I was reminded yesterday, after Strat was pk'ing and harassing people (at a Corvus station) as they repaired and reloaded for a nearby furball, that there is no good recourse (except at Corvus stations, of course) against people damaging you in monitored space. If they are admired or better there and do it outside of the NFZ you can't kill them without losing standing so they can damage you while you leave or travel through the sector with impunity. Being able to abuse the faction system like that is obnoxious.

Therefore, I propose that if you damage someone in monitored space and outside of a NFZ your standing with the controlling faction be temporarily set to neutral. The less the faction system gets in the way of people who want to PvP the better.

+100000000

very wise suggestion

I've been screwing with people by doing this for years, usually shooting them down to 5% or so, and have always thought it great that I could do so without any penalty.

Speaking of fighting in monitored space, I keep getting instant 1,000,000cr bounties if I kill somebody outside of a Corvus NFZ :(

Anyvays, that's a great idea. I suppose it wouldn't be triggered by bump damage, and would end if the violator left the sector or docked?

So, clearly CHRN proposing a change which is detrimental to their normal pattern of behaviour ?

Aye , I'd support that ...

I'm not sure I understand this suggestion. Is it only the initiator of the fight whose standing gets dropped to neutral? And is it only dropped to neutral if they attack someone with positive standing to begin with?

Otherwise, it seems to me that there would never be a faction penalty anytime someone is killed outside of the NFZ (unless the person shot at doesn't fire back).

The suggestion is to temporarily drop to neutral the standing of anyone who deals weapon damage to anything. Leaving the sector or docking would reset the change.

Faction penalties strongly discourage killing. If someone attacks me I want to have the option to fight back.

In other words, if some 13 PoS turd starts shooting your ass at a station (other than Corvus) and hit's you, his standing drops to neutral so you can kill him without issue. (as a example)

There, that wasn't so painful now.. was it?

+1

+1

Good idea. Solves a known exploit and is difficult to abuse. Just be sure that returning fire against someone who is temp-neutral doesn't flag you as temp-neutral yourself.

vIsitor: the general principle here as I see it is that the faction system shouldn't stop people who want to fight from fighting. Your alternative suggestion is contrary to that.

+1
You should drop to temp neutral if you choose to fire back.
The game should treat it as a duel.

Therefore, I propose that if you damage someone in monitored space and outside of a NFZ your standing with the controlling faction be temporarily set to neutral. The less the faction system gets in the way of people who want to PvP the better.

This is a very good idea, and will make fighting inside nation space a thousand times less obnoxious. +1

Maalik: the general principle here as I see it is that the faction system shouldn't stop people who want to fight from fighting. Your alternative suggestion is contrary to that.

PaKettle: You should drop to temp neutral if you choose to fire back.
The game should treat it as a duel.

I can't say I agree to the spirit of that. Basically, it means that renegades can avoid punishment if someone choses to defend themselves. Thats a logical enough reaction from someone who is being shot at (especially a newbie), and basically opens a window for pirates and the like to get player-kills without consequence. Expecting people to just sit tight and die so that the offender in question gets penalized isn't realistic.

This is non-consentual combat we're talking about; if you want a duel then arrange a duel.

I'm with vIsitor here.

I see your point but useing the duel system is a bit cumbersome and not very spontaneous....

As it stands now fighting back will only earn you a kos so getting rid of the penalty for defending yourself would seem to be an improvement.

Wanting to PvP does not make you a renegade in need of punishment. And it's not just pirates who do this. I've had this done to me by VPR quite a few times. If instigators cannot defend themselves against counter-attacks then they will be forced to run off which means that monitored space will remain devoid of meaningful and enjoyable PvP.

You can already bait newbs into making themselves killable by having them violate a NFZ. This has not demonstrated itself to be a problem in practice, however.

People learn quickly that if they do not want to risk dying then they should not involve themselves in combat.

But regardless of whether retaliators should be set to neutral, instigators definitely should.

I agree with vIsitor, retaliators should not be set to neutral, and instigators definitely should.

the problem is, Nahin, as far as i know there is no mechanic in VO to track who fires first.

Why do so many suggestions turn into arguments these days? Oh wait they always did.

Anyway, if you want to duel with someone in nation space, that is possible, as long as you can trust they will forgive you, so throw that argument out of the boat. As far as VO not knowing *who fired first* well, that is just nonsense. Whoever fired first fired first? There is a difference between who fired first and who caused damage first though. Tracking who is the instigator in this instance can be tricky.

I have fired across many a newbs bow and then rammed them inside an NFZ. This may make some (and does) un-educated new guys think I shot em, and they return fire, hitting me inside the NFZ. This gives me a licence to kill em, so I do. This idea only adds to this *feature* so I am of course all for it :P

-1