I've recently been seeing a lot of posts on other websites calling Vendetta "a first person shooter set in space" instead of a space flight sim.

I'm not really sure how this movement got started, particularly since Vendetta uses newtonian mechanics for the most part.

Is it the fact that you can strafe in all directions, including backwards?

Is it the artificially imposed "speed limits"?

Is it the mouselook feature?

Is it the fact that gamers are used to less realisitic physics like in Wing Commander and X-Wing?

I'm not trying to start an argument about how the physics engine of Vendetta should be changed... I think the engine is great and the devs should stick with what they've got... I'm just genuinely curious why Vendetta has been repeatedly described by some people as "a first person shooter set in space", what factors might contribute to that perception, and whether or not you agree.

It's the fact that you have to be fifty-one hundred meters away from your target to be effective, have no momentum to speak of in the fighter ships and the controls are virtually identical to an FPS. Increase ship mass by 3, increase weapon speed by 9 or 10, require a joystick and people would call it a space flight sim.

I agree with the perception... I mean, remember how everyone called it SpaceQuake before the leveling system? That wasn't just because of quick respawns. The gameplay felt like Quake with no gravity and no down. This isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it does make for some frustration while you adjust to the new rules of weapons and flight.

Well, up until very recently thats exactly what vendetta has been. It WAS effectively spacequake after all. The RPG elements are very new and as yet mostly unfinished, so i can see how the perception might have come about.

I can see where the concept came from, I can also see (somewhat, only the devs know for sure after all) where the game is going. Vendetta is definitely a RPG not a FPS, It's jut not totally there yet.

The basic gameplay is and will be FPS, though. The combat and movement system, at least.

In reality, you could fire a bunch of pebbles in space and reek havoc on an enemy fleet.

Wreak?

no, he means it would stink to be the enemy.

I would be a little better if I could be able to control a ship using mouse wraping or Mouse Glide instead of Mouse Looking all the time.

No momentum? We have momentum.

What are mouse warping and Mouse Glide?

The Xwing flight system is unrealistic, i mean how would you slow your ship down?

If there is every guna be a space ship it's guna had manuvering thrusters, allowing it to perform more complicated moves.

The Xwing flys more like a conventional plane than a spaceship

I can see where people might get the feeling that this is an FPS in space, but personally speaking that has never been my experience.

In most FPSers you can change direction instantly. In Vendetta ships have actual inertia, both translational and rotational, which much be acted on by the ship's thrust and torque. In an FPS if you stop running you won't continue to drift like in Vendetta.

I think people sometimes wrestle with the concept of physics mode, which allows players to move in one direction and shoot in another. This does kinda make it feel a little like Gundam Wing or something. But in my humble opinion this just adds to the realism... this is space after all which affords many more degrees of freedom than atmospheric flight. Someone who has been playing WWII simulators may come to this and call it an FPS since they don't have things like lift to work with.

I think flying around in Vendetta is dizzying, like at any moment I might fall forward through my computer screen and into the vastness of space (okay, that might be a slight exaggeration ;p). I've never thought of it as an FPS in space... truth be told I've always sorta thought of it as a 3D multiplayer EV Nova.

I suppose I should say "so little momentum that it seems like your ship is a feather at times." Yes, there's inertia, but changes of direction overcome it so quickly in the fighter ships that you barely notice it. It feels like Quake, where you can sidestep on a dime. Here, you can sidestep on a quarter. ;)

I like Vendetta's flight mode. It's simple enough that it's not boring (ie: some-game-where-ex-players-make-fun-of-our-flight-style where you have to spend most of your time correcting your course...) yet complex enough that you can do some nice maneuvers.

Get in a Centurion, turn space debris on and THEN tell me there is no inertia. Granted, it's much less noticable in Vults and Valks but it is still there. Want to see the thruster limits? Strafe with a bot and see how many corrections you need to make to stay on-target.

The limits on inertia's implementation or lack of implementation were placed by the devs who, in their opinion, feel the limits enhance game-play.

The physics are not a question here, whatsoever!

Vendetta *IS*, among very many other things, a first-person-shooter. The other elements in the game, mainly the faction system, limit how much first-person-shooting a player can engage in before not being able to engage in it in 2/3rds of the universe. So, tell the FPS'ers that they will not go very far in this game if that is all they are looking for.

Ok, the current ship controls we have now is basically you can mouse look anywhere, where the some crosshair represents the direction of the ship turning.

So I turned 90 degrees when I moved my mouse 2 cm to the left, the problem is, the ship hasn't moved to the direction so in that case, the crosshair slowly moves to the center which tell me that the ship hasn't moved to the proper orientation yet.

Would it be possible in the future to make the mouse movement snapping to the ship turn rate instead of mouse look for those like me without a Joystick?

I'm sorry. I don't buy the FPS thing. Its a space combat sim. We don't call BF1942 a flight simulator just because it has planes, do we? No. Its an FPS with planes. You don't call Combat Flight Simulator or IL-2 Sturmovikp an FPS. You do use the first person and shoot things, but its about the flight and the combat. Same with Vendetta.

I think its now a balance of RPG and space combat sim, depending on the player. You can do combat or missions, or a mix.

I think calling it a FPS is like the hammer seeing everything as a nail. It's based on your perspective, and people must be playing too much Quake.

People are going to see it as a FPS, because that's the closest thing they can compare it to. And it plays a lot like free range of motion Quake, at least in physics mode.

You can argue the fine details of classifying the game all you want. In the end, all that will matter is how the anonymous mass of gamers out there classifies it in their collective conciousness. I believe they will see the combat and flight system and think FPS before they think Space Sim. That's just the way it feels when I play it.

Again, this isn't necessarily a bad thing... after all, it's just a label. If gamers like it, you could call it a chicken sex simulator and it would still sell.

Starfisher, I can't argue with that, but labels do have effects. If Jpe Gamer spends money on it after reading a reviewer call it a "Space FPS" thinking "Oh, Quake in space", he might be pretty upset that I'm not running around picking up health packs and scoring "First Blood".

If he buys it b/c it's billed as an MMOG/Space Combat Sim, he's less likely to feel ripped off and will tell his buddies about this awesome RPG game that plays like Wing Commander, or Freespace.

I'm going to agree with Wubby on this one. I mean, with a name like Wubby, how can you go wrong?

And not only that, like Mr. Wubby said, this game is what you make it. If all you do is shoot at stuff, then, well, yeah, it's a first person shooter. Not because that's how the devs made it, but because that's how you play it. If you don't want a FPS, then, i dunno, do something non-FPS-ish. Talk to some folks rather than shoot at them. I'd bet Paedric would he happy to see another potential RP'r out there.

Or haul some cargo somwhere. Contract a few pilots to fly along side you, call it a convoy, and be happy.

Or shoot stuff and moan about the lack of creativity the dev's display. hehe. I love irony. Not as much as the name Wubby, but it's still good.

:)

Unfortunately, the act of making virtual money against no competition does not bring me pleasure. Trading in this game is boring for me, because there's no challenge. Give me a day or two and I could have millions of credits - but to what end? Did I have to overcome anything to get there? Was there any skill or competition invovled? No. I just found a trade route, which is a simple process of elimination, and used it until it went dry. Repeat. Bam, I've got millions of credits with which I can buy... what?

PvP, on the other hand, requires direct competition. To do well, you have to overcome someone. You have to be skilled. You develop these skills not through some arbitrary point system, but by mastering the game mechanics through practice, and by learning how other pilots fight. It's almost a martial art in that way - pilots have distinct styles that you don't notice until you've fought them for a while. A beautiful thing, one that can leave you sweaty and focused. That's why I stay with this game. In the hopes that some day in the future I will again be able to fight someone much better than me in equal ships with equal equipment, in a pure contest of skill and luck and reflexes.

Yes, you can use the framework of the game to take it further and roleplay if you wish... I never had much of a taste for that sort of thing, unless it was roleplaying a combat pilot of some persuasion. I can't really do that anymore, unless I want to kill bots. Which I don't want to except as a means to getting me to real combat again.

Make no mistake - the majority of the gaming world takes this view. They want to fight. They want competition. They want to fly in fast ships and shoot powerful weapons and defeat other humans and rub it in their faces. They want to be able to do what their boring everyday lives make it impossible for them to do. I can get a job in real life. I can make money in real life. In fact I have to do both to stay in college. I can't fly an Itani Valkryie carrying two sunflare tubes and a tachyon against Evhun Cerundir and have a tense three minute sparring match. Guess which one I'll pay to do in my spare time? Guess which one the majority of gamerdom will pay to do in their spare time?

Of course, I could be wrong. EvE, which is basically a job simulator set in space, is doing quite well, I hear. Maybe I'm really in the minority and all people want to do in their games is boring drone work. I can dream, though.

Which all sort of suprisingly came out of me wanting to say this: The game's basic controls and feel is that of a FPS. Reviewers are going to have a hard time classifying this one. A "MMORPG that feels like a FPS but is a Space Sim". The game doesn't force you to RP.. but it does force you to play with FPS controls.