I know you need to keep VO idiot friendly But your insistence on inserting all these binds is way out of hand. I cant even slip a single bind into my file in-game without you screwing me up at this point.

Either give us a way to shut your ---- meddling off or remove it!

Your well meaning efforts are really annoying!

edit:
I guess I should mention that my turbo lock which I have had bound to my tab key since 2008 was replaced by +zoom. the only way I can configure my dual sticks is to do it manually offline since VO keeps reassigning stuff based on a single stick setup.

What's a bind? Just play the game and get targetless.

This is more of a Suggestion, assuming you want more than a chance to vent. Moved.

I'm seriously confused. The game re-bound your tab key? And to.. zoom? Tab is turbo, why on earth would it bind it to zoom?

Or do you have some kind of "tab" on your joystick, and this is about how we handle joysticks?

I honestly don't know if this is a Suggestion or a Bug.

Its a complaint!

I have had the turbo lock bind on my linux pc bound to my tab key since 2008.

alias mt "+turbo 0"
alias -t "mt"
alias +t "+turbo; alias -t mt"
alias acti "Activate"
alias ttog "ttog1"
alias ttog2 "+turbo 0; alias ttog ttog1; alias acti Activate; alias -t mt; alias mt '+turbo 0'; echo 'Turbo OFF'"
alias ttog1 "+turbo 1; alias ttog ttog2; alias acti 'Activate; ttog2'; alias -t ' '; alias mt ttog2; echo 'Turbo ON'"

http://www.vo-wiki.com/wiki/Turbo_lock_bind

I was changing a bind on my joystick and afterwards I had +zoom bound to the tab key along with a bunch of stuff for d-pads which I don't have. There were also a number of other items I couldn't identify as well. (I am thinking phone)

I have commented on this before and asked you to provide a way to stop VO from changing stuff. To date the only way I can prevent it is to make the files read-only. I don't object to your hand holding the newbs _ Just make a way for the vets to turn it off or at least ask before changing stuff - A simple set defaults key in the config screen.

Right, but the problem here is that.. as far as I know, we don't change stuff. People re-bind their joystick and gamepad buttons/axes all the time, customization is pretty fundamental. I honestly don't recollect complaints about the game re-defining people's joysticks before? I mean, like half our PC players use joysticks. The whole original reason for the config files was to let people custom-define their joysticks and keyboards.

You may have commented on this before, but there's a good chance we didn't know what you were talking about then, either.

So, anyway, that's really weird, we'll look into it? If I had to take a wild guess, maybe your computer is shutting down USB ports to save on power, and when it comes back up Linux is assigning the devices a new ID? Although that wouldn't make sense with the read-only config thing.. maybe..? Honestly, no idea.

If you could be specific about exactly what joystick you have, what Linux version, and what kind of PC (laptop?) that'd probably be a good start.

PaKettle my WGAF is over 10 pages long, and in over a decade, NONE of my binds have been undone by updates. Dunno what went wrong with your setup, but it did not effect mine. Granted I am now running win 7 ent, but my wgaf goes back to when I was running win 2k, through win xp.

You might be well served by making backup copies of it. Just as an extra measure, I emailed it to myself, and printed a couple copies out, along with putting one copy on a cd.

I think it's a fig newton of his immigration. :-)

I did have a problem a while back of the system swapping my sticks but I solved that simply by defining them twice...

Vo has always reassigned stuff especially if one of the shoots is not assigned and twice if its shoot2....

Part of it is likely the fact that I am running two sticks instead of one. Shoot1 is not on the same stick as shoot2 for me and I know VO does not like it.

Try cleaning up your wgaf file and see if vo doesn't panic and start reassigning stuff.....

LNH I do keep a copy and it has served me well over the years...But I am curious why you keep one since yours has never gotten changed.....

Dual-joysticks may not be the most common case, it really isn't that super-unusual either. Plus we have had a whole assortment of people who use big multi-throttle/stick setups, like the Saitek X52 and X45. I've used the X45 with our game.

PaKettle, I'm not claiming there isn't some kind of problem or bug. But a lot of your earlier statements are predicated on the assumption that this is some sort of long-standing "known issue" and choice on our part, and.. it isn't, nor is it something other people are reporting.

So, if you want to help us track this down, you're going to need to go back to scratch and start approaching this as a rare bug that happens to be affecting you (and perhaps only you).

We're still interested in rare bugs. But what we'll need is a really solid and specific reproduction case (a way to replicate the conditions under which the bug happens), and enough technical detail to make sure we can make the same thing happen on our own testing machines and development VMs.

Then we can actually fix something.

"Dual-joysticks may not be the most common case..."

Um, can we get a show of hands? I love flying twin-stick.

o/

I had dual sticks and the game liked to unbind plugin commands and aliases on a pretty regular basis. It seemed to just randomly forget what was assigned to JOY0BUTTON7-11

I've had stuff like that happen on mobile plus my old post about how L1 kept binding to quit
https://www.vendetta-online.com/x/msgboard/2/31063#373101
Fixed it by writing in the config file

Isn't the x 52 and the like a joystick on the right and a throttle axis on the left so the stick always has shoot 2 and such.

I have seen that if targetless fails to load then VO will wipe out most of its related binds in a heartbeat. Its a frequent occurrence when working on a new plug in.

Perhaps as a starting point you could also try loading an empty wgaf / config file and take a hard look at everything VO automatically forces a bind to.

(Even though I hate bloat I am amazed at how much I am blind to .....)

I will try to document the incidents if I can...

"I had dual sticks and the game liked to unbind plugin commands and aliases on a pretty regular basis. It seemed to just randomly forget what was assigned to JOY0BUTTON7-11"

Any binds assigned to a command defined by a plug-in get erased any time the game is loaded and the plug-in is not present in the plugins directory. I think it can also happen if there is a lua error in the middle of while plug-ins are being loaded.

A simple way to avoid the plug-in binds getting erased is to create an alias for each plug-in command used and then bind to the aliases. Then the bind will persist whenever the plug-in is uninstalled (but the game will complain about it not being a valid command if you try to use the bind while the plug-in is not installed).

Knowing why it happens doesn't make it any less annoying.

I don't want to pick on targetless but it makes such a perfect example....

Your talking about making roughly 25 aliases and 25 binds to stop VO from changing the binds which is a royal pain and should be unneeded. That is for a single plug in.

The correct behaviour is for VO to not do anything until the player clicks on a button to tell VO to install a set of default binds.

For a first run of the game, setting up a working config file is expected but after the first run the behaviour is in fact usually going to be wrong. (I Know - Opinion...)

Apparently VO decided instead of activate on JOY1BUTTON4 I needed the mission log instead....
Thanks Incarnate, you got me killed over a stupid ion storm.

PS there were no plug in loading errors....

PPS the replication you need is to setup/install targetless and then delete the folder and watch the changes...

So, the issue involves a plugin?

Sometimes config.ini gets messed up a bit, when VO crashes on exit due to plugins mainly.

Guess need to do preflight checks ;-)