Forums » Suggestions
> Why wouldn't the hive use beam weapons?
Because, until they scavenge it, they don't have the technology for it.
> Cap ships have been around longer than hive bots acording to the storyline anyway.
> So one has to have gotten destried by a hive queen somwhere along the line.
Capital ships have, but have beam weapons? And it doesn't matter, anyway. Either the Hive has all of the technology humans have, or they don't. If they do, then why do we have the loading tip about how they can't innovate themselves? If they don't, then what don't they have? IMO beam weapons would be the best thing for them not to have yet, because they're the best weapon in the game. So, players have to make a choice, do they take their capital ship with beam weapons in to attack the Leviathan, or not? If they do, they gain the advantage of having superior weapons, but they risk being destroyed, and then the hive bots can scavenge the beam weapon technology, which would cause players to lose the advantage of superior weaponry.
> I think that the leviathin should drop existing items untill the exploration
> expancion is in effect. That could be one way to introduce players to the
> idea that there is stuff out there worth risking being stranded in a
> far off system for. After all where did the hive get that hyper-death-ray,
> or that anti-matter torpedo?
Once we have the exploration module, that could be cool. But it would imply either the existance of alien sentience, or the Hive discovering an alternate path back to the Sol system.
> If the lviathin increases it's own armor over time it should do so at a
> conservative rate at firsy untill we can get a better idea of the long
> term rate of leviatrhin attacks. After all players will be able to clear
> their favorat sectors without ever attacking a leviathin, so it may go
> unherassed for some time.
I agree with that, especially as right now we don't have a very large playerbase. As the playerbase grows, I expect raids on the Leviathan strongholds to be more frequent.
Because, until they scavenge it, they don't have the technology for it.
> Cap ships have been around longer than hive bots acording to the storyline anyway.
> So one has to have gotten destried by a hive queen somwhere along the line.
Capital ships have, but have beam weapons? And it doesn't matter, anyway. Either the Hive has all of the technology humans have, or they don't. If they do, then why do we have the loading tip about how they can't innovate themselves? If they don't, then what don't they have? IMO beam weapons would be the best thing for them not to have yet, because they're the best weapon in the game. So, players have to make a choice, do they take their capital ship with beam weapons in to attack the Leviathan, or not? If they do, they gain the advantage of having superior weapons, but they risk being destroyed, and then the hive bots can scavenge the beam weapon technology, which would cause players to lose the advantage of superior weaponry.
> I think that the leviathin should drop existing items untill the exploration
> expancion is in effect. That could be one way to introduce players to the
> idea that there is stuff out there worth risking being stranded in a
> far off system for. After all where did the hive get that hyper-death-ray,
> or that anti-matter torpedo?
Once we have the exploration module, that could be cool. But it would imply either the existance of alien sentience, or the Hive discovering an alternate path back to the Sol system.
> If the lviathin increases it's own armor over time it should do so at a
> conservative rate at firsy untill we can get a better idea of the long
> term rate of leviatrhin attacks. After all players will be able to clear
> their favorat sectors without ever attacking a leviathin, so it may go
> unherassed for some time.
I agree with that, especially as right now we don't have a very large playerbase. As the playerbase grows, I expect raids on the Leviathan strongholds to be more frequent.
Beolach:
(Description of tedious, frustrating activity) Guess what? I still had fun.
...
But I do a ton of things in games that I consider to be fun, even when they don't give a reward. Circle strafing asteroids doesn't give me squat, but I find I do that fairly often.
Congratulations! You're .0001% of the population. (Circling strafing roids amuses you enough to pay for this game 0_o) I thought Guild was making a game that might one day again have an active player count of over 30?
That sounds harsher than I mean it, but it's still reality. The game has no real appeal to new players. Don't post with "Oh, I'm a new player!!111omfg" because you're the exception to the obvious rule. They need more varied, purposeful, immersive content, not to increase one thing's armor to insane levels.
Let me say again: the Leviathan should never fall to a single player. It shold require a varied raiding party to kill, maybe taking a full hour of intense, group attack to take down completely. However, it needs to have significant in-game results. Clearing the asteroid fields isn't nearly enough - for one, mining is also boring as hell, but then it's meant to be. The Leviathan shouldn't fall into that timesink category.
The Hive, overall, needs a far more active role in the game. I honestly do not care that it exists at this point. It has no effect on my ability to play the game, other than botting. In which case I want the bots to respond as quickly as possible so I can end the eyeball searing tedium.
hmm...
I don't think I'm communicating this effectively. The primary interaction with the hive should not be entirely player based, and the only motivation for killing it should not be player based. The majority should be mission based, clearing systems for NPC miners, or clearing swarms from space lane sectors for NPC traders, or killing Hive Queens, not because you are part of the statistical outlier that enjoys repetitive activity, but because you have a mission to do so with even the barest XP or RP reward.
The Leviathan shouldn't be something you just do for the hell of it - it should be something that you get as a group mission, maybe with a helper force of NPCs or a guide or something that makes this universe feel like it's populated by more than 30 homicidal maniacs. If you want to organize a random group to take it down, you can, but that's not something normal gamers want to do.
(Description of tedious, frustrating activity) Guess what? I still had fun.
...
But I do a ton of things in games that I consider to be fun, even when they don't give a reward. Circle strafing asteroids doesn't give me squat, but I find I do that fairly often.
Congratulations! You're .0001% of the population. (Circling strafing roids amuses you enough to pay for this game 0_o) I thought Guild was making a game that might one day again have an active player count of over 30?
That sounds harsher than I mean it, but it's still reality. The game has no real appeal to new players. Don't post with "Oh, I'm a new player!!111omfg" because you're the exception to the obvious rule. They need more varied, purposeful, immersive content, not to increase one thing's armor to insane levels.
Let me say again: the Leviathan should never fall to a single player. It shold require a varied raiding party to kill, maybe taking a full hour of intense, group attack to take down completely. However, it needs to have significant in-game results. Clearing the asteroid fields isn't nearly enough - for one, mining is also boring as hell, but then it's meant to be. The Leviathan shouldn't fall into that timesink category.
The Hive, overall, needs a far more active role in the game. I honestly do not care that it exists at this point. It has no effect on my ability to play the game, other than botting. In which case I want the bots to respond as quickly as possible so I can end the eyeball searing tedium.
hmm...
I don't think I'm communicating this effectively. The primary interaction with the hive should not be entirely player based, and the only motivation for killing it should not be player based. The majority should be mission based, clearing systems for NPC miners, or clearing swarms from space lane sectors for NPC traders, or killing Hive Queens, not because you are part of the statistical outlier that enjoys repetitive activity, but because you have a mission to do so with even the barest XP or RP reward.
The Leviathan shouldn't be something you just do for the hell of it - it should be something that you get as a group mission, maybe with a helper force of NPCs or a guide or something that makes this universe feel like it's populated by more than 30 homicidal maniacs. If you want to organize a random group to take it down, you can, but that's not something normal gamers want to do.
We still need queen killin missions :(
/me is unique, just like everyone else!
No, circle strafing 'roids doesn't amuse me enough to pay for the game. If that were all there was, I wouldn't be paying. But I do amuse myself that way from time to time, even though I don't get any reward from it.
I agree, more variety & immersive content with a specific purpose is something that should be added. But that's what all this new Hive stuff (including the Leviathan) is supposed to do, it's supposed to give us a real purpose for killing the hive bots.
I'm not saying that the Leviathan's armor should be increased to insane levels. Have you fought a Leviathan yet on the test server, Starfisher? Right now they can be destroyed by a single player in a few hours or so: make that 5-10 players, it'll boom in significantly less than an hour. I see that as meaning the Leviathan is weaker than it should be right now. The obvious solution is to increase how much armor it starts with, but I think it would be more interesting to let it start off with the same, rather low, armor that it starts with now, but then it adds additional armor to itself over time.
And I don't think it's likely that it will ever actually get insanely high armor levels. Yes, if it did ever reach the max value an unsigned long can hold, then that would be way too much armor. But even if it was never attacked at all, it would take centuries for it to get that high. My suggestion is that it adds armor at a rate somewhere between 100 to 1000 points an hour. Even if it was 1000 points an hour, that's only 24000 points a day, 168000 points a week. Yes, that looks like a lot, but think about it, how much damage can a single player do to it in that amount of time? A single Rag full of gems and stingrays can do 129700 damage in a single run. That means one player, in less than 5 minutes, can do burn through almost as much armor as the Leviathan can build in a week.
> The Hive, overall, needs a far more active role in the game.
That's what all the new hive stuff the devs are working on is supposed to do.
> The primary interaction with the hive should not be entirely player based, and
> the only motivation for killing it should not be player based. The majority
> should be mission based, clearing systems for NPC miners, or clearing swarms
> from space lane sectors for NPC traders, or killing Hive Queens, not because
> you are part of the statistical outlier that enjoys repetitive activity, but
> because you have a mission to do so with even the barest XP or RP reward.
I completely agree with this (and BTW, I never said I enjoy repetitive activity: that's what I meant when I said botting was tedious, not boring - it's fun for a while [hence, not boring], but it gets old [hence, tedious]). There should be missions and medals and other rewards. But they should be fun, which in large part means they should be challenging. For the Leviathan to be challenging, it needs to have more armor than it does now, and I think having it continuously build armor for itself would be a more interesting way to do that, than just increasing its starting armor.
No, circle strafing 'roids doesn't amuse me enough to pay for the game. If that were all there was, I wouldn't be paying. But I do amuse myself that way from time to time, even though I don't get any reward from it.
I agree, more variety & immersive content with a specific purpose is something that should be added. But that's what all this new Hive stuff (including the Leviathan) is supposed to do, it's supposed to give us a real purpose for killing the hive bots.
I'm not saying that the Leviathan's armor should be increased to insane levels. Have you fought a Leviathan yet on the test server, Starfisher? Right now they can be destroyed by a single player in a few hours or so: make that 5-10 players, it'll boom in significantly less than an hour. I see that as meaning the Leviathan is weaker than it should be right now. The obvious solution is to increase how much armor it starts with, but I think it would be more interesting to let it start off with the same, rather low, armor that it starts with now, but then it adds additional armor to itself over time.
And I don't think it's likely that it will ever actually get insanely high armor levels. Yes, if it did ever reach the max value an unsigned long can hold, then that would be way too much armor. But even if it was never attacked at all, it would take centuries for it to get that high. My suggestion is that it adds armor at a rate somewhere between 100 to 1000 points an hour. Even if it was 1000 points an hour, that's only 24000 points a day, 168000 points a week. Yes, that looks like a lot, but think about it, how much damage can a single player do to it in that amount of time? A single Rag full of gems and stingrays can do 129700 damage in a single run. That means one player, in less than 5 minutes, can do burn through almost as much armor as the Leviathan can build in a week.
> The Hive, overall, needs a far more active role in the game.
That's what all the new hive stuff the devs are working on is supposed to do.
> The primary interaction with the hive should not be entirely player based, and
> the only motivation for killing it should not be player based. The majority
> should be mission based, clearing systems for NPC miners, or clearing swarms
> from space lane sectors for NPC traders, or killing Hive Queens, not because
> you are part of the statistical outlier that enjoys repetitive activity, but
> because you have a mission to do so with even the barest XP or RP reward.
I completely agree with this (and BTW, I never said I enjoy repetitive activity: that's what I meant when I said botting was tedious, not boring - it's fun for a while [hence, not boring], but it gets old [hence, tedious]). There should be missions and medals and other rewards. But they should be fun, which in large part means they should be challenging. For the Leviathan to be challenging, it needs to have more armor than it does now, and I think having it continuously build armor for itself would be a more interesting way to do that, than just increasing its starting armor.
I just read Starfisher's post, in part about how we should make the Hive affect NPCs and missions. I laughed, because Ray was just complaining that it was killing the NPC in a mission he was building ;)
The Hive *will* have a greater influence on the universe than just being in the way or being something to get together and kill. But first the rest of the universe needs to be a little more receptive to influence than it is now.
For instance, if the Hive were to occupy a sector that NPC traders go through, right now it would kill them and they wouldn't make their deliveries, but since the economy isn't really changed by that event, no one would care. We do intend to make things like that matter to the players. Maybe the Hive has control of all the sectors with Xith in a system that people buy some advanced ship from. Suddenly the stations in that system are buying all their Xith from player and NPC traders (instead of player/NPC miners and traders) and the traders are being harrased by the Hive too. The price of the ship skyrockets and maybe even becomes largely unavailable in that system. Due to the high demand of Xith in this Hive-infested system, the price goes up elsewhere in the universe too. The ship's price also goes up elsewhere, and since it's a favorite of escorts, the price of an escort goes up. The cost of a trade run through that system also goes up (along with things commonly carried on those runs), to some players delight and others' dismay. Now you have a good reason to get together and try to take out the Leviathan (or clear the hive out of the Xith-rich sectors). Or maybe you and your guild have an interest in keeping the hive around, and make life difficult for those trying to clear the system. Thats just a simple example, and not necessarily the first reason you'll have (since it requires reworking the economy, which is not a small task).
Keep making suggestions, but try to remember that we've thought of and/or read most of them before, and have every intention of making the best of them a reality just as soon as we can.
The Hive *will* have a greater influence on the universe than just being in the way or being something to get together and kill. But first the rest of the universe needs to be a little more receptive to influence than it is now.
For instance, if the Hive were to occupy a sector that NPC traders go through, right now it would kill them and they wouldn't make their deliveries, but since the economy isn't really changed by that event, no one would care. We do intend to make things like that matter to the players. Maybe the Hive has control of all the sectors with Xith in a system that people buy some advanced ship from. Suddenly the stations in that system are buying all their Xith from player and NPC traders (instead of player/NPC miners and traders) and the traders are being harrased by the Hive too. The price of the ship skyrockets and maybe even becomes largely unavailable in that system. Due to the high demand of Xith in this Hive-infested system, the price goes up elsewhere in the universe too. The ship's price also goes up elsewhere, and since it's a favorite of escorts, the price of an escort goes up. The cost of a trade run through that system also goes up (along with things commonly carried on those runs), to some players delight and others' dismay. Now you have a good reason to get together and try to take out the Leviathan (or clear the hive out of the Xith-rich sectors). Or maybe you and your guild have an interest in keeping the hive around, and make life difficult for those trying to clear the system. Thats just a simple example, and not necessarily the first reason you'll have (since it requires reworking the economy, which is not a small task).
Keep making suggestions, but try to remember that we've thought of and/or read most of them before, and have every intention of making the best of them a reality just as soon as we can.
and that example was actually one I had come up with for a completely different post momerath.. sort of I'll just post it here rathar than creating a new thread for it.
I also assumed a more robust economy (something like the one i duscussed in my other post, referenced here: http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/10897 ), but I tied it to the mission system.
A trade route between two stations is highly inflated and as such very profitable, and NPC traders are working the route to keep the economy in balance.
The hive moves in and takes over a sector between the end station and one of the wormholes.
That sector ends up in a storm, and the hive bots kill most or all of the traders.
After X traders fail to reach the station, a new mission is created at the two stations involved.
The mission can only be 'active' for one person/group at a time. Once someone takes the mission it dissapears from the active missions list. However it must be completed in a certain period of time (something reasonable to be determined later)
To complete the mission you must either:
a) locate the point where the transports are being ambushed and clear the sector of hive bots, and report back to one of the stations so they can send an observer bot to verify that the hive has been eliminated from the route.
or b) ### transports must succesfully make the trip between stations without being destroyed (would work kind of like the CtC transports do now on a smaller scale and in both directions)
If the mission is not completed in that time, the server checks to see if the transports are still dying on the route(eg how many have made it through while the mission was going on? is the trade route still overly profitable?). if they are, the mission becomes availible again.
If you partially complete the mision it gives a dynamic allocation of reward, based on the criteria for mission success B. if 75% of the ### of transports made it, you get ~35% reward. (I feel the partial reward would max out at about 59% (99% of transports made it) of the reward for actually succeding, anything under 40% success would just count as a failure.
The nice thing about the above mission template is that the goal and cause can be changed without significantly altering the mission, or even the text. Maybe its a group of NPC pirates blocking a wormhole that is stopping the transports.
Or, turn it into a PvP mission, perhaps a rival faction has created a mission to 'interrupt' its competitor's trade, and there are actual PLAYERS killing the transports. (that would make option b a more effective solution as it would be much harder to clear an entire trade route of enemy players)
I also assumed a more robust economy (something like the one i duscussed in my other post, referenced here: http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/10897 ), but I tied it to the mission system.
A trade route between two stations is highly inflated and as such very profitable, and NPC traders are working the route to keep the economy in balance.
The hive moves in and takes over a sector between the end station and one of the wormholes.
That sector ends up in a storm, and the hive bots kill most or all of the traders.
After X traders fail to reach the station, a new mission is created at the two stations involved.
The mission can only be 'active' for one person/group at a time. Once someone takes the mission it dissapears from the active missions list. However it must be completed in a certain period of time (something reasonable to be determined later)
To complete the mission you must either:
a) locate the point where the transports are being ambushed and clear the sector of hive bots, and report back to one of the stations so they can send an observer bot to verify that the hive has been eliminated from the route.
or b) ### transports must succesfully make the trip between stations without being destroyed (would work kind of like the CtC transports do now on a smaller scale and in both directions)
If the mission is not completed in that time, the server checks to see if the transports are still dying on the route(eg how many have made it through while the mission was going on? is the trade route still overly profitable?). if they are, the mission becomes availible again.
If you partially complete the mision it gives a dynamic allocation of reward, based on the criteria for mission success B. if 75% of the ### of transports made it, you get ~35% reward. (I feel the partial reward would max out at about 59% (99% of transports made it) of the reward for actually succeding, anything under 40% success would just count as a failure.
The nice thing about the above mission template is that the goal and cause can be changed without significantly altering the mission, or even the text. Maybe its a group of NPC pirates blocking a wormhole that is stopping the transports.
Or, turn it into a PvP mission, perhaps a rival faction has created a mission to 'interrupt' its competitor's trade, and there are actual PLAYERS killing the transports. (that would make option b a more effective solution as it would be much harder to clear an entire trade route of enemy players)
Awesome! That's exactly what I meant, except I can't explain things. You don't need to make the Leviathan tougher to kill, you just have to make it more woven in with the rest of the universe.
So a single player killing the Leviathan in an hour or two (if not less) is fine?
Ok, this is probably partially irrelevant, but whatever.
In a completely different game, there is a boss.
He has 8 arms, each with different attacks and characteristics, which all must be destroyed. Each takes a minimum of 10 minutes to waste, and one can heal all the others from time to time. Another can enhance their power, a couple more specialise in crippling status attacks, etc...
After you take the 8 arms out, you are faced with the unenviable task of killing the BODY. Which has a vast amount of HP, even MORE devastating attacks, minion summons, and the like. This body takes AN HOUR OF SUSTAINED ATTACKING to eliminate. Upon elimination, it drops the best damn weapons available- not 1, not 2, but 6 or 7. And all 9 parts combined give enough experience points to kick you up a hell of a lot.
Why is the leviathan so rigid?
You people are SO narrow-minded with the hull slowly ticking up.
THATS BORING.
Instead.
You have the leviathan periodically add bits to itself. Visible, chunky modules with their own weaponry and characteristics. Modules that could be blown off one by one before the body of the leviathan is exposed. Blow off a bit, you reveal a nice array of turrets and a section of the main body. You get a hunk of experience for your trouble and aid the main struggle against the leviathan. Missile racks, giant beam cannons, lightning-zapping-orbs, arrays of neutron blasters, bits which look like theyre made from salvage and welded on the side. The more diverse its weaponry and the more pronounced the pounding is to the onlookers and assailants, the more fun it is.
Now add alerts every time the leviathan adds something BIG to its arsenal. Not hull armor, WEAPONRY. Over time, the powerful body of the leviathan would be caked in hunks of death-dealing metal which, while LESS LETHAL than the body itself, make the body harder to kill.
In a completely different game, there is a boss.
He has 8 arms, each with different attacks and characteristics, which all must be destroyed. Each takes a minimum of 10 minutes to waste, and one can heal all the others from time to time. Another can enhance their power, a couple more specialise in crippling status attacks, etc...
After you take the 8 arms out, you are faced with the unenviable task of killing the BODY. Which has a vast amount of HP, even MORE devastating attacks, minion summons, and the like. This body takes AN HOUR OF SUSTAINED ATTACKING to eliminate. Upon elimination, it drops the best damn weapons available- not 1, not 2, but 6 or 7. And all 9 parts combined give enough experience points to kick you up a hell of a lot.
Why is the leviathan so rigid?
You people are SO narrow-minded with the hull slowly ticking up.
THATS BORING.
Instead.
You have the leviathan periodically add bits to itself. Visible, chunky modules with their own weaponry and characteristics. Modules that could be blown off one by one before the body of the leviathan is exposed. Blow off a bit, you reveal a nice array of turrets and a section of the main body. You get a hunk of experience for your trouble and aid the main struggle against the leviathan. Missile racks, giant beam cannons, lightning-zapping-orbs, arrays of neutron blasters, bits which look like theyre made from salvage and welded on the side. The more diverse its weaponry and the more pronounced the pounding is to the onlookers and assailants, the more fun it is.
Now add alerts every time the leviathan adds something BIG to its arsenal. Not hull armor, WEAPONRY. Over time, the powerful body of the leviathan would be caked in hunks of death-dealing metal which, while LESS LETHAL than the body itself, make the body harder to kill.
I don't think I'm narrow minded, I'm not saying the hull ticking up is the ONLY thing that should happen. But here's the thing: right now (or at least, last time I was on the test server), with the amount of armor the Leviathan on the test server has, it is possible for a single player to destroy it within a couple hours. Unless it gets more armor, it's not going to last for any significant length of time against a dozen or two players attacking it together. And I think letting it continue constructing additional hull armor for itself is a good way to solve that problem. The Leviathan is what builds Hive Queens, that's its primary purpose. So it's essentially a massive construction platform. So I think it makes sense that it could construct additional armor for itself. And I would consider that to be a more interesting solution than just increasing the armor the Leviathan spawns with.
Ok, you missed the point, so I'll summarize.
Armor is boring, weapons are not.
Why is it constructing simply additional metal plating for itself when it could be welding on salvaged guns and bits of ships with which to defend itself better?
Armor is boring, weapons are not.
Why is it constructing simply additional metal plating for itself when it could be welding on salvaged guns and bits of ships with which to defend itself better?
No, I think you missed my point. It needs more armor. With the armor it has now, 10 players could make it boom in 10 to 20 minutes. And IMO 10 players isn't really all that "massive" a group, and I'd like Leviathans to require closer to 30 to 50 players (although we don't really have the playerbase for that yet). Yes, additional weapons would make it more interesting to fight, and I'd like to see that as well, but if it doesn't have more armor it won't matter, it'll still pop way too soon, rather anti-climatic IMO.
[edit]
I wrote the above just before I went to bed, and as I read it now I don't think it communicates what I meant very well.
The way I see it, destroying the Leviathan should be a group activity, not a solo activity, and with a group it should take a fair amount of time to destroy. Not so much time as to become tedious, but it shouldn't just pop after a few bombing runs. Which means it needs to have more armor than it does now.
Now I want to clarify why I like having the Leviathan continuously add more armor to itself better than just raising the initial amount of armor it has. The big reason is that it allows a wide range of group sizes to be viable for attacking a Leviathan. If 10 players get together to make a raid against the Hive, they can try to find a "young" Leviathan that hasn't built up a lot of armor yet, and then those 10 players could destroy it in a reasonable amount of time. But it would also encourage player to form large, multi-nation raiding parties to attack the "older" Leviathans that have built up a significant amount of additional hull armor.
I think this is were UncleDave and I are looking at it differently: I think UncleDave sees the Leviathan adding armor as making it take more time to destroy with the same amount of players, while I'm looking at it as making it take more players to destroy in the same amount of time.
[/edit]
[edit]
I wrote the above just before I went to bed, and as I read it now I don't think it communicates what I meant very well.
The way I see it, destroying the Leviathan should be a group activity, not a solo activity, and with a group it should take a fair amount of time to destroy. Not so much time as to become tedious, but it shouldn't just pop after a few bombing runs. Which means it needs to have more armor than it does now.
Now I want to clarify why I like having the Leviathan continuously add more armor to itself better than just raising the initial amount of armor it has. The big reason is that it allows a wide range of group sizes to be viable for attacking a Leviathan. If 10 players get together to make a raid against the Hive, they can try to find a "young" Leviathan that hasn't built up a lot of armor yet, and then those 10 players could destroy it in a reasonable amount of time. But it would also encourage player to form large, multi-nation raiding parties to attack the "older" Leviathans that have built up a significant amount of additional hull armor.
I think this is were UncleDave and I are looking at it differently: I think UncleDave sees the Leviathan adding armor as making it take more time to destroy with the same amount of players, while I'm looking at it as making it take more players to destroy in the same amount of time.
[/edit]
I like this idea a lot, and kind of goes along with a mission idea I thought up, http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/1/10725#128525, the mission may need tweaking, but I think it would add a reason for killing the leviathan, and it ties into the increasing armor that the lev is getting via Beolach's suggestion.
According to a post in the GD, ( http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/1/11105 ), lesser bots now repair higher bots. This is a far better method to making the higher hive bots harder to kill than adding armor - it feels more real and is more interesting behavior to deal with.
Thanks Starfisher, I thought so too ;)
(though, I read this thread with an open mind)
(though, I read this thread with an open mind)
I'm going to hijack this thread for the discussion on the type of armor that I (and Celebrim, and to a lesser extent Spellcast) have over the years expounded. Basically, it would work in one of two ways:
* Armor absorbs up to [amount] damage per shot from weapons of [type]
* Armor absorbs [percent] damage per shot from weapons of [type]
The first way would eliminate the problem of people using fighter ships to blow up capital ships by finding a convenient nook and just shooting at from hiding. The second type would help with that, and would also be useful against larger weapons. I rather favor the first kind, though.
As to types, Celebrim proposed them as these:
* Reflective - lasers and blasters
* Ablative - rail gun, gatling cannon/turret, flechette cannon, gauss cannon
* Dissipating - explosions, charge cannons, plasma cannons
Reccommended reading:
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/1375 (note Celebrim's post)
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/1416
Let's get some devish input this time!
* Armor absorbs up to [amount] damage per shot from weapons of [type]
* Armor absorbs [percent] damage per shot from weapons of [type]
The first way would eliminate the problem of people using fighter ships to blow up capital ships by finding a convenient nook and just shooting at from hiding. The second type would help with that, and would also be useful against larger weapons. I rather favor the first kind, though.
As to types, Celebrim proposed them as these:
* Reflective - lasers and blasters
* Ablative - rail gun, gatling cannon/turret, flechette cannon, gauss cannon
* Dissipating - explosions, charge cannons, plasma cannons
Reccommended reading:
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/1375 (note Celebrim's post)
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/1416
Let's get some devish input this time!
I suggest effectively the same type of armor here
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/10941
in the later parts of the main post.
I definitely like the idea of a leviathin adding more stuff as it gets older ala uncledave's post. Might be hard to do without a lot of new art content tho, so what about adding more of the segments we allready have instead? Once they move like they are supposed to that would seem to be a good way to expand a leviathin without too much work. Each segment could be individually destroyable, and each one that gets added would have more weapons and add XXX armor. ( it takes a certain number of resources to add a new segment maybe.. making the rate of growth directly related to the activity of the playerbase in destroying bastions and mining outposts? )
then the leviathin could be like the centepede it resembles.. blowing up a middle section would result in 2 smaller leviathins. =D
I would also like to see an optional weapon on the largest capital ships and old leviathins that makes the entire huill act like a lightning mine, meaning that enemy ships that come within BLAH meters of it take damage. I'd suggest 50 meters from any point on the hull and a damage of 25% of a L-mine.
http://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/3/10941
in the later parts of the main post.
I definitely like the idea of a leviathin adding more stuff as it gets older ala uncledave's post. Might be hard to do without a lot of new art content tho, so what about adding more of the segments we allready have instead? Once they move like they are supposed to that would seem to be a good way to expand a leviathin without too much work. Each segment could be individually destroyable, and each one that gets added would have more weapons and add XXX armor. ( it takes a certain number of resources to add a new segment maybe.. making the rate of growth directly related to the activity of the playerbase in destroying bastions and mining outposts? )
then the leviathin could be like the centepede it resembles.. blowing up a middle section would result in 2 smaller leviathins. =D
I would also like to see an optional weapon on the largest capital ships and old leviathins that makes the entire huill act like a lightning mine, meaning that enemy ships that come within BLAH meters of it take damage. I'd suggest 50 meters from any point on the hull and a damage of 25% of a L-mine.
Did Michael read this yet?
PS: Yes, I am violating the Rules of Conduct.
PS: Yes, I am violating the Rules of Conduct.
well i was going through past threads and i have ur motivation here what happens when (and this will happen) the hive and even the levithan moves to b8 and other WH huh so thats ur motivation ok?
it will promptly be taken care of and will scuttle off with it's tenticles between it's armor in shame for trying to move against us humans. It has little hope of surviving if it tries to take a populated area.