not as it is now a slow ambling pace into a wormhole. THERE IS NO WORMHOLE!!! It's just a jump from 1 sector to another. I know, I know This is a temporary animation. Well fix it quick please, I do NOT like being vulnerable for the few seconds it takes to enter this false and incorrect wormhole. Oh, not just vulnerable, but defenseless as well. I CANT SHOOT BACK!!!!
Being vulnerable during the jump is another matter. THE DAMN ANIMATION IS ALL WRONG AND TOO LONG!!!! The only thing you should see is an immediate and speedy departure from the area. Not as it is now a slow ambling pace into a wormhole. THERE IS NO WORMHOLE!!! It's just a jump from 1 sector to another. I know, I know This is a temporary animation. Well fix it quick please, I do NOT like being vulnerable for the few seconds it takes to enter this false and incorrect wormhole. Oh, not just vulnerable, but defenseless as well. I CANT SHOOT BACK!!!!
Incarnate: If we are going to continue being vulnerable upon jump/warp-in, can we please have the toplist back during the exit animation?
From 0 -- “I'm still waiting for someone to name any other RPG where you can start a fight and run away when you realize you're going to die.”
What about if you didn’t start the fight but still want to run away? I’m not saying running should be easy, but it should be a viable option for a trader. I suspect we will see people use more infiboost ships with non energy weapons.
What about if you didn’t start the fight but still want to run away? I’m not saying running should be easy, but it should be a viable option for a trader. I suspect we will see people use more infiboost ships with non energy weapons.
Do I have a right to voice my opinion given the little game time I've had recently? hrm. Here's my 2cents anyway.
II dont mind too much about being vulnerable through sector or WH jumps. But the 1 min rule before coming back through WH is ridiculous. Given we're vulnerable anyhow, there's no need for this. It actually removes some tactical opportunities. Scenario: you're escorting a cargo (/friend etc). Everything seems fine and you jump ahead. On the other side of WH, all is fine but your friend (or convoy) signals it's being attacked on other side. Given you can't come back, they're screwed.
As for intra-system jumps, I'd change the gameplay a bit. Given you're (theoretically) going super fast and you jump out, what if your trajectory would get skewed when being fired at as you jump? I mean, off just by a few grid locs.
Another nice thing would be to stop changing the fundamental game rules. These new jump rules (battery drains for intra, 1 minute hold and vulnerability) all affect one's gameplay. It affect tactics. It affects ship selection for given missions. It's dang annoying to have to adjust to all these changes.
I'd ratter we have more game-related changes (where's the player frigate dangit?) ratter than game rule changes.
Bidoc Teagage; "The wormhole effect is used, too, for the time being.". This implies it's a temporary thing.
II dont mind too much about being vulnerable through sector or WH jumps. But the 1 min rule before coming back through WH is ridiculous. Given we're vulnerable anyhow, there's no need for this. It actually removes some tactical opportunities. Scenario: you're escorting a cargo (/friend etc). Everything seems fine and you jump ahead. On the other side of WH, all is fine but your friend (or convoy) signals it's being attacked on other side. Given you can't come back, they're screwed.
As for intra-system jumps, I'd change the gameplay a bit. Given you're (theoretically) going super fast and you jump out, what if your trajectory would get skewed when being fired at as you jump? I mean, off just by a few grid locs.
Another nice thing would be to stop changing the fundamental game rules. These new jump rules (battery drains for intra, 1 minute hold and vulnerability) all affect one's gameplay. It affect tactics. It affects ship selection for given missions. It's dang annoying to have to adjust to all these changes.
I'd ratter we have more game-related changes (where's the player frigate dangit?) ratter than game rule changes.
Bidoc Teagage; "The wormhole effect is used, too, for the time being.". This implies it's a temporary thing.
Yeah, the sector-to-sector jump (NOT WH) should be something more like the TV show Battlestar Galactica's jumps, quick & simple.
Clearley there is some tweeking needed on this update, but it was stated earlier by many players that any jump timers/bat req's would need some amount of experementation before they are really any good.
I dislike changing fundamental game rules as well. But, sometimes it becomes apparent that changes are needed. We go through some upheaval, and then things settle down a little better than they were before.
Incarnate;
Recently, I opted to alter my main character serco faction rating to minus dang-negative (from it's +900 boot-kissing it had). It's more in-line with Mogul Velaio's true calling: an IDF council. (IDF still lives!)
One in a while, I conducted forays into serco land. It taked a few pre-calculated jumps to look the strike force (and a fast ship), but this allowed some movements.
Given that we now need a full battery, it makes it impossible to:
- fly into "enemy" space for whatever purpose
- regain faction rating (since you can't enter their space)
- escape any kind of strike force
I think this needs attentions rapidly. Perhaps an intra-sector jump could require, say, ~150 power units. This makes it possible to make at least 1 jump with a FC battery, 2-3 jumps with the heavy battery and 3+ (?) with the meca/holy grail Ultra Charge.
(Oh, and the Ultra Charge is a totally unattainable goal btw. Those who reached it used the ... er... "technique" requiring newbie character created for that sole purpose of donating mentor points.)
As far as being vulnerable when we jump, it's a bit unfair that you can get shot at but that your can't neither steer or shoot back.
Recently, I opted to alter my main character serco faction rating to minus dang-negative (from it's +900 boot-kissing it had). It's more in-line with Mogul Velaio's true calling: an IDF council. (IDF still lives!)
One in a while, I conducted forays into serco land. It taked a few pre-calculated jumps to look the strike force (and a fast ship), but this allowed some movements.
Given that we now need a full battery, it makes it impossible to:
- fly into "enemy" space for whatever purpose
- regain faction rating (since you can't enter their space)
- escape any kind of strike force
I think this needs attentions rapidly. Perhaps an intra-sector jump could require, say, ~150 power units. This makes it possible to make at least 1 jump with a FC battery, 2-3 jumps with the heavy battery and 3+ (?) with the meca/holy grail Ultra Charge.
(Oh, and the Ultra Charge is a totally unattainable goal btw. Those who reached it used the ... er... "technique" requiring newbie character created for that sole purpose of donating mentor points.)
As far as being vulnerable when we jump, it's a bit unfair that you can get shot at but that your can't neither steer or shoot back.
I for one think the update is fantastic. I was able to kill a runner when he/she tried the old fight at 3km trick and seriously damage another as he/she tried to escape through a wh. I have never understood why you were invulnerable when jumping into or out of a wh, it always seemed very artificial and more suited to the space-quake nature of the alpha test.
It has made escaping the SF a bit harder, but that’s not really an issue as they were always a little too easy to escape.
As a side note, when someone gets killed while jumping, the wh effect keeps playing long after their ship has gone. Maybe it should collapse and produce some kind of concussive force or damage to ships close enough?
It has made escaping the SF a bit harder, but that’s not really an issue as they were always a little too easy to escape.
As a side note, when someone gets killed while jumping, the wh effect keeps playing long after their ship has gone. Maybe it should collapse and produce some kind of concussive force or damage to ships close enough?
I agree the new jump whre you have to have full battery in my opinion is somewhat stupid and people that run when their health gets low will run sooner so that is my opinion
Haven't tested the jump thing out, I don't really have a problem with nothing in it except for the in-jump animation, which does last a tad too long.
Jump bug notwithstanding, waiting for a battery to recharge is not big a deal; I even took out my FC and put in a heavy, and the change really is irrelevant.
Running away IS harder with anything but an FC, but people who fight and run are the only ones affected. Some say "but what if I'm standing still and am attacked?", well, floating around in space has never been a good idea, not even in station sectors (sometimes even the dumb station guards crash into you), and those people who do want to go AFK in space usually lock turbo in and let themselves be carried as far away as possible.
Jump bug notwithstanding, waiting for a battery to recharge is not big a deal; I even took out my FC and put in a heavy, and the change really is irrelevant.
Running away IS harder with anything but an FC, but people who fight and run are the only ones affected. Some say "but what if I'm standing still and am attacked?", well, floating around in space has never been a good idea, not even in station sectors (sometimes even the dumb station guards crash into you), and those people who do want to go AFK in space usually lock turbo in and let themselves be carried as far away as possible.
mgl_mouser: running from the SF in not impossible, your tactics need to be changed. You can no longer keep just ahead of the SF and use the wh as a safe haven, so you need to put more distance between you and them. I've found flying around roids and stations (preferably flying through some kind of tight opening) lets you put 1000m on them. Plenty of time to jump away.
The full battery rule is definatley flawed. requireing 200 power and only using 200 power to jump sounds a little more reasonable.
LeberMac,
i like the way it is in BSG too, but it isn't feasable for a game like this. first off in BSG they jump from anywhere, and their jumps are supposedly untracable. aside from those there is also the refrence to "spinning up" the jump engins that inplies there is some miner charging time involved. All and all i think the way VO's jump system is now is as BSG like as it can be without making running excessively easy. about the only cahnge that could be made (and posably what you were recomending) is to make the animation more of a blink out than a wormehole entrence for in system jumps.
mgl_mouser,
here is the M'at formula for escaping the current strike force:
1. fly a hog mk2. it has infiniboost and a hight tip speed, with enough room for the weapons i'm about to sugest.
2. carry proxcimity mines. i suppose concussion and maybee even lightning mines would work to, but proxies work like a charm.
3. plot a coarse that goes into no les than 2 empty sectors.
4. use infiniboost and clever alterations of terjectory to allow your battery to charge to full (this may take a few coare changes to keep ahead of the areana seekers). once you can jumpt into an empty sector do so.
5. once in unmonitered space, boost in a strate line using (x) to target the nearest hostil. If no one is within 1km of you jump. if the seekers ate in close than, boost in a strate line untill they reach about 100m trailing distance and drop a mine. one mine will usualy take down one seeker, and there are usualy 2 seekers.
6. once the seekers are gone, the strike force usualy can't keep close enough to track you when you jump.
if you want to kill bots to increase standing, i recomend using a low deain weapon, and attacking kanic, or orun colectors, so you can kill them while maintaining full or near full turbo speed. and don't get greedy, if you want to stay ahead of the SF you need to make quick kills, if one run doesn't do the trick, finde another bot, stopping to finish that one off is a bad idea.
anyway, i' sure this method is needlesly complicated, as i'm relatively new to the whole bitting in enemy teratory thing, but if i can do it and live than so can you. you just need parctice.
i like the way it is in BSG too, but it isn't feasable for a game like this. first off in BSG they jump from anywhere, and their jumps are supposedly untracable. aside from those there is also the refrence to "spinning up" the jump engins that inplies there is some miner charging time involved. All and all i think the way VO's jump system is now is as BSG like as it can be without making running excessively easy. about the only cahnge that could be made (and posably what you were recomending) is to make the animation more of a blink out than a wormehole entrence for in system jumps.
mgl_mouser,
here is the M'at formula for escaping the current strike force:
1. fly a hog mk2. it has infiniboost and a hight tip speed, with enough room for the weapons i'm about to sugest.
2. carry proxcimity mines. i suppose concussion and maybee even lightning mines would work to, but proxies work like a charm.
3. plot a coarse that goes into no les than 2 empty sectors.
4. use infiniboost and clever alterations of terjectory to allow your battery to charge to full (this may take a few coare changes to keep ahead of the areana seekers). once you can jumpt into an empty sector do so.
5. once in unmonitered space, boost in a strate line using (x) to target the nearest hostil. If no one is within 1km of you jump. if the seekers ate in close than, boost in a strate line untill they reach about 100m trailing distance and drop a mine. one mine will usualy take down one seeker, and there are usualy 2 seekers.
6. once the seekers are gone, the strike force usualy can't keep close enough to track you when you jump.
if you want to kill bots to increase standing, i recomend using a low deain weapon, and attacking kanic, or orun colectors, so you can kill them while maintaining full or near full turbo speed. and don't get greedy, if you want to stay ahead of the SF you need to make quick kills, if one run doesn't do the trick, finde another bot, stopping to finish that one off is a bad idea.
anyway, i' sure this method is needlesly complicated, as i'm relatively new to the whole bitting in enemy teratory thing, but if i can do it and live than so can you. you just need parctice.