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... and restrain him...
Ethanol boom may fuel shortage of tequila
The switch to corn will contribute to an expected scarcity of agave in coming years, with officials predicting that farmers will plant between 25 percent and 35 percent less agave this year to turn the land over to corn.
Ethanol boom may fuel shortage of tequila
The switch to corn will contribute to an expected scarcity of agave in coming years, with officials predicting that farmers will plant between 25 percent and 35 percent less agave this year to turn the land over to corn.
Oh My God NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!
Damn ethanol!
Damn ethanol!
D:
Ethanol fuel sucks anyway, energy balance-wise.
Idiots, all of 'em.
Idiots, all of 'em.
Economic pressures. It is the raising price of oil (thanks to some hare-brained quagmire of a war that some of you might be aware of) that has made ethanol, and that south-african liquid coal, economically feasible.
However, like with nuclear power, we're now facing the realities of these supposedly superior biofuels: they may be environmentally friendly and don't contribute as much to global warming directly, but they affect other sides of the equation negatively, namely in this case, the food supply, and that has got to be a bad thing in the long run.
However, like with nuclear power, we're now facing the realities of these supposedly superior biofuels: they may be environmentally friendly and don't contribute as much to global warming directly, but they affect other sides of the equation negatively, namely in this case, the food supply, and that has got to be a bad thing in the long run.
They are not 'environmentally friendly', far from it.
For one thing, you have to plant it in monocultures to have any kind of satisfactory yield (at least if you want to satisfy part of the need for gasoline). Monocultures are, by definition, bad.
For another, you need gas to run a tractor. You need electricity to refine the ethanol. I mean, come on, people. Just because the plant is green to the eye doesn't mean it's 'green'.
So, I agree with you, jex, and put some more on it.
For one thing, you have to plant it in monocultures to have any kind of satisfactory yield (at least if you want to satisfy part of the need for gasoline). Monocultures are, by definition, bad.
For another, you need gas to run a tractor. You need electricity to refine the ethanol. I mean, come on, people. Just because the plant is green to the eye doesn't mean it's 'green'.
So, I agree with you, jex, and put some more on it.
Well, ethanol just sucks anyway, you need engine modifications to run it, and the mileage you get out of ethanol is something like only 65% to 70% as good as with normal gasoline, so we'll need MORE of it to do the same amount of work. Not to mention the rest of the infrastructure costs associated with it.
Oh, and the price of oil is not ALL about Iraq's "service" disruption due to the war, it's also about increased demand across the board internationally. The fact that many nations have demands that will triple or quadruple in 5 years has a lot to do with the price of oil. Or maybe it's OPEC keeping supply artificially low?
All I know is I want my tequila. Maybe we can make cars run on THAT. Oh, what a perfect world!
Oh, and the price of oil is not ALL about Iraq's "service" disruption due to the war, it's also about increased demand across the board internationally. The fact that many nations have demands that will triple or quadruple in 5 years has a lot to do with the price of oil. Or maybe it's OPEC keeping supply artificially low?
All I know is I want my tequila. Maybe we can make cars run on THAT. Oh, what a perfect world!
Switch to moonshine? I mean that is pretty much what ethanol is right? Just that they add poisons to it to keep people from...drinking it out of the pump(*looks at lebermac). So just switch to moonshine, plenty of supply for that. Make it yourself.
The US is switching to adding ethanol in its gas. In a few years our gas will have 20% ethanol in it. And Brazil and other countries have cars that just ruin on ethanol. I think we should ethanol at least its an easily renewable resource.
shows how much you know about agriculture. soil degradation occurs when you over-cultivate a same specie over time on the same soil. this is why farmers rotate their cultures and vary their crops.
UC, crop rotation is still possible when the end product is ethenol, you can make booze out of almost any biomass that contains starches or sugars. However some crops like sugar cane and agave yeild a relativley high amount of ethenol per acre. Who knows perhaps some kind of genetically engineered crops for making ethenol is the solution.
"Switch to moonshine? I mean that is pretty much what ethanol is right? Just that they add poisons to it to keep people from...drinking it out of the pump(*looks at lebermac). So just switch to moonshine, plenty of supply for that. Make it yourself."
currentley the gasoline in E85 is sufficient to make it undrinkable, though I'd love to figure out a way to extract just the ethenol from E85, more to say I figured it out than for consumption.
edit:
almost forgot the major engine modifications required to run ethenol; the fuel air mixture has to be tweeked, possibley requireing a more powerfull fuel pump, and there might be a problem with shorter fuel pump life because ethenol has next to no ability to lubricate anything.
"Switch to moonshine? I mean that is pretty much what ethanol is right? Just that they add poisons to it to keep people from...drinking it out of the pump(*looks at lebermac). So just switch to moonshine, plenty of supply for that. Make it yourself."
currentley the gasoline in E85 is sufficient to make it undrinkable, though I'd love to figure out a way to extract just the ethenol from E85, more to say I figured it out than for consumption.
edit:
almost forgot the major engine modifications required to run ethenol; the fuel air mixture has to be tweeked, possibley requireing a more powerfull fuel pump, and there might be a problem with shorter fuel pump life because ethenol has next to no ability to lubricate anything.
fuck ethanol. It's costly, inefficient, and no better for the environment than oil. If you want to look to alternative fuel sources, there's plenty of sunshine to go around, and lets not forget wind, water and geothermic energy. You want your car to get better gas mileage? how about ∞ mi/g? you can get that with a photovoltaic cell car. Just a solar panel for a roof and some big Li-Ion batteries.
clay, it's not possible when the farmers abandon everything else to grow only the lucrative stuff: corny fuel.
by the time the land is exhausted, it's too late. it because a poor unproductive sand trap. ethanol is a fraud and a danger to the world food supplies.
by the time the land is exhausted, it's too late. it because a poor unproductive sand trap. ethanol is a fraud and a danger to the world food supplies.
You know, not a real solution, since it's tied to gasoline, but down here many cars use natural gas, cleaner and easier to "produce" than gasoline; there are even stations that offer gas as well as gasoline, or that are for natural gas vesicles entirely. Minimal if any engine modification is required, if I remember, and yet people don't see too interested in the technology.
Even if they were more efficient, biofuels including biodiesel are not worth it, just for the danger to our food supply.
I think hybrids are the best choice right now, until better all-electric cars hit the market, but hybrids are still hideously expensive, even if the government offers subsidies to buyers (it does down here).
Even if they were more efficient, biofuels including biodiesel are not worth it, just for the danger to our food supply.
I think hybrids are the best choice right now, until better all-electric cars hit the market, but hybrids are still hideously expensive, even if the government offers subsidies to buyers (it does down here).
Ethanol is good, but not as good as some other alternative fuels. There's one that's actually made of a kind of midwest plains grass—essentially stuff that cows eat. With some kind of processing (it was awhile ago, I forget how the documentary described it) it is actually cheaper to produce than ethanal, it's more plentiful (hey, it's grass!) and it's more effective as a fuel.
Ethanol is a good start, but even in terms of alternative fuels, it has a lot of drawbacks. This grass stuff is a better choice, and it's actually closer at-hand.
Ethanol is a good start, but even in terms of alternative fuels, it has a lot of drawbacks. This grass stuff is a better choice, and it's actually closer at-hand.
We need either the scientists to discover cold fusion, or the fundies to bring on the Rapture. Either way our energy troubles are over.
Or we figure out what Dark Matter is and harness it. Then the universe would end. And we'd find out how right Dr. Lecter was when he said "the Void awaits you…"
Man I'm tired.
Man I'm tired.
Seraph, Ethanol is *not* good. In fact, no fuel from plants is 'good' in terms of energy balance.
As Cunjo and jexkerome said, there are multiple representations of energy that can be harnessed. What's important is that not only one path is being followed, but many different ones, to ensure versatility.
However, growing plants to create combustible fuel is not one of them.
As Cunjo and jexkerome said, there are multiple representations of energy that can be harnessed. What's important is that not only one path is being followed, but many different ones, to ensure versatility.
However, growing plants to create combustible fuel is not one of them.
It would be far more efficient to just use electric cars instead of searching for alternative fuels to power our rather antiquated internal comustion engines. Unfortunately, ICE engines are cheaper to manufacture, and the automotive industry has long been in cahoots with Big Oil (despite their heated denials to such alligations).
As for power in general, it would be better to harness more readily availible forms of renewable power like Solar, WInd, and (dare I say it?) Nuclear.
As for power in general, it would be better to harness more readily availible forms of renewable power like Solar, WInd, and (dare I say it?) Nuclear.